Hello, everybody, and welcome to a brand new series on heritage radio network called the culinary call sheet where we give a peek into the back kitchen of culinary media. I'm your host, April Jones,

and I'm your co host, Darren bresnitz. Part of why we started the show was to offer an unofficial mentorship for anyone who's interested in learning about all aspects of food and video, whether that's TV, social media online, or just something you want to do for fun.

Absolutely what was once niche or a little silly, as I'm sure you remember, Darren, when we started out, this man has now become such a massive playing field for so many creatives using food as the medium.

It's something that has driven us professionally and personally, for so many years. What excites me the most about this show is that we're going to sit down with some of the industry leaders to hear how they made it and what drew them into this industry.

With 20 years in the culinary production game ourselves. We're hoping we can give through these conversations an insider's view into personal stories from the field, as well as an in depth behind the scenes look into some of the most popular food programming. In today's evolving culinary media landscape.

We'll be covering everything from how to style your food, to how to license IP, to developing your own ideas, and some tips from the masters of how to host your own show.

Yeah, it's a little bit of conversation, how to and how do you do the things that you do in color media, which I'm so excited about? I love so many of the guests that are coming on this season. We have talent from Food Network from Vice media eater refinery 29,

we've met some of the best people in the world both in front of and behind the camera. And we're bringing them all together to share their stories, their delicious adventure and their unique journey into this crazy world.

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This is Dave Arnold, your host of cookies coming to you live on heritage Radio Network extremely late today. Because we had a we had our weekly China call which we can't do on Tuesdays anymore. Anastasia our weekly call to okay to be more precise to our team in China. We're not calling the entire country. Yeah, for every serene Bushwick enjoyed as usual, Anastasia the hammer Lopez, how're you doing? Good. Yeah, we got Matt in the booth. How you doing? I'm doing great. Yep, calling your questions, but make them brief because we only have like eight minutes or whatever today make quick 1718497212 Wait That 71849721 to eight. So after the radio program today, and it says hey, we need to do some Bob's Red Mill talking. Specifically, they want me to talk about amaranth flour and sorghum flour. But you know what I'm super sick of in general. I'm sure in this data. I'm sure you hate this as well as oh no anything like whatever. Gotta pay the bill. I don't know why we got to pay the bills, honestly. But we have to pay the bills. But no, but like when someone gives you a recipe for like a gluten free flour. What are they always freaking say? What's the thing they always say? It tastes just like regular? No, they never say that because it's untrue. What do they say? Don't matter? Do you pay attention to the world and Stasiuk clearly doesn't Oh no,

I'm on her level.

It's like she's not even in the food business. It's crazy. Although I have to say Anastasia Okay, so we're on this call

in the hospitality business. She cares about people.

Well, that's not what I heard this morning on the telephone. Because he said he's not people so Anastasia first of all Stasiuk calls into this call with China which by the way hard enough to hear because they're connecting on Skype and like I don't know whether the you know, Chinese mainland government isn't slick enough to not like when they're listening in on whatever our engineer is saying. Like his connection is the worst connection in the in the universe constantly. We can never hear what he's saying. Ever. Nastasia meanwhile, is on speakerphone in the middle of a New York City street because she's walking to pasta flyer, whatever

and I couldn't do the call. My house,

but because you didn't want them to hear they might stay asleep. Oh, Jesus. So then she shows up and she starts yelling at her employee. Like, like worse than I yell at my kids when it's like the same f up. They've done everything. She's like, Well,

the thing is that he's mopping in the dark. mopping the restaurant front of house in the dark, because if I feel no, then I'm like, Hey, person's name person's name. He has his headphones on so loud, he cannot hear me. So that just raises my anger level.

Yeah, yeah, of course before as he knows he's there alone. So why wouldn't he

mopping in the dark? The dark, you know, I walked in and I was like, hey, and then I sat down to do the call. And then I was like, it's dark.

