Hello, everybody, and welcome to a brand new series on heritage radio network called the culinary call sheet where we give a peek into the back kitchen of culinary media. I'm your host, April Jones,

and I'm your co host, Darren bresnitz. Part of why we started the show was to offer an unofficial mentorship for anyone who's interested in learning about all aspects of food and video, whether that's TV, social media online, or just something you want to do for fun.

Absolutely what was once niche or a little silly, as I'm sure you remember, Darren, when we started out, this man has now become such a massive playing field for so many creatives using food as the medium.

It's something that has driven us professionally and personally, for so many years. What excites me the most about this show is that we're going to sit down with some of the industry leaders to hear how they made it and what drew them into this industry.

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We'll be covering everything from how to style your food, to how to license IP, to developing your own ideas, and some tips from the masters of how to host your own show.

Yeah, it's a little bit of conversation, how to and how do you do the things that you do in color media, which I'm so excited about? I love so many of the guests that are coming on this season. We have talent from Food Network from Vice media eater refinery 29,

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Hello and welcome to cooking issues. This is Dave Arnold, your host cookie cutter is coming to you live on her journey network every Tuesday from roughly 12 to roughly 1245 Roberta's pizzeria in Bushwick. We're having some technical issues we actually didn't know if we're gonna have the show today because so far. I'm not gonna say who it was Dave, but somebody spilled like an entire like coffee plus coke plus slushy Freezy into the mixing board. We're having some mixing board issues. What a waste. That sounds delicious. Yeah, I know. Right? In fact, like we in the studio here can't hear Dave in the booth. So it's like a weird a few liquid or headphones. Yeah, hear nothing. Why are you wearing okay? I think Dave Are we okay? Thank you. All right. So we're okay, so you can hear us but we can't hear you. That's fine. Happy Halloween, everybody. We have as usual Anastasia the hammer Lopez. How you doing? Assessing good. Yeah, good. Anything interesting happened over the past week. What a freakin liar. You're the worst liar in the world. What interesting happened to you last week? Oh a moron. She likes starting a new business. I'm like, like leaving right into

a restaurant with Mark and Mark Ladner and you came to friends and family? Yeah. Oh, and your son broke the elevator.

Listen, listen, listen, people like this is this is what it's like dealing with the Stasi. So like anytime you hear her say nothing happened? Nothing. Oh, yeah. Friends and family on that new restaurant. I'm opening. What? Yeah, yeah. So how's it other than the fact that Booker came and broke the elevator

you know what it was a copper wire had

it's not poker, that's your that's your old busted the 120 whatever, but that's not Booker's fault. That's the incompetent weasel you hired to come fix the elevator. Right? I mean, it's like first of all, first of all we have I wanted to be able to chime in so we have Paul Paul Adams friend of the show. How're you doing?

I'm good. Although apparently I am not anastasius friend nor family.

Oh, wow. Whenever you want so Paul, formerly known as poate, that was how I used to know him via email po te what did that stand for Paul?

Poate is a domain name that I bought back when you could buy a four letter domain name. And after I bought it, I made it stand for Paul's online text editor. Before Google Docs existed. I wrote my own online text editor in 1999. And I'm here on the show to promote my

online text editor,

text editor. Paul, can you go to that other microphone? I don't see another way across the way. Sorry. We're just having some we're having a day today.

Yeah, it's like, you know, the Gremlins have invaded. So I don't know if you can hear over the crackling. My microphones moving as Paul's passing by? I don't know if you can hear the crackling, but we have some serious Gremlins in the in the board today. Okay, so we have pote. Do your manuals online text editor, which you started in 1999? And how should we put this failed to monetize? Let's just put it that way failed to monetize?

Okay, where are we? It's a free online text editor much as well. So I'm used to using it to harvest the email addresses of African medical students who are the primary users. Is that Is this real? Yes. It's a hugely popular in at least one East African medical school.

Which can you call it by name or that but that'd be like were like, what?

