Hello, everybody, and welcome to a brand new series on heritage radio network called the culinary call sheet where we give a peek into the back kitchen of culinary media. I'm your host, April Jones,

and I'm your co host, Darren bresnitz. Part of why we started the show was to offer an unofficial mentorship for anyone who's interested in learning about all aspects of food and video, whether that's TV, social media online, or just something you want to do for fun.

Absolutely what was once niche or a little silly, as I'm sure you remember, Darren, when we started out, this man has now become such a massive playing field for so many creatives using food as the medium.

It's something that has driven us professionally and personally, for so many years. What excites me the most about this show is that we're going to sit down with some of the industry leaders to hear how they made it and what drew them into this industry.

With 20 years in the culinary production game ourselves. We're hoping we can give through these conversations an insider's view into personal stories from the field, as well as an in depth behind the scenes look into some of the most popular food programming. In today's evolving culinary media landscape.

We'll be covering everything from how to style your food, to how to license IP, to developing your own ideas, and some tips from the masters of how to host your own show.

Yeah, it's a little bit of conversation, how to and how do you do the things that you do in color media, which I'm so excited about? I love so many of the guests that are coming on this season. We have talent from Food Network from Vice media eater refinery 29,

we've met some of the best people in the world both in front of and behind the camera. And we're bringing them all together to share their stories, their delicious adventure and their unique journey into this crazy world.

So to be the first to hear our episodes when they launched this fall, go to wherever podcasts are streaming, and hit subscribe and make sure to give us a follow at the Culinary call sheet on Instagram.

My name is Samantha Garner, and I'm from Boston, Massachusetts. I'm a cheese Landy and because I take cheese seriously just like they do in Wisconsin. Go to cheese lynda.com to learn more. And if it's for you sign up

hello to cookies. Cookies coming to you. Every Tuesday from whenever to wherever, whenever whatever I'm in the Lower East Side of Manhattan as usual. Matt is in the actual Bert booth at Roberta's pizzeria. How's it How's it look over there?

Looks got crazy. They've been doing fun things in the backyard.

But what does that mean?

Like crazy isn't busy?

Oh, yeah. Well, I mean, I don't even know. I don't think there. Oh, Ben.

Nastasia the hammer Lopez still in California. Hey, how you doing this? dassia? We got a you sound fine. Great. Fine. We got Rebecca The Boondock blur. Where are you right now? Rebecca? You're in Brooklyn.

Yeah, I'm in Brooklyn.

doggerland, some booms Aria?

You know? I have nothing to say to that. All right.

I mean, you know, you want to come on, I figured you'd have something to say about that.

I asked her to come on. And for some color for some female color. That's okay. By

the way, what is the what is the genesis of the term color commentary?

I don't know. I think so that, oh, like black and white is doll right? And then color is like vibrant. So color.

So you think that that term goes all the way back to like the 70s when they were selling color TVs to people? I mean, like, I feel like I'm the only person here who's ever watched a black and white.

Watch the answer to B is that on black and white television, they would have one person whose job was just to describe what the color of each thing was that was being shown. That's what I want the answer to.

I love that. I love that especially like to well, this is why, you know, one of the reasons I think why there's such a good color contrast between different teams. I mean, imagine that in black and white. That's the blue person is the blue person. You know what I mean? Like, they both look identical in the same black and white thing. Or how the, you know, Lone Ranger's t shirt used to be a light blue, so that showed up super white. Yeah.

Isn't that hard to imagine, like people in black and white with actual skin color like Jimmy Stewart, you know, it's hard to imagine him as a person. That's not just a black and white person.

I mean, he was in a bunch of color movies later on. He's got to watch those movies. There's real boring, he was in it. He was in a super boring, super, like intensely boring movie. He called a Strategic Air Command where it's basically just him chilling in a b 29. Which is got to be the most boring job on Earth unless you're actually like just flying at high altitude and a B 29 for

hours or like Charlie Chaplin, you know, like him. Yeah.

You know what they need smellivision for him, apparently one of the most intensely foul smelling performers of all. Just apparently, just like, like swapping the chonies like stinking it up strong.