Yeah, but the tone of voice the Stasi used like, honestly, if I was that, dude, I would have been like, this lady wants me to quit. I'm going to quit right now. Like me Doctor ups. Oh my god, Anastasia. Anastasia, should have been arrested for what she said the UPS Yeah, like honestly, yeah, you're not allowed to physically threaten people although good news. Amazon is going to have three headquarters not just to their so like they're gonna have their Seattle headquarters or wherever the hell they are. And then remember, they're going to have their country wide search for where they're going to put their second headquarters. Well, they decided to do to win outside of Virginia and won this dasya in Long Island City. So now you can physically go over there and choke out somebody at Amazon. Google, here's like a good health tip. Like do not do business with Anastasia and then move within choking rage. She will find you I honestly I can't believe that you weren't that you weren't like it. No police showed up at your door. I know that she made to the

first time I felt bad about things I said.

I believe you have a caller.

Oh caller you're on the air.

Hey, Dave is Judy from Melbourne again. How are you doing? I'm good. So, um, I picked up the cookie around the world series that you? Oh, yeah. And I don't know

the time life one the one from early 70s. Yeah, great. Great, right. Yeah,

I've read two volumes. But right now I'm making the SEMA beverage. Like some weapons like word made from Scandinavia. Okay. Yeah, you never made it right. No, no, basically, it's just Slevin sugar, an active dry yeast.

Okay, but so sure. So it's not a meat. It's like it's got

Yeah, I know is like, Why was I seen need, but next time might use honey.

Yeah, we should get that need guy back on from enlightenment wines. I mean, the thing is, is that obviously, if it's Scandinavian back in the you ever read Beowulf, there's meat all up and down and vailable if it's all everywhere, the meat bench,

like I've read or anything, yeah. So you will have no idea how much ABV it will turn out to be,

oh, that's an easy calculation to do. If you're using white sugar, I don't happen to know it off the top of my head. Yeah, you can just look up, you know, bricks to potential alcohol. And then you can just convert the sugar to potential alcohol because this is the thing that brewers worry about constantly. So for anyone that is doping in sugar, I just again, I just don't happen to have it off the top of my head. I know that, that when I ferment orange juice, I ferment pretty much. I have to add sugar to it. And it starts out at around 11 bricks. So 11% sugar by weight, and I have to add sugar to it. So it's not one to one. So if you want, let's say 8% alcohol, you're going to need more than 8% Sugar, I think. But again, it's been a long time since I run the calculations, but they that's an easily knowable thing on any one of the Brewers, sites bricks to potential alcohol scales, what they call it because they don't know if you're going to ferment dry or not. So obviously, any residual sugar that you leave is is potential alcohol that you didn't convert.

Okay, yeah. So what I'm doing right now is lemon. I was thinking about other varieties once I get started, and I'll probably use citrus ideally pretty

orange is good. I mean, the good thing about Orange is the residual acidity that's in orange juice is nice and the residual it's clear I use clarified Of course I've never tried unclarified and the residual bitterness that's in clarified orange juice is nice once it's fermented dry, it doesn't tend to last so you can't you know, the flavor of it. I didn't like as much when it been aged for you know, three, four months, as when it was you know, fresher on the order of like a couple of weeks old after the Initial primary is done. I mean, the one problem if you haven't done a lot of fermenting before is you'll probably have a tendency to make it too acidic on the beginning. And then once it ferments dead dry, it's going to be extraordinarily tart because the sugar will be gone. Unless you don't fermented dead dry, you could do a partial fermentation in which case residual acidity is more your friend. If that makes sense,

by fermenting it dead dry, like I know, this is the first time I'm making any sort of alcoholic beverage, what do you mean?

Well, so like the sugar that's in there, right it as you convert it to alcohol, then there won't be any more that sugar will be gone away. So, you know, like when I do deciders and other things, I tend to try to ferment almost all of the sugar away other people, for instance, there's techniques and cider making called caving, and there's all sorts of techniques to try to stop the fermentation, you know, at some point in mid cycle, so that, okay, that's residual sugar, but you know, and sometimes things will just get stuck. So there'll be a lot of residual sugar, like at the fermentation will just end for you know, a number of reasons the yeast is inhibited by something, or, in fact, honey, a lot of like a lot of mead, you know, first time Mead makers will have problems with their distillation, it's called getting stuck. And so you'll end up with a higher you know, proportion of sugar and less therefore, alcohol, but if you are going to ferment something until it is completely dry, so it's all the sugar is gone, then just have to take into account the fact that, you know, the acidity will taste, you know, double, you know, much more present than then you might expect

Okay, yeah. Okay, another quick question. What's your best recommendation as to an inexpensive meat grinder?