I haven't looked at the site since probably 2010. So I don't remember the name. But how many users do you have? In the three digits? I

would say? So like there's a medical school in East Africa. That's like, I don't know what this post is. But that's what we use. Because I have given my stuff to big Google. That's what's happening. Exactly. Hey, is your stuff available in China? Are you an alternative to Google docs in China? Yes. Oh, hey, people, if we have any. Yeah, if we have anyone that wants a an online, shareable free text editor, documents source and you're in China, and can access Google Docs and don't have access to a VPN? I'm sure they have their own solution. Now, some sort of something. But you're welcome to use Paul's. Was it Paul with

Paul's online text editor, which I believe is no longer currently functional? If you're in China, Please hold while I did you get around?

Did you just leave an entire medical school high and dry? How many people have died as a result of you not keeping your online text editor current fall? I don't know. I

think you can't sign up as a new user. And if you're an existing medical student, you're fine.

All right. All right. All right. Okay. So of course, if you're in medical school now, and you were in there in 2010, which is the last time you looked at it, you are an extremely poor medical student. And probably Paul, you don't want to count them as your users.

Well, no, you're a doctor.

All right. So Paul, for those of you that don't know, is that what's your title of their senior editor? My title is Senior Research editor Senior Research illustrated Cook's Illustrated slash America's Test Kitchen and his his outfit which Anastasia will Instagram out maybe later is America's Test kitten. And he's got cat ears on which is I like it the unusual man dressed as Cat. six week Paul, a longtime love affair with cats.

Yes, I bought these cat your cat ears. Halloween, probably 15 years ago and it's every year every year I come up with a new way to get my money's worth.

Yeah for more dollar categories. For me it's a loot sugar masks I love Lutra door masks on the Halloween and my favorite favorite favorite Lutra door look is Lutra door in a suit and tie like a like Lucci door mask, suit and tie I think is just like the look. In fact, I'm considering just having that be my look in general. Mainly no one wants to know wants to look at my face. So you put a mask on a suit and tie all of a sudden fitting maybe lucido without the suit and tie I mean, people don't want to hang around someone with a cape all the time, or they definitely don't want to hang around me with my shirt off. Definitely not if I'm all greased up like lucido horrible in like in those little spandex shorty things, but lucido masks, so you get rid of the face, that's plus one, and then suit and tie. Right? Yeah, brilliant. Good news, right? I just gotta I gotta go find a resource for some of those super wide 70s ties.

I have one at least one

Oh, yeah, I'm not gonna blow up my spot where like the like every once in a while someone exactly my size goes to die and gives all their clothes to this place. And I snapped them up. And you know, right now is the sweet spot for people from the 70s dying, you know, people who had these suits in the 70s are starting to kick off you know what I mean? Like people who are in their, you know, 40s like people who are my age in the 70s are like dropping, you know what I mean? And like leaving their suits to this, this,

their kids and their kids are like kids

like, I don't want that. I don't want this. You know what I mean? They give it to this thrift store. You know, my so you saw the picture I had up ago my stepfather's father who died fairly recently. He was a butcher to have all those sweet knives. I have his scale I just hung his lamp which no one else wanted in in my places giant awesome seven days land nice. I wish I had a high enough ceiling because originally where it was it was in a high space and it was a hanging crazy crystal lamp over a table lamp. And it looked like you know, it looked like something out of the Deathstar. Like Obi Wan might be going around like disabling the tractor beam on it. It was sweet, but I just don't have the space for it.

Well, it's in your New York home. I

got my New York home like like it like if you hung it in my New York place, it would be hitting the floor. Like what am I going to? Do? You know what I mean? We don't have high ceilings up here in New York. Anyway. Calling your questions your Halloween or otherwise, really? Questions? 27184972128. That's 718-497-2128. We got one. Got one. All right. Caller you're on the air.

Oh, hi, necesito. Hi, Dave. David, sorry about the tech issues. Glad to report. I'm calling from Europe again and calling via Google which is free. I don't know if maybe that's right.

Yep. Good. What do you got? What do you got for us?