Like, that's such a power move. You know, like, if you're able to smell that bad. And people have to deal with it. Like, and you're

so good at what you do. Your job is like,

it doesn't matter. You smell awful. But we all want you here, right? Wow. I

mean, like, I feel like a number turning

a number of heritage radio engineers have tried this move. And then they found out their power was not great enough. It's like guys, you got

like, like, Rebecca comes on be like, like turning the man's stink into a power dynamic.

It is. Think about it. Yeah, they have no choice in yours. Nobody better than someone not gonna say something.

Maybe he's successful despite of this stank. I mean, like, in other words, like you're making it a conscious decision on his part to be stinking.

It's more well, it's twofold. It could be that but I think it's also at what point are the people around you not going to say anything to you? Because of how much power you have?

Oh, okay. Well, there's two different things, right. There's that there's, he has power because he's so he can get away with stuff, right? And then there is he is doing things to demonstrate that he can do whatever he wants, it seems to me to be two separate phenomena.

Alive, right. Like, I think most of the time, it's probably just, this is me. I'm disgusting. And no one's saying anything. But I feel like, I'm sure they're, you know, they're testing it out, you know, like they must know, at some level,

because it's famous character is a tramp. Right. So I mean, like

it was going Daniel Day Lewis. Yeah.

This character isn't a tramp. I mean, I don't know. I don't know. I don't know, Chaplin. I do know. I love that picture of Chaplin when he's giving America the Hi ho. He's like, he's like fu ragi. And he like leaves because he was ejected because of the whole because he had his communist sympathies. You see,

what exactly do you mean by a tramp?

That's the name of his character. A little tramp?

What? Like a street urchin.

But no matter what, it doesn't matter what he's doing. He could be in the EO is up in the Yukon trying to like get gold and it's freezing out and he's still Charlie Chaplin, the little Trent. You don't I mean, I think the only time he does anything different was in The Great Dictator, where I don't even know maybe he's still playing that carrier. I haven't seen that movie and so long. You know, I haven't seen a Chaplin movie in probably decades. I mean, I went through a phase where I looked through all of the, you know, I went through a historical movie phase and it looked at it all. Whatever whatever. His granddaughter is an actress now.

Chaplin Yeah, Luna

she was in something really good recently, but I forget what it was. And people can look it up and we have not introduced but yet he is here. John. How you doing John? I'm doing well. Thanks. Hanging out. Back land in the land does in the land of Connecticut based potato chips. Yes, that's exactly why I'm Yep. Nice.

So Charlie Chaplin was very good looking.

Listen, that's a subjective thing. Oh, it's fine. He's

also he's not very trim or stashes

I mean, no sounds like grooving on Hitler stashes now remember he had the

wakeup pedia Yeah, that's it's not a Hitler stache if you had it before. And you know,

it doesn't have a thing mustache.

And it was good. Yeah.

That to wait, but here's the thing. I'm looking at him dressed as a tramp and like he's not as dirty as I would have expected. Like this is a pretty clean tramp. Well

might have been earlier and like he wasn't sure he could get away with it. So we started out cleaner and then he just got smaller and smaller as he became more famous.

Yeah, and this last year, I'm looking at that photo. He's super he was super hot. Very attractive. Very attractive.

I mean, okay, wow. Yeah. Wow.

This is the kind of lady content that goes on here for

Matt. Matt put that photo as our as our photo of

Is it public domain? It probably is. Yeah, it's just

doesn't look good. like a tramp?

You think I can't identify the Hot photo? I'm gonna leave you off figure it out. Yeah.

All right, five wives. Look,

you can do that not all ones 11

kids, it's a lot.

With five lines, that's kind of trampy your wish. And if you're if you're rich, and you're going to abandon your families, and it's not so many

did he abandoned his families? I don't know. That's an assumption. That's an assumption.

What is your assumption that on the fifth wife, they spat out 11 kids? I don't mean,

well, I mean, you can still be present and not be married to the mother. Right?