Ooh, I don't have a I don't have a good one. I have the KitchenAid one, and I don't really like it. I hate it. Right. Some people buy that? Yeah. Hello, was it? Yes. No. Good ever doing that again? Yeah. Some people use that. I believe it it's check. I think that like one that was built the old one that the hand grinder that's, you know, like a casting. But you know, I don't have any good luck with it. I should research inexpensive. Grinders. I don't have a lot. I mean, I just deal with garbage. I mean, like I was I don't have that was the stuff that I do when I grind it. I just don't like it. I just think it's low quality.

The only thing you're using as the KitchenAid attachment.

Yeah, it's garbage. It's just wretched. Okay, so you have to cut up you know, like the thing with the KitchenAid attachment is it smears so easily. So you have to like cut things into into long strips. I mean, everyone that owns a real grinder loves it. People like so I've used for instance, the inexpensive sausage stuffers from places like grizzly Yeah, which is not, you know, a catalog and it works fine. It's not as well put together as the more professional ones like the welds are really crappy, and the grinds on the welds are really crappy. So presumably, it's more difficult to sanitize. They also have relatively inexpensive grinders. That may be good I just don't have any personal experience with what's the Randy well, like a catalog that sells that stuff is kind of is grizzly, the the GRI ZZ ly, like they're mainly a Tool Company, but they also cater to hunters, right? And, and so hunters have to process a lot of sausage, so they have sausage, or don't have to, but they do. So they have things like sausage stuffers, and meat grinders, and they tend to be cheaper than Bass Pro, which also sells these things, or Cabela's, which also sells these things. So you know, like once it's being sold into a professional kitchen, the prices go way up, but when it's sold to a hobbyist or a hunter or something like this, who still has the need for professional grinding abilities, the price can come way down now the quality probably also comes down but if you're not using it every day in service, then it's probably not you know, not that big of a deal but you know I doubt you're gonna have anything that's going to you know, rival like the you know, the butt kicking Hobarts that you know, we had back at the school, you know what I mean?

Yeah, yeah. All right. Well, thanks a lot.

I will if Yeah, if you're having a good experience tweeted over to me let me know. Let me know what you get. Yeah.

Like I mean, amazing. mortadella even though it should have turned out like seven years ago. Yeah,

yeah. All right. Yeah, if you're doing a small amounts, you can get away with almost anything you know. Anyway, good luck with it.

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Dave, we got another question from the internet or what isn't? It says hello Anastasia and Dave is from Sam in Chicago. Love the show looking for an alternative to the SU V turkey this year. You mentioned a method where you spatchcock the bird laid over a pile of stuffing and blast it in a hot oven. I've listened to every episode and I can't remember if it was a new one or an old one. I can't find this spec, would you mind going over this again?