Yeah, so I'm part of a rugby club, a student rugby club in the Netherlands. And we have like Tuesday, boat nights, it's actually based on a houseboat, believe it or not. Anyway, we meet for the whole club. And typically, we'll try and cook for like 5060 people and aim at the Euro 25 Euro 50 per person, which in dollars, it's about, let's say $1 and a half to $1.70. Right, per meal. The big issue is that food quality is often pretty poor. Well sometimes get students who've never, you know, they've hardly cooked for themselves that much, let alone cook for a lot of people. So often the food quality is super poor. And unfortunately, sometimes we waste a lot of food because they cook too much. Anyway, as an older member, I'm trying to improve things, but I was hoping that someone on the panel had experienced cooking for large numbers of people on a shoestring. We also have, you know, quite limited equipment. So I was wondering if you got any thoughts on that?

What's your equipment? First of all? At first, I thought you said Oh, instead of boat. I was like, Oh, I've been gearing up for question. And do you cook off board or on board?

We cook on board. It's 30 meter long steel whole house boat.

Nice. Alright, so what equipment do you have on board?

So we've got like, we go to a large pot like kind of cauldron style. It's really huge, but it means that people can't get the water to the boil and they're trying to do pasture and stuff. We got some pretty high BTUs portable gas burners with obviously the gas canisters are kind of let's say large mobile cooking stations. Couple kettles, a pie pan, some smaller pots and pans. And then you know the tiny oven and microwave are hardly worth talking about.

The pie pan is so fired or it goes on your burners. It goes on burners and the kettle is separately fired.

Kettle Are you know they're electric just common household things are probably donated by members in the pasture, like small house.

So how many? How many liters is this kettle? Sorry, how many liters is this kettle?

Like literally 1.2 Maybe maybe one and a half liters. Oh,

so Okay. All right now. So, in reality you have six six gas burners, and you're feeding how many people?

We got to to get gas burners to large gas burners, and we're feeling like 50 to 60 people.

How, how large how large are these? When you say large gas burners? Like what are you what are you talking about? How large is large? Like candy stove large like rip roaring like, like,

an inches wide?

How many inches an inch diameter? Tennis? Yeah, but I'm trying to figure out like, do they rip? Or I mean, can you just tear off on these things? Others? Could you just purchase or steal a large large kettle and then like

oops, sorry, sorry, the quality's a little sketchy. Go ahead. Sorry

my life quality a little sketchy. Like like are these burners strong enough to cook let's say soup for 30

Yeah, you know you can get it to a simmer but but if you need to get it to a boil it's a losing battle and you're gonna get there

and and you're not underway when you're cooking, right? So you don't have to worry about sloshing

No, no, no, it's totally stable.

And no fire regulations or anything like that. Because you can always supplement with very cheap candy burners. You can get candy stove burners or wok burners, and you can supplement like from power wise off of gas. Those things tear like a mother. If you need more hot side, Anastasia, I'm sure she hasn't said anything. But I'm sure Anastasia is wondering whether that budget includes liquor.

Because she's like, Oh, look into those. You have never heard of those.

Yeah. So I don't know what they call them in Europe. You know what I'm talking about, right, Paul, like the candy stoves like this, they're no, they're low down. The advantage of these burners is because they're low to the floor. If you're doing a big kettle full of stuff, it's a hassle to move around a big kettle when it's high up. So these, we used to call them candy stoves or candy burners, we would also use them for stocks and for everything like that is there down low, and it's a lot safer to move those things around when they're down low. Now, one or two leaders for for like, you're the other cattle thing. I mean, like, you know, what are you gonna do with one or two leaders for 30 people, you know what I mean? I mean, I'm sure if if you get one of those candy burner style things, now all of a sudden, pasta becomes a reality because you can get a big bowl on it. A big sorry kettle on it, you can rip that thing up, get it boiling, you know, salt the hell out of it. And then you could just go in batches stream out and go ba ba ba ba ba, ba, ba, ba, ba, ba, ba, ba, ba ba ba out and you can get it because ain't nothing cheaper than doing pasta. It's just you need to be able to do it in, you know, in quantity such that you can get it out and hot and good and not turn it either into mush, or have it be rocks on the inside. Yeah.

Exactly the thing that we struggle with. Yeah, yeah. But you

know, the Stasi enjoys cooking, right? Anastasia, as the owner of a pasta restaurant. Do you have any recommendations other than just going to your new pasta restaurant?