Listen. Listen, I that is true. Wow, that is 100% true. And while the man was rich, right. I know that he had some of his families here in the US and had to leave the US and he never came back. Right. But I'm just gonna say that there are 24 hours in the day, there are 52 weeks in the year. Okay. And five sets of families to keep track of and be good. That's a

lot. Yes. But you're, you're assuming that these women wanted him around. And they're like, Lindsey coming back. Thanks for God. You're not here. And the money. Just did it for the window Amy says abandoned is abandoned. Which makes me think that you're like, Oh, these women felt abandoned or the children. Oh, glad Dad's not around.

Stacia the Stasi that that is what did you mean? Like? I'm thinking about the kids, the women or the women? Yeah.

Kids could be like, Thank God Dad's not around. He's really

and then he's not by watching

by watching his movies know what they did in all move to Switzerland? Rebecca. Alright, so

Charlie Chaplin is really good looking. Very good. Oh, super hot.

Are you being serious man I

want I want listeners to know Anastasia, before we got almost like I'm implementing the two minute rule. We've now done 12 minutes on Charlie chat. As always,

we try and the question really, but we spent like,

three minutes, right? Have any of you ever like you're even you guys like barely even know what it looks like? You don't even know like you've never seen one of these movies. Apparently you don't even know the character in the movies.

It's great is literally

his true face with a fake mustache and a hat. And also, he's in movies. I think The Great Dictator he doesn't play. He's not the tramp. But I think he probably has the mustache because I think he's literally doing a Hitler thing. Because that was in the 30s. And modern times. I don't think he's dressed that way. I don't remember. But it's because having actually watched all of these movies. You can say, you know, I

also, I just want to say that we talked about a variety of things with on, you know, under the guise of Charlie Chaplin, right, we talked about family dynamics, we talked about

we talked about talking about the women.

Yeah, women and you

know, yeah, sure. No, I was referring to the children and stuff. Yeah. Children. So cooking. Thanks. Yeah. So I'm going to try to rip through all of the 8 billion questions that we have. And Nastasia is only going to keep us to 12 minutes when it has to do with Charlie Chaplin and his relative hotness. Which Which picture you looking at, by the way, where he's so hot?

pedia just the I am actually working here. So I can't

make a PT. Look at it later. I have like, you know, everyone's questions up and like recipes that I have to talk about. But you know, you guys talk about Charlie chat. Is it the picture where he's leaving on the boat now knowing the F, you

know, I'm sending right now. Young Charlie Chaplin. Also I did Charlie Chaplin hot. And these are the images that came up. So I'm just letting you know. It's a thing.

So you're self selecting?

No, I already did the regular No, I already did.

Attractive in the right light. No. Well,

I mean, I did the regular search first and then now because we determined that he's hot. And you know, I made that conclusion on my own. I did the Charlie Chaplin hot so

no one's saying you're not your own woman. Rebecca, you can come to your own conclusion. Thank you. I appreciate that. I wonder whether he's ever appeared in a diaper then he would be triple hot right

Rebecca, I'm not gonna say anything more about this, but Rebecca likes a man and a diaper. Not that he needs a diaper. I have no

idea what you're talking about.

I have no idea. No one No. This is

by the way, by the way, by the way. What you've just witnessed is two people lying at the same exact

zipper Dave I this is The family shown and

now I want everyone. There's nothing. Rebecca there is nothing more family than diapers. Man in a diaper making assumption. There's nothing more family than diapers. Like the life begins with diapers and life ends with diapers. I'll leave it at that. Yeah, all right. It's like It's like the famous riddle of the of the Sphinx, like, you know, who poops in a diaper in the morning, like poops in water in the in the afternoon and poops in a diaper again in the evening. Oh, it's painful. It's painful.

By the way, that's not the hardest one Rebecca you but that's

like, this is a

nice one. First of all, Rebecca has sent me a picture of just like a random 20s guy with like a like, like a Houdini brow that I don't know. I would not I would

only think this is Charlie Chaplin. You think I'm sending you a false one. I

just don't think it's that hot. I just don't think it's that hot. I think like, you know, if you'd sent me a picture and I was like, oh, that's Paul Newman.

Who the other one Rebecca. Do the other one. Okay. That's he and people.