Sure. So you can do depending on how much you take out, you're going to speed up the cooking, more or less. But if you're willing, see, the thing about it is is you can make something that looks relatively bird shaped. The thing that I don't like about a lot of like the classic kind of rulide things is they don't end up looking like birds, which is okay if you're a French person, but not okay, if you're doing an American kind of a Thanksgiving. So what you can do is just cut along the backbone and you can cut along the backbone kind of on either side and rip it out. And then you can even rip out some of the you can rip out you know the the internal carcass of the of the bird there, it's a lot easier than doing for instance, when I use was doing the turkey where I'd have to put the exoskeleton in I would have to do what's called Inside Out boning where you roll the bird apart and remove the skillet without making a cut in the meat at all. And that takes a long time on a turkey a lot longer than it does on a smaller bird like a quail. Especially if you have Anastasia Lopez sitting next to you pestering you about how long it's taken. Remember how me and you were just asking she's like it's taking you a long time Dave taken you a long time on a freakin frozen freakin Turkey trying to Inside Out bonus so it looks good on TV. And the Stasi is doing nothing but sitting there. The Stasi is very good at sitting there and pushing your buttons while you have a sharp knife in your hand. She's the worst, worst. Anyways, so this is much easier use cut out the backbone. And then like kind of pry it open, snap the joints at the at the Lay, you know at the legs and at the wings rip out those bones you can take out you know, you can leave the rest of the bones in really but then so you have those bones now you can roast them off and make a gravy with them, which is what I would do. So then you make a stuffing shaped kind of mound, I mean sorry, a bird cavity shaped mound on, you know, on a tray or whatever. And then you roast that or cook it or what I typically do is I'll make like a bag and I'll make a plug like cvwd Almost of that and I'll cook the stuffing as its own kind of thing like a football. And then I'll have it hot really hot, like you know hot, like you know, steaming temperature. And then you'll have your bird and because you've taken all the bones out it's going to most of the bones out it's going to cook relatively quickly. Also, the stuffing is already at cooking temperature. So you don't need to get it hot, it's already hot and it's already been made safe. Then you can drape the bird over the stuffing in the shape of a bird. By the way, you can also have brined it already injected brine into the breast and whatnot and you can drape it and dried it if you want. You should dry the skin, drape it over the stuffing and it clips relatively quickly. Not as quickly as like the actual flat pressed spatchcock against a sheet tray, which is the absolute fastest way to cook it but it's again it's gonna look like a flat Turkey and not like a turkey turkey for Thanksgiving so it makes any sense. Who the internet's the internet's. Alright. Let's get to the questions that were written in. This is from gas Herbert. I am writing after having done some research on peppercorn infusions, which seems to be little material online, especially in the gastronomica applications I'm interested in. It occurred to me that you may know about this stuff after reading through liquid intelligence. I mean, I have a pepper infusion in the in the book Anastasia. Not that Anastasia. I remember it you were Never be making it you've never opened the book once. I mean, I don't know did you ever read my paper itself is not useful as toilet paper or as clean so you think you you know you look to see whether I thanked you or not. And that was it that she's opened the first three pages miracle I love your use of interesting spices and relate to your perfectionism here at the Korea West African fine dining restaurant in London. My question is when it comes to infusing peppercorns and spices and non alcoholic solutions such as milk or water, what is the ideal temperature and time for infusion and what scientifically speaking are the consequences of going above or below this temperature slash time? Take as an example peppercorns, clothes and star anise which by the way our friend Leanne Wong has said was her porn star name which is amazing, right? Start is

no she said it would be Star anus. Well,

he's just mispronouncing it. And it's well, aren't you? We had another woman at the French culinary who used to mispronounce something in a horrifying way. I can't say it online. But like literally whenever she opened her mouth and said these words and stuff sent her like

she would travel to a certain country

Yeah, but mispronouncing the most horrible way and like in like it was like it was like you know when you see the shockwaves you see the skin like in slow mo and like the cheeks are like getting flashover like they do those explosions. slowmode it was like that and stuff. And it's like, ah, anyway. Yeah, yeah, sturdiness. Where are we where we are infusing into milk with 90 degrees centigrade for two hours be too high, too long. All the best. So look, a lot depends on we tell you what the variables are, first of all, milk whole milk, by the way, or as my grandpa like to like to say milk because he did not admit that skim milk was in fact milk. And he lived to be 98. So there you have it. Although that's such a dumb, I hate people who make arguments for like an n of one. So they're self hate, right? Anyway, whatever. So the point being that milk is a good choice because it has some fat and a lot of these spices, especially specifically black pepper, the the actual nice flavors in it like piperine, and all the other, all the other good kind of aromatic, volatile stuff, not extremely soluble in water, which is why and also it's volatile stuff. So Geoffrey Stein garden, you know, our friend Jeffrey stone garden, who by the way, all the younger people out there, if you haven't read the man who ate everything, you should go ahead and read that seminal seminal book and its subject and, you know, very early person of that kind of kind. And, you know, kind of a curmudgeon, and you no more than kind of a curmudgeon. Yeah. The end of the worst, Best and Worst love and love, love myself some Jeffree Star guard anyways. Point being he was like Dave, why do you add pepper early on? In he used to call me you would literally he would just call Nastasia and me and just yell at us for our practices, even though he had like, we would not have seen him in like a year. And he would just call us and start yelling at us, right? And