Yeah, he can freeze it.

He can't freeze it only you can freeze it because you have the special IQ F like pasta freezing status. He's like, you could invest in a $300,000 Freezing machine for your pasta. Also, obviously, you know, soups are much appreciated as the cold weather kind of, you know, rolls in, like a hardier stick to your soda, like a rubber lead that kind of situation. Well, yeah, for a long time. But we believe Yeah, but well, also, but yeah, you know, like, but he says he has a giant pipe. And the question is, are his burners good enough to everyone loves pie? Yeah, it's just a question of what you're gonna throw in it for cheap, right? So you're gonna have to short out

grilling like meats and things. And using the pie pan is actually pretty good because it's nice and thin. And it's like, well, not too thin. It distributes the heat pretty good. And then we can cope with that guy pretty well. But what we really struggle with is like making nice like pasta, it just kind of turns into a big block of mush. And that's a real shame.

What about the obraz?

Oh, yeah, beer brats, right. You put one of your things on there and your beer brats. You know, beer brats are delicious. You have the power on this boat. Electrical power. We love that stuff. Yeah, yep. Power on this boat. Like electrical power. Yeah, we got power. Yeah. So you could also move you could also move into low temperature. Right. So if you have some screaming burners, you could do for instance, I was hoping, yeah, you could do something and

say that. Yeah, we're Yeah, we're an engineering student club. So we can I can probably get a team of engineers to try and work on like a large sort of merchant circulator, something like that.

Yeah. So the only things you have to worry about obviously, is, you know, I don't know what liability insurance is like over there. Alright, cool. Yeah, you want to make sure you don't get any. You want to make sure you don't get any stray voltage in your, in your water. So like, you know, you know, you could use a GFI, or whatever the equivalent is over there, GFI. But, you know, a lot of the cheaper heating units that you know, for instance, people used to make over here, immersion circulators, out of the immersion coffee heaters. And the assumption from the manufacturers of those immersion coffee heaters was that you weren't going to shove your fist into the cup of coffee while you were heating it. And so they have stray voltage all over the place, when you put it's very disconcerting to put your hand into a liquid and get electrical tingle out of it. very disconcerting. So you just want to make sure that you don't have like a lot of stray. Like I say, stray stray voltage, but hell yeah, turn a bathtub into a into a circulator is not a problem if you have the power. The other thing by the way, if you have a lot of gas, one thing you can do for low temperature is let's say you said for instance that water limps along right in the in a big pot on your stove. So if you have water limping along, you put in a gas input where whereby you know, the gas inputs never going to take you over the top of the temperature you need and then you electrically heat the rest and so I used to do that for like very large things. You would put your, your pot Yeah, on the burner, heat up the water and then take it that last couple of degrees and just use the circulator as a as the as the finisher, in the same way that like that guy, Koenigs Koenigsegg has his car with electrical and, and gas, but not because he cares about energy and how Ever just to get the fastest possible acceleration, you seen that carpool? No, Koenigs a this guy, Swedish guy think he has this car, that it's so fast that he electronically limits the speed to 250 miles an hour. And his 60s is zero to 60 is limited by traction of tires and his 60 to 120 is limited by traction of tires. Wow. Yeah, yeah. And you can have his car for the paltry price of $1.9 million. If you had bought it back when he's first offered them because they're all sold, but he hasn't built them yet. Yeah, yeah, definitely. And my son DAX isn't

that correct, you kind of get like a sort of temperature baseline with the gas, and then whatever you need and the accuracy to do that electrically. And you can control that.

Yeah, if you have unlimited amounts of electrical power, and you just do it all electrically, right. But you know, a lot of times you're a limit to the amount of electrical power that you have. And if you do have a limited amount electrical power, then you can use supplementary stuff like gas, as long as you know, it's not going to go over and if your heat input from the gas is constant, right, so you don't porpoise it around and have it go up and down. Then a PID control loop can just account for it and use the electrical to take it take it up to the last little bit.