By the way. I don't know if you know this. We're not in a physical medium here, people. This is not a visual medium. That's true. Yeah, yeah. No one knows what we're talking mean. They can

look at Oh, because we're gonna post photos on

the cover. Okay, Dave, look at that one. Look at that one.

They did they also have Google.

No, no, we will talk about this later. To me, it looks like a guy that second breakout

room will do a breakout room where we only discussed

goodness. You but I encourage you guys to actually watch a movie first so we can discuss it based on the person's actual talents. Watch. The UConn one is famous because he's got the little thing where he picks up the here's a food thing he picks up the rolls with his forks and he does the little kancan dance with the with the with the rolls. Anyway,

I think I'm gonna go with the dictator. I feel like that feels more appropriate for what we're going through these days.

Nobody liked it when it came out because he was making a lot of a political statement. Again, this is my memory from a long long time ago but they were like make a funny movie already. Which is funny but it's not like you know what I mean? Yeah, John Have you watched any of the chaplains

have Yeah, what the gold right political Is that what you're saying? No, no, no. No

dictator. Oh, right. Yeah, okay.

The Gold Rush is the classic one where he just like he's in the cabin. It's snowing He does nothing with the dinner rolls. Like that's the classic stuff right and then you know he did the one way but then his political ones are the one reason the factory right which where he shows his his leanings there and the other one is the obviously the dictator which is done I believe 1940 Yeah. Oh, I thought was the 30s I didn't realize it was that late but yeah, that's right before he you know, gave us the heave ho and I actually did he leave the US after the war they leave before after the house on American Committee. Can't remember

unclear but I just want to let you know that when I was finding additional images to send you there are a lot of very creepy the Charlie Chaplin dolls as well. So

the word Charlie Chaplin there are a lot of very creepy dolls out there. True but

typically Charlie Chaplin dolls

Stasi as a collector of dollar familia really? Applehead doll, doll books.

My God every Apple doll head book I own is yours.

A gift? Not mine. It's yours once you

make you make me keep all that stuff so that you're not the Applehead stereotype.

Now the stereotype of the middle aged man living in lower Manhattan and making Applehead those ways a vicious stereotype that's right up there with you know person who stormed the Capitol, right middle aged man and lower Manhattan making Applehead dolls. The Stasi you're the one that didn't want to be the stereotype of the of the Hell's Kitchen. Lady who instead of cats has

Applehead done yeah, and yet you made me do that three times.

made you realize

to do that. We haven't actually discussed this. So the not well received Netflix series nurse ratchet. Um, they feature Applehead dolls.

See, Dave? I told you it was going to catch on.

I mean, did you not hear what she just said? Not well received

that but yeah, there's there there's a scene where they're they're making apple heads. I think it's to sue the mentally ill patients.

Nothing is less soothing. And Applehead I mean, it's they're horrifying. I mean, the first time DAX on Applehead doll picture of it. He's like, Get that away from me. I never want to see that picture again and then and then you do it. While I was threatening to give it to him as his Christmas gift. He's like I'll burn it. Crush it I'll put it in a in the in the garbage disposal.

Dave Are you gonna use Rebecca cvwd technique and your cvwd book?

Why are you trying to find First of all, while you're trying to get me to say negative things about Rebecca, and why you crankin me on

Anastasia, is that why you brought me on?

No, I just thought of it right now thinking about our. So that

was first of all, Rebecca's fault that was your mess up.

My mess up. Yeah, cuz you were the

one that first set it to

cooking pointers, people, here's some cooking pointers your times. First of all, don't use food as a doorstop. I'm just gonna go ahead and say don't use food as a doorstop. Right, especially food that you're going to eat soon, right? Why not? Just because you might step on it or grow stuff might fall into it, they could get on the bag and then get in, although that's also true, right, but because you're not looking at it, because it's not an eye level anymore, right. So don't use it as a doorstop. Secondly, learn the difference between Celsius and Fahrenheit and have some sort of mental idea of like at what temperature things need to be to start cooking. And then lastly, but not least, why don't you check on the food you're cooking every once in a while. These are some tips from Dave. And I'll leave it at that. But Anastasia, why are you trying to crank me? Yeah, so me, what's, what's up was that

I was thinking about your book. And then Rebecca and I were talking about sub parties earlier this morning.