we'd see the number come up on our phone and be like, it's your turn. Yeah, because

we knew there was gonna be like eight hours of him yelling at us about X, Y or Z. He's like, Dave, why do you add pepper early on him cooking? All that's left at the end is the bitterness and none of the great aromatics. Why don't you add it at the end? And I was like, Jeffrey, I like those bitter notes. Why can't I add it two times? He had no response. Right? So the problem with pepper is one a lot of especially things like soups is a lot of those, like awesome. aromatic compounds are one volatile. And two, not super soluble in water. They should be more soluble in the fat in the butterfat that's in Mill, I think. Right? So then there's there's two things that are going on, there's loss of volatiles, because it's just like literally evaporating, right? There's a loss of olives, because it's also just not infusing into whatever liquid you're using. And then there's the actual destruction of the of those flavors and aromas due to the heat. So you know, you have to separate some of these things. So in a sealed system, where there's no air, right, it might be possible to have a higher temperature and because you're not volatilizing, anything because it's sealed, maybe it's possible to keep those things in solution if they actually want to dissolve into it right. So you might run into a situation there where it's good. So 90 degrees C in milk in on a stovetop, you probably will have evaporated a lot of those bottles and they won't be there. Right? So I read a study that even just your grinding temperature that you use right with you, if you you know, refrigerate you grind refrigerated or frozen pepper with dry ice black pepper, versus grinding it at a higher temperature because of the friction of grinding, like let's say 40 5050 degrees Celsius results in a huge loss in the volatile components presumably to the atmosphere because you can smell them right? Not presumably Due to autolysis, where the stuff is breaking itself apart, so I think in other words, it might be possible in a sealed container to get a decent, higher temperature extraction of pepper, but I don't know for sure you'd have to run some tests. The other thing you could do is try to do infusions under high pressure at lower temperatures, even in the milk in something like an EC, under you know, high pressure like, you know, 10 bar or so 1011 Bar something there, right. And then you could do a side by side with it with heat. That's the whole thing. It's like doing the side by sides and kind of seeing what what you get tonight. Yeah, we

don't Yeah, we do. We,

we still have nine minutes.

They have a show at one and you have to record a cast. Not even here yet. Right there,

right here. And you do need to record those ads. Right. One

thing I'll say before we go on, Nick wrote in and asked for the speck on the vaca Cristino. It is I believe five to one cranberry, fresh cranberry two. Vodka might be four to one, but I believe it's five to one, and then just blend it with the SPL. Spin it out. The buttered popcorn rum is literally just, you know, pour like air, pop some popcorn, pour the rum over it. You know, I think it's, you know, it's uh, you know, it's a lot. We just do it. Let it sit there for like, two three hours straight it off, press the hell out of it. Melt butter, keep the butter stirred and it doesn't take that much butter. Frankly, I don't have the numbers off top my head. Stir it let it stay liquid with like a what's it called? immersion circulator? For overnight covered so you're not losing anything and then freeze it straight off. And then someone was going to try to make activated charcoal with rye bread. But I don't think it's going to work and I will talk more about it next week Kevin, but activated charcoal is very difficult to make. And I would look at the books there are online. On activated charcoal. How different and complicated is from just plain charcoal. And once you turn into charcoal, it won't taste like rye bread anymore unless it's just something you really want to do now on to Bob's Red Mill because what we started to talk about the beginning of the show that we never finished. And can we just believe this into the ads Matt or No? Anyway, what I was going to try to get Anastasia to say that I hate is when people are like, Yo like just add it to pancakes or muffins. Anytime someone has a gluten free flour. They're like Trump's make way we you pancakes, muffins cookies, you know what I'm saying? It's irritating, because like obviously, you know, I do that all the time. I add oats to my pancakes, but it's not interesting. So I've been trying to work with these products to try to see if I could make something that is interesting. But anyway, I have not 100% successful yet but I have run a lot of tests I was working on a scrapple a sorghum based scrapple serving bass biscuits and Joe are roti stuff. Anyway, so we'll talk about it later more next week. I got to record some ads make some money Bob's Red Mill cooking issues

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