Alright, nice. I think I'll fix this to the rest of the guys were obviously you know, students on a shoestring but I think I can kind of make a case that we will need to upgrade the equipment. I was kind of hoping you say that. I mean, it's it's kind of obvious. And then I liked the idea of the the beard rots, obviously like chili and stuff is good for the winter as well. And, and like just quickly and then I'll stop taking time. What other recipes do you think are go to that are simple enough for people to follow? So you know, recipes that can have a pretty simple method. Good quality, robust, not too sensitive. Does anything really come to mind for the rest of you guys?

And me, like obviously, like things that are like bonehead easy are things that people make in huge quantities for families, so stews, soups, I mean, they're not they're not so excited. If here's what I say if you go, if you're gonna go the low temperature route, I would start with zip ease, right zip locks, as opposed because you probably don't have the money for a vacuum machine right now, although building a DIY vacuum machine is cool, right? I would just mean that your problem is, is that you're looking at an inherent hard limit on the input cost, right. And so like most of the time, when you have a hard limit on input cost, you want to have the majority of your calories come from cheap stuff, like grains and pulses. And then then you supplement it with the high grade stuff like meats This is why things like Paya seafood wasn't so expensive, right? If it's more of a sausage base with like a little bit I'm sure mussels are cheap where you are. So if it's like primarily things like mussels and and you know and sausages, then you know you can your pie is not nearly so expensive, and you can splurge a little bit on the rice and get the good stuff because even expensive rice isn't that expensive. You know what I'm saying? Same goes for soups are like you know, we believe that as being dishes things like this is why this stuff is peasant food because it's made, you're stretching out the expensive ingredient by using cheap ingredients. As soon as you're going into full protein cookery then you have to find a protein that you like to eat. That is not that expensive, right?

I just went to a Dutch restaurant in Canada where I had stumped pot, which is as far as I can tell. And Bacon Yeah, I did not

I did not know I got further than than the Netherlands. It's just kind of great to hear some folks in Canada.

restaurant called Gordon,

here's, here's a good one for you. And let's say you get a candy burner right. And you don't have a big ol big old oven. Here's what you're going to hear here is a good recipe for you. You got to make a you can make doesn't actually have to be low temperature because you don't actually want it that low temperature you can do it in sippy is a relatively high temperature, but like fine HOXA is pretty cheap. I think even in the Netherlands fine. HOXA is super cheap. So what you do is you get your circulator and you heat you know, you heat this the stuff up, you cook you cook your your fine HOXA through until they're done. Pull them out when they are hot, I can't stress this enough, pull them out when they're hot and let the skin flash off so that you get rid of the moisture on the skin. Then if you get a candy burner, fire that sucker up with your oil and fry off the shine HOXA until they're crispy on the outside and serve with some sort of a braising sauce. I love fine hog. So you mean it's not traditional that way, but you can make it that way. Yeah, I mean, everyone likes crispy pork, hawks, or every one of this. It's not the hawk, it's whatever it's like, it's like lamb shanks for pork. Yeah, yeah. So whatever you call that

we thanks. All right, I'll report back if there's success, any quick notes on food safety for cooking for that many people like we don't have any training and we're probably going to kill each other by the end of this but

don't aim for very, very low temperatures on your stuff. And if a bag blows up, just toss it. You know what I mean? Like if a bag inflates, just toss it. Start out with, you know, relatively short term or relatively high temperature stuff. And if you're going to do cook, chill, you know, get a bath, you know, not a bath to get large enough vessel to chill your stuff down. And, you know, are you ice challenged? Or no, like all of Europe is ice challenge, right? So, you know, you got to chill this stuff down at a reasonable reasonable rate in the US, you know, you know, we have more ice than we know what to do with in general not in houses but by

really the case here. Yeah, maybe when it gets cold outside we can steal the ice from the canals.

Yeah, I wouldn't really an option. I wouldn't drag it behind the other canals clean there. You can't drink out of those things. Aren't they? cesspools? No. Yeah,

they're terrible stuff if you ever go to Holland never jumped in the canal

now. Like it's like all like didn't like our equivalent of the GLONASS over here. Now,

I guess so like, it was literally the first thing that the mayor said to us is like, but seriously, kids don't jump in the canals. And I was like,

Hey, man, let us know what happens. Good luck. Yeah,

thanks a lot. Okay. Bye.