And I know we were we were talking about what are you doing for Mike's birthday, which I hope is not a sub party? Yeah.

Well, I again, just let you guys know, this is this is classic and attempt to get me to spool off into into zany Ville and look like I'm the ogre. Well,

I think it's just as both of you guys would be ogres in that situation, because you you know are in control of your words, and what you choose to do. And this dasya is the one bringing it up. So I'd say two overs. Hypothetically, if we were to have this conversation, which we're not, so

get to the questions, Dave.

Oh, now get to the questions. All right. Joe Thompson wrote in a long time ago now and I'm going to use this as an opportunity to talk about something similar to what you asked Joe because I never heard back from Adam Lee. So Adam Leon T wrote a book called the flour lab, in which he talks about fresh grinding, you know, baking bread with freshly ground flour, he grinds all of his own flour. And I have to say his bread is delicious, right? Anastasia, we can we say this? But but we had this question. And for weeks Nastasia tried. I tried no response. It doesn't get passed. The man does not want to talk to us about your question, Joe. So I'm just going to use this as an opportunity to how to teach all of you it you know if if what how does that how does it work? If I teach you how to do this, you can do it. Does that? Give you a fish that thing? Yeah, but I usually mutilate it into something horrible like if you get punched in the face once you get punched in the face once but if you buy anyway, whatever Joe wrote in Good morning, Mr. Garcia, and the rest of you have the sense up on air a few months back I listened to an interview with Adam Leontine about his new book and was inspired to hop onto the sourdough bandwagon. Once the worldwide grain mill supply rebounded after COVID hit by the way it's still hard to get one they're still like will sell out as the as they get sold. So you know, kudos to the grain mill people I'm glad you didn't end up going out of business and I'm glad that people actually buy your products now. Now that I've lost any shred of your meaningless stasis respect, I tried out the flower lab recipe rye bread recipe and it was a complete disaster after cleaning up the dough waterfall the cascaded down my kitchen cabinets while the bread was rising the final volume the final product was more dense gummy ride putting than bread by the way. Anytime you overload the height okay, anytime you overload the hydration on bread past the point where it can structurally hold right so it's it's too liquid and it will just the bubbles will boil up and out before it sets and it collapses so you know you'll you'll get lighter area lighter area and then boom super dense. Okay, ride putting then bread, the volume and the recipe seemed off in the beginning and I was wondering if you had any word of passing these questions on to add them to help me and so here's the thing, right? By the way that Joe is squarely in our demographic mid 30s white guy engineer living in the burbs with wife and kids in case you are curious Anastasia Where are you curious she's gone. So not curious that she is in fact gone. So I'm gonna I'm here

he's didn't want to confirm or deny that.

We I didn't hear what you said. What did you say? Of course not. What do you say? It's

like the one hour where we actually need to listen to each other. I

had to close the window because there's someone drilling

Oh my God, even in California. I can't they've been jackhammering every day at my apartment outside the window and they're like, you know, what's a good time to start jackhammering? 7am You should wake up All right, right outside my window. Nastasia when you move back, you said you're going to specifically look for places that are entirely built right?

Well, yeah. Or have like a park in front of them. Man, well,

let's get rich. Like, I don't know if you know this people, but if you want to live with a view of a park in New York, the best thing to do is to get rich. Oh, you could do grammar see?

Oh god, that's it. No, that's

douchey Yeah, also, more rich probably.

Mr. Garcia Lopez just said that people who live on grammar see our douchey and all the people who live on the Upper East Side overlooking the park aren't the do need a Manhattan he

to get into Gramercy Park, you don't need to key to get into Central Park,

ya know,

about the park. It's about looking out on something that's green, instead of looking out on something that is a jackhammer. I'm

just gonna jump in here and say that this is from I don't know, I guess, like years of experience. But I know you have way more than that with anyone else. Yeah. But like, trying to convince Anastasia to live in a different neighborhood or anything of the sort is very challenging. Oh, no, it's a losing battle.

I'm not trying to convince her. I'm just saying I was just listing parks. And she was like, that's not even a park. Because you need a key. Like, I mean, I know she's not gonna live there. Because for those of you that don't know, and, like Manhattan is an island. It's only a couple of miles wide. Like if, right? It's a thin, Long Island.

It's not I want to get a scientist on this because I thought about it the other day, and I was getting angry and they get a scientist on it.

Let people know. This isn't what I'm thinking about. Yes, yes. But people don't know yet. So let me tell them first, the Stasi Lopez believes that the sunlight on the west side of Manhattan is better than the sunlight on the east side? I

know I didn't say better. Yeah, it's a better it's longer, you get it longer. Okay,

that's even more but as she says that this is true regardless of what buildings are between you and the setting sun if any, if she has not discussed what happens if you live in battery park city where you are both east and west side we have not discussed this No.

Okay. But I would like I want someone to confer a scientist to confirm that if you live on the west side of something the

Earth is a ball

it is a ball I want a real

no matter where you live on real science in terms of East and West, you are on a circle that is spinning right? Therefore you can choose any place on that circle and you will experience the same number of hours of daylight and nighttime now if you move up or down if you change your latitude sure you can change the stuff but remember Manhattan isn't roughly north south oriented thing and so when you go east to west on on on Manhattan from the east side to the west side you're pretty much staying on the same radius circle of rotation that the earth is on. So

no it might be something with the reflection of the light though like Jesus he

a scenario so by you know by this I know where Anastasia needs to live Rebecca Elizabeth, New Jersey, it's right across the river slightly more west. So they get slightly more and now that you're in California like every day three days yeah days long. Why? Because it's longer the further west you go it's longer so now your days are eight days long because you're 3000 miles further although

the sun does set later than it does where you guys are right now.

When the sun sets depends, well when the sun set I mean obviously obviously the sun sets depends on where you are but also the sun set depends on where you are in your timezone right so like you can be if you're all the way on one edge of a timezone you can you're the sunsets almost an hour different from when you're on the other edge of the timezone you know I'm saying

yeah, yes. Oh, my backside bread questions.

Yeah. Robert, let's try

Okay, so it does look to me like the the numbers in Eliade thing, like there might be, like, a typo on on one of the things but here's what I typically do when and this is this is hopefully, perhaps the only useful thing you're going to hear out of my mouth today, because clearly nothing else has been useful. And you know, if the future is like the past, I will say nothing more useful today.

Like the child abandonment stuff. It was pretty good.

I don't know how useful it is.

Just keep going don't respond.

I'm gonna talk a little bit about how, like, how I check recipes and how I develop recipes. Right. And John and I actually spoke about this on the phone yesterday. And John, you said you use a similar kind of a thingamajig. Right? Yeah. Yeah. So first first thing you need to do before you do anything, is you need to go out and taste somebody's product that you like, right? Find a product, find something that you like, you need a target, right? Now, sometimes you can't have the target and you need to, you need to kind of cook in the dark, but it's very difficult to know what you're trying to achieve if you haven't had the thing in the real life. Now again, you can't always do that. But actually nowadays, it again is not the same. You can go to someone like gold belly let's say you're researching Knack addition, meat pies, which are delicious, but you've never been to NACADA shorter the Cane River in Louisiana. You can go on gold belly now and someone will ship you frozen Macintosh meat pies. And you can at least see whether you're close to what they think a good one is right? Okay, so first of all, get your tour

you can just buy the product and eat the product and be like this is the best way ever.

For what did I just say? Did I just say buy the product?

Yeah, and then stop there because you're never going to achieve what they're doing.

Okay, that's really helpful in a cooking advice show. That's really helpful information in our cooking if I show to tell people just don't bother cooking.

No, but again, we're done forever. No while your food Fred

Ben and puppy lippy puppy deep.

This episode is brought to you by Wisconsin cheese. My name is Samantha Garner, and I'm from Boston, Massachusetts. I'm a cheese Landy and because I take cheese seriously just like they do in Wisconsin. Cheese Landy is a community for loud and proud cheese lovers brought to life by Wisconsin cheese. I know that I can always cook amazing food with their cheese and it's even good enough just to snack on as a cheese Landia member I know there's always a supportive community behind me who always gets as excited as I do about cheese. Go to cheese lynda.com to learn more. And if it's for you sign up. Check us out on Instagram at cheese Landia.