Wait, so we were talking Paul, we were talking about what America's Test Kitchen program. Now we had gone on from the old program I thought hadn't we? We were talking about your whatever. Let's get to some questions.

I liked the idea of this stray voltage cocktail, though. Stray voltage cocktail.

It's kind of like set one buttons. Yeah, sure. Caller you're on the air.

Alright, Happy Halloween.

Happy Halloween.

So I was lucky enough to grab some of the elusive Ashmead to Colonel apple you love so much.

I do love it. I do love it. Oh, I'm gonna amaze Tell me, please tell me that you stored it in the refrigerator before you processed it, please? Absolutely.

And so I'm going to make some Kentucky kernels from liquid intelligence. But what else should I make? And will the juice freeze? Well, and if it will, or should I clarify it first juice will

freeze? Well. I don't think it'll matter too much. Whether you clarify first you want to hit it with ascorbic acid as you juice it so that you keep the character of it? You know, I usually I'd use it right away. If you you know, if you have access to very high proof high grade as an all and we'll get into this later, if I ever get to the questions. You can do the auto who's Dino with Azure. Other questions? No, no, I meant the questions that written in the whatever, you know what I mean? Dave has to give me the giving me the nudge anyway. So the like, you can do an auto hoogsteen on it, which is a pectin trick, which, you know, one of the written in questions deals with later on. But yeah, I would. Yeah, you freeze. I've never frozen unclarified juice, but I'm sure it'll freeze fine. And then if anything, it should be easier to clarify. When it thaws out. I don't think you're gonna get any more oxidative damage in it by freezing it before or after, I don't think but I've never tested it. So I can't say for sure. The one thing with ash meats or any other Apple and that's why I asked you about the refrigeration is ash means in particular, all apples ash means in particular, if you leave them warm, especially if they're respiring together in a case or in a bag, they will relatively quickly reduce their malic acid content substantially. And this is an actually this can be a benefit for cider. I think one of the mistakes people make when they're making ciders is they use apples that are too high and acid content. And then when the sugar ferments out, it's unpleasantly acid. You know, and that can be a big issue. But in juice for cocktails, you want to maintain all the acidity that you can, what happens

to the milk? Would it get converted to I don't

know, I think it just gets consumed. I don't know I should look it up. They just you know, the acid levels, starch levels go down, acid levels go down, sugar levels go up. And I think sugar levels go up. Absolutely. And not just relative to acid, but I can't be sure. And volatiles go up. So overripe or sunesson Apples tend to have that more flowery aroma that you get, you know, and if they're allowed to overripe it on the tree, you get that greasy skin phenomenon. But yeah, Ash meads, like was very depressing when someone buys a, you know, a bunch of ash, Ash meats, and then let them kind of go too far. And they lose that amazing kind of rich acidity that they have, because they really are just remarkable. When they're good, they're remarkable. Apple. Yeah. From 17 Like, or very early 1700s English, like 1701 or something that same year that the post was founded by Alexander Hamilton, I believe anyway, it's been a long time since I've looked at the history of ashrams anyway, yeah, so that's what I would do with it. And please tweet on back and tell us how the cocktails worked out. Great, because I think they do eat one Aren't they good? Yes, very, very. I spoke to this guy. His name just went out of my head, but he's like the most famous Virginia apple grower of old varieties. He has a book out he's got a he's got a huge apple orchard. I forget his name, but I was I talked to him once about attributes currently. They're too good too. juice. And I was like, Hey, wait, it's my job. And I make cocktails. You know, I don't serve slices of Apple to people for a living.

Remember or citrus tasting?