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We're done. First of all, Mr. Rossi, here's where I think you're wrong. Here's why I think you're very, very, very wrong. And and I've been thinking about this a lot. Because you say this all the time. Yes, there is a lot to say trying to do something at least once to see what the issues are in in making something and then saying you never need to do it again. But to like figure out, it's like I went through a thing with cheese. I'm never going to make the world's best cheese. But I went through it so I can understand kind of like what was going on. Like how hard it is like what the different variables are. And it helps me appreciate other people's products more. So actually doing something actually helps you appreciate other people more. And it's a good thing to do.

I can see that. I can see that. All right.

So what I do then is I research and it used to be much harder. It used to be I used to go to the New York Public Library back when they had books in the New York Public Library and not just computers to type out your resume on I would go and I would read every single book on the subject and write down the different recipes. But now it's so much easier, get an Excel spreadsheet, or you know, word or whatever if you can't use Excel, and then go look at a bunch of recipes a bunch. And you can look at the reviews if you want a lot of times I look at the reviews. And if if something has a lot of bad reviews, I see why they say it's bad. And then I look at their recipe, and I see whether or not what they have in their recipe is different from other people's recipes. And what you'll do is if you look at let's say 567 recipes, you'll will you'll notice trends, and then you'll see where particular recipes are different from trends. And then when you read reviews, you can see kind of how that difference from the from the rest of the recipes in that same trend how that difference translates to how other people were making the product and the finished Uh, thing now again ignore anyone who's like, I didn't have flowers. So why use buckwheat? No, it's not doesn't work. You know what I mean? Like you have to like focus on reviews where people have actually made the recipe. So I just did a single recipe. Look, I looked at Leon T's recipe for rye bread versus King Arthur's recipe for full corn bro, I would arrive for what he's doing here, I would look at full corn brote as the as the standard. I didn't look at the picture what he's doing, but it looks like it's a full crop corn bro thing. And indeed, the hydration is is way higher Interestingly, both have starters or pre ferments that are at 100% hydration. But then Adam goes on to have a much higher amount of water such that it makes more sense if it was the water, the Niner grams of water were for both the 500 grams of flour and the 500 grams of course right in the bread dough. Even so the relatively high hydration when you're doing breads specifically when you're putting all of the data points into your Excel spreadsheet. One of the things I like to do is look at total liquids versus total solids. And then also certain ratios in recipes that have eggs, look at the egg to water or egg to milk ratio. So you can kind of because that's important. So like when I'm doing like leat like brioche or or or liege waffles or things like that I'm looking at overall hydration ratios. I'm looking at fat to starch ratios, and I'm looking at milk to egg ratios. And without even like knowing like a lot lot by just lining up all of the ingredients in like you know across 567 columns of an Excel spreadsheet, you can then choose your own starter recipe of which one of those you want. And then make sure you write it down and then take notes on it. And then you can adjust and then after you're finally done, you can pitch the Excel spreadsheet and just keep your own recipe and that's how I do recipe development. All right. That makes any sense. Perfect. John, since you actually enjoy recipe development that make sense or not, yes, that makes sense. All right now are we on our two minute clock now says

Wait, we need to just mention that our newsletters coming out today. Quick mention it newsletters coming out today.

How do they get it

I'll put a link in the show notes here

what's what's the newsletter you are talking about? Something you got for Christmas? John's talking about New Year's recipes because poor guy wrote this time

which New Year's recipes did you do?

I thought that was New Year's recipe. Well, there's one for beans you know, like my Shama Bailey's recipe for being a

recipe for New Year's It was great.

Can I tell you something about well finish where it is and remind me beans remind me beans?

Well, then I also included a history of toasting and the science of like when you pop up on the champagne bottle at a certain temperature there's a little blue cloud that happens between the cork and the and the bottle.

Toast the things you do with friends and family with glasses of champagne and not the pieces of bread that become crunchy. Correct? Yeah. So beads.

It's like I don't care what Anastasia and Rebecca had it. All right, no, it's fine. It doesn't matter.

Oh, come on, please. Go on. Well,

I actually I'm interested for Dave to know about

book or actually Anastasiya want me to go ahead and get it in place, please. I think

actually, I talked about the violin in my section. So that's very relevant.

I do about about violin.

Well, I talked about to care packages that I received for the holidays, one from Anastasia which was pretty incredible and very thoughtful and included a like a watercolor painting slash card that she made for me. And a scrub made with sand from the beaches of Malibu. So I just wanted to say thank you scrub, like a body sky.

And the body scrub has actual sand in it. Yes, the Stasi sends me very nice care packages of things like citrus and like little tiny banana guavas. Don't ever send anyone out there. Don't ever send me sand. Do not ever send me send a question send it to me. I'm just saying. I'm just saying

I obviously know. When the colleagues show yeah.

My colleagues and colleagues show yeah.

But the other the other package I received is from one of my best friends from growing up Eliza and she moved to Florida like a year ago and all of us in our friend group looked at her like she had you know, two heads really What are you doing? Um, but she especially during, you know, COVID and everything. She's living like a very, you know, charmed life. She has a huge garden that she made outside. And so she's just constantly sending us photos of all of these amazing tropical fruit. She's growing. And she's in

South Florida.

So no, she's so she's in. She's outside of Tampa.

Like it's relatively north for tropical stuff. Yeah. So it has to stand a light frost then.

I guess. So. I mean, she's also she went to Warren Wilson College and has worked on farms for a long time. So she's, you know, if anyone can do it, it's her. But she also like goes swimming with manatees on the weekends, which she did this past weekend. But she made me a shrine to our old orchestra conductor was the holiday gift that I got. And it was pretty incredible. But I played the violin and Eliza plays the harp. So if you want to learn more about what a shrine to an orchestra conductor conductor looks like, you should check out the newsletter

harp Ah, hey, I want to learn an instrument where it takes up my whole house, but I don't want it to be as versatile as a piano. What do you got?

How about I mean, she didn't live in she didn't grow up in an apartment in New York, so they have plenty of room for the harp. But anytime like she still plays it like she'll play it for weddings and different events and stuff. But moving it is such a challenge. HARP

is great if you're like really rich, like when I was like a little kid I took piano lessons. And my teacher she had like, you know, the Steinway grand, not the baby grand like the full grand because I guess her she was rich, I guess. And she had the full size harp. And when you have that giant, you know, that giant living room with the windows with the fancy curtains, and over near one corner, you have that giant kind of like gold gilt harp. Like it's a serious it's a serious sign of wealth right there. Again, not a poor person's instrument.

It's a power move.

Move much like smelling real bad. What about smelling real bad at the harp?

Um, that's I guess, if you I don't know. Does anyone have the power to do that? Like if your

real power move is to talk about nitrogenated coffee cocktails?

Beads? See you guys tried first of all the Stasi got out of saying what she wrote about

Ms. dos seus is in crisis

a price about Mines a surprise. Very good. Okay. Okay.

It's very good.

So on beans. How many of you and I think this is a family friendly word. How many of you have fart problems with beans? Really? Yeah, in general. In other words, like I don't eat like I don't eat beans every day. So like I'm not saying that I walk around going to tu tu tu tu tu tu tu tu but like when you have beans, I feel I feel the bloat. You know what I mean? Like when I make beans, I have beans. I feel the bloat. If I eat a lot of beans, like for instance, like going back to New Year's, like New Year's, I do the hopping John every year. A little bloated. I'm not saying like it's a nightmare, but I get a little bloated. You know what I'm saying? None of you guys have that problem. No, I'm the only person are you still want to admit it? A lot of people

think it's noticeable. And yeah, like I can't say that.

Harold McGee started writing on food and cooking because beans make people feel that was the whole

Tuesday. We're supposed to talk about gene Lester.

Okay, when we finished beans, and then we'll talk about gene Lester, I thought you were gonna have Harold on to talk about the edginess. Oh, we're