Well, yeah. What about it didn't like distancia is like how many times we brought this up on the show where you can't get past the stop. Lunch of our life was not that bad. It was not that long. It wasn't a not a big deal. Tell me about it. It's like, you know what it's like, here's I am if I want an experience, right? Like, let's say, I want an experience that you can't get anywhere else on Earth. Right? Right. And you said to me, Hey, Dave, in order to get this experience, I'm gonna run over your foot with with a medium sized car. And I'm like, okay, will the car break my foot? No, it's just going to hurt for like a second, and it's going to be over. But then you get to do this amazing thing, right? You do that. And you don't keep complaining about the freaking car that ran over your foot. It's interesting. And we get to go to this, like tasting is unbelievable tasting that you can't have anywhere else. Anastasia had to sit inside and watch someone else eat whose conversation she didn't enjoy three hours, not three hours was not three hours, it was not three hours, because that would have meant that we left after dark, which we did not. And in fact, we were there for a little bit of time. All she had to do was sit there and pretend she was dead. When you're in a place and you don't want to be anywhere, just sit. No, seriously, everyone like

everybody knew to bring their own lunch, you know, except for us. So we sat there because they

were horning in on somebody else's property and somebody else's lunch. It's like you invited yourself to their lunch that they were having so that you could steal all of their freakin citrus fruit. And you can't just sit there and pretend that you're dead for three hours to sit and pretend that you're dead that you're not alive anymore. That's how I get through half of my life. I just sit and pretend that I'm not alive. Oh, that's bleak. It's so great. LLC you're supposed to get through if you're bored out of your freakin mind. Right? All you have to do is pretend that you don't exist anymore. And that's okay. All of a sudden,

is this what it's gonna say?

No, it's how am I tell you grow up add. If you grew up as an add kid who can't see the board and doesn't have glasses yet. And you have to live through all of school. What you do is you sit there in your seat not like seeing anything that's going on around you. And you pretend that you're not alive anymore. And you learn how to daydream like a human being, you know what I mean? It's like, it's like, just take yourself out of the situation have an out of body experience. Like think about that. Think about the freakin universe, Zan, you want to take a quick break. Take a break, we'll be right back with some cooking issues.

Bob's Red Mill has been milling whole grains since 1978. When you mill whole grains, you get all three parts of the seed, you get the brand, the germ and the endosperm. The germ is only about 2.5% of the kernel. It's actually the sprouting section of the seed what's going to grow into a plant. It's usually separated during milling process because it contains most of the fat and therefore has a shorter shelf life. So what you want to do once you buy whole grain flour is keep it kind of wraps so that oxygen can't get to it so it doesn't go rancid. But the good news about having that fat is that it has a lot of flavor. If you want you can actually buy the wheat germ for instance and add it back to flowers. But if you buy Bob's Red Mill product, it already has the German so you don't have to learn more at Bob's Red mill.com/podcast. And we're back. So we have a caller on the Stasi who's giving me the dirty looks let me quickly answer one of the writing questions. Cody right in Cody, Cody Brown wrote in about grilling. I'm interested in a grilling setup I have seen in photos and videos from professional kitchens. It's essentially a smaller medium box with charcoal in it and a great slapped on top. I've attached the pictures below. I'm interested in a solution for quickly and efficiently finishing meats that I love temperature cook. You know you could buy a Sears I'm just kidding. I would also like to I'm not kidding. You can. You can't because Amazon whatever. I don't want to get into it. We just say why Amazon? Well, Amazon Well, Amazon has over 1000 Anastasia Yeah, over 1000 back orders for this year's Oles and they're not and they have 2500 of them in stock and they're not selling them because they're afraid they're gonna run out. I swear to God, that is what's happening. They have how many 1000 are on the water right now? 20 420 on the water we have 2400 on the water maybe then they'll start selling jerks. Okay, I'm interested in solution for quickly and efficiently finishing meats that are low temperature cook I would also like to charge vegetables. I would also like to charge vegetables to get that woodsy Ember flavor I have a gas grill but it doesn't put out quite enough heat of course not gas grills are by and large horrific monsters things there any gas grills you like well, nope. Okay. I was fast and

the infrared. Okay, handles,

can I tell you this guy fired? Can I tell you this just because I have a well because because we have the patent on this year's spreading because we have because we have a patent on this aerosol technology my dream and I would like to do it in the next not it's not the next product we're coming out with but I'd like to develop it maybe in tandem maybe not. Is it's outdoor only because I can't possibly make this indoor legally. But the Sears all v eight that's like a teppanyaki grill that's like maybe 12 inches, or mats longer like maybe 16 inches by like 10 inches, and just have like the power of it's probably in that space. So it's about the size smaller than a garland Salamander. But with like 40,000 BTUs or 50,000 BTUs in that up fired how sick would that be? It's not handheld? No, no, no, but it would be instant on so you would click it on and it would stay in would get hot within 10 to 15 seconds. You do your like you know Tepanyaki from hell, and then you pull it off. What do you think? Yes. All right. So look for that some time in my lifetime assuming my lifetime for longer than a year which you never know. Anyway, I have a gas grill that doesn't put out quite enough heat to finish low temperature meat a full size charcoal grill doesn't seem time or charcoal effective when I'm just staring off a steak for my wife and I this setup the one he's talking about EC seems like it'd be great for my purposes I looked online but couldn't find information about this type of grill box. Do you have any experience with this kind of setup? I'm looking for advice on how to build or procure one if it's a good tool for my purposes. I was also curious about the safety of such a rig. Thanks for any guidance you can provide. Love the show loving the spins off and goodness just made a foul punch with burr cognac and clarified lemon and clarified Apple quarter of course will Cody brown s and he included a picture from McGrady's McCrady isn't Charlson what you have there, my friend is a Conroe grill so you can get those@coryon.com and they are for like teppanyaki style stuff and they amount to. It's like imagine if you had a box made out of firebrick with a thin grate over the top, you'll have to replace the great quite often and there's a little door at the bottom that let you increase or decrease the amount of air that comes in from the bottom. And the reason chefs use these is because you don't list them on your plan. So if you want to have something grilled, you can carry this box into your kitchen put it on your kitchen, everyone throws in bento time because people have this like feeling the need to spend an enormous an exorbitant amount of money on their charcoal so they buy Japanese bench a ton. And maybe it's partially a little bit cleaner burn him you can buy fairly clean burning American charcoal. Is you ever done American hardwood? Charcoal versus bench a ton? No, man, I've never done the test either. We should sometimes I live in

an apartment. So what Yes, resources are limited. Yeah, creating tremendous amounts of smoke.

MD wicker brings in cheap, cheap vintra tomcito Tom from Thailand. People love it. They're his cheap Aton what does he call it? Do you have a name? He does have a name, which I don't remember is it called Andy Andy records cheap, cheap in Japan. I like cheap. Cheap Aton. Yeah, anyway, so get something like that. But one of the main advantages is has is portability. So any restaurant that doesn't have the permits to have an actual flame thing, and they're only doing a couple units at a time. So if you're doing like a, you know, if you're doing a steak for a billion people, you can't use something like this. But if you know you're only going to fire two or three small pieces at a time for a particular table, then they're kind of ideal for this and then you can put them away. And then when the inspector comes and says do you guys use in you know charcoal in here? You're like charcoal. What are you nuts? I don't have the permits to do that. What are you stupid? You know what I mean? And then that's it. That's like the technique. They always have to be like, What are you What do you jerk? Well, you moron. You know the other way you can do it professionally people used to do in New York. Now you can get permits for it. I think it's just hard. But it used to be people would buy these gas grills that you could throw in wood chips in quotes. And so people would just build wood fires in these gas grills. But they were technically gas and that's how they got in on the plans. Brilliant. Yeah, everything in New York's about messing with people anyway. Okay, let's take a call and then we'll and then we'll come back and answer some pectin questions. Caller you're on the air.

Yeah, it's crazy, because that's what my question was about. We're Hey guys, how you doing? This is Cameron in Delaware. But my question was about charcoal. You know, I'm using the Pop Pop. Charcoal bricks right now I use all kinds of hardwood, charcoal. The oven that I'm cooking on right now is a kind of like a, it's a Mara Forney. It's a new kind of josper style oven. Which is it's beautiful, you know, gives great mired reaction and normalization but it's really for the test kitchen. What charcoals do you guys cook with what do you recommend for that type of cooking?

Paul, is there a is there a party line in America's Test Kitchen?

There's almost definitely a party line but I do not know it. I'm not on this show as an official representative of air of America's Test Kitchen which in fact is in Boston so I'm almost never there in my home kitchen. Use. Royal oak hardwood lump jar. Cole and I use electric assisted airflow to get it super hot.