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Hello, and welcome to cooking issues. This is Dave Arnold, your host of cooking issues coming to you live on reverse pizzeria on the hairdryer network in Bushwick. Every 12 312 What do we what are the 1210? Let's say we started 1210 I know. We have to say 12 We have to make it 12. All right, we're keep working track you don't listen people's. It is true that I leave my house late but because I'm hard at work on the questions that you guys have submitted. But for some reason, I always seem to think that I can make a little bit faster than I can today. I didn't stop but my bike had the same problem. I took my tire off my my tube, no leaks. It's the Schrader valve. That's right by people. I'm an American I use Schrader valves not these Euro pretentious press the sun guns that you guys you bike enthusiast favor? That was like I don't know. I mean, I don't even know your bike rider. But you use I don't like the way you do. What is that supposed to mean? Like you go like car speed like anger? You know? I? Well, that's the reason I like biking. I like biking because you can if you were to go all out on the street, like walking or running with like an angry look on your face like all your stuff on your back in your work clothes. People would they would think that you were in would call the cops. You think you're crazy. If you're in your work clothes, and you're going a billion miles an hour on a bicycle with all your stuff. People might think that you're a weirdo but they're not going to call the cops back right or crazy bikers back but that's about it. I can deal with that.

Can't do in your car either.

No, like bike is the only place that you can really get you're kind of New York there's too many damn people here rage out. You know, my wife. My wife was like, I was complaining my wife. She's like, Dave, you're you know, you're becoming a crotchety old jerk in your in your old age. Because you know how they have the bike weekends in Manhattan? Where they like turn streets. Yeah, they turned like Lafayette and like stretches of like real streets into bike bike and like, what it was that thing. Rollerblading is for summer streets, is it Yeah. It's the worst time to bike is the absolute worst time to bike. It's like families riding like four abreast like two miles an hour, and like brothers, sisters, I've got fantastically expensive tomatoes in my bag, I build a special support structure for my bag when I'm going to carry tomatoes. And I aligned said support because you don't want the bag crashing on it right so I basically turn it into a hard box on my back that I then line with with with tablecloths that are fluffed up, then I lay the tomatoes carefully in and then I stand on my bike the entire way home to provide the extra shock absorbing power of my legs and, and unlike my normal riding posture, which is kind of forward leaning angry. I'm writing fully erect, like like some sort of a Dutch person. And and, and I'm hindered by these people, like all of a sudden, like making me like, like, slam on the brakes. Like I'm trying to get my tomatoes home. I'm not having fun. It's not fun. I'm not out here, like you know, it's like no one drives me more just hey, I'm gonna take a leisurely drive out in the mountains he's not here you don't I mean,

you're writing fully erect.

You know, you know listen gooey duck face. Like you know you love the innuendo on the show. But I mean

just trying to you know, you're making us all picture this.

Whatever. Calling your questions to send 184972128 That's the 184972128 so we can hear your cooking or other questions here live on the Cooking issues radio program are joined as usual with Jack and the engineering booth. You've already heard from this dashing hammer Lopez we've already got we've also got Eliza Eliza right Eliza from by the way, double duty lady. Does Mossad work as well? Has Did, did you you didn't want her to have the puffing guns right? And you also did the roundtables you only did the roundtables you never went you never came to Maker Faire. Yeah. The roundtables by the way. They're fun. You've done all we did two or three three. We did three right three. I did two did two. Yeah. Which one's

the first and the second.

So that'd be GMOs and soda. So So you know, I really whatever the last one was. I don't remember what it was. It was good. Oh, big business is big fitness and food fitness food. Baby. Spinning cheese. Alright, so we got the you know, that'd be That'd be better. Like, that's how you like it. Like as much as I listened to like all the old school rap stuff, and how much I love it. Like the older I get. I've had this discussion on the air, man, I won't go too deep into it but pimping being a pimp is disgusting. It's like freaking vile. It's like the worst thing you can do is to be a pimp and yet, you know how many years if you walk around with like, big PMPs being achieved, you know, I'm saying? It's like, it's ridiculous. Like women will walk around using the word pimp like it's okay. What do you think about this jack? It's

not okay, pimping? Pimping? Not

okay, not okay. Yeah, yeah. Pimping ain't easy. Like being hard out. Not easy. Really. Did you get to that? Well, because you said big business. And then I said big, big business spend and cheese. They can be LEDs up in NYC, which, you know, I don't think that's his phone, son, by the way. No. 99 problems also questionable, but like amazing song. Nine problems. Amazing song. Anyways, stars is more up on the Beyonce breakup, the potential Beyonce break. Have you watched the Beyonce breakup? Or your mom hasn't called you about that yet? No, guys, but I food food food. We're better than this. Better than better than Beyonce. I really doubt it. Yes. What about early Beyonce? What about Destiny's Child? Beyonce? I

don't know about that.

We have nine questions. All right. Geez. Anyone questions?

Boom. There Dave Anastasia. This is from Mark spelled CK I like to see K. It's not like mark with a C not mark with a K. got both. You can afford both of those letters in your name mark. Like Mark index, right? Isn't how to spell it, Mark. Anyways. When I make sauces slash soups in a blender and there are onions in there, I get a weird metallic slash I'm using the slash and whatever. Metallic slash bitter taste. It's like the taste you get when you chop onions in a food processor. I forgot about it. But then I tasted the same thing in a restaurant on the internet. I found that tomato seeds might be the problem. Can you tell me why that why that happens. And is there anything we can do about it Kind regards, Mark? Well, in typical mental tangent form, this should just show you people I want you guys to notice that the tangents don't just happen. When I'm here talking. The tangents happen when I'm literally reading your question, because I reading it aloud. I just realized I didn't see that tomato seed thing. I only saw the first portion of your question. And so that's all I can respond to because it is something that I know that chopping onions with, for instance, carbon steel blades, and we've talked about this in our show singles a couple of years ago. When you when you chop onions with carbon steel knives, you get this kind of horrendous metallic taste. And the reason is well known fact, well known that it's a well known fact that alliums onion, being an Allium have lots of things that react with iron, and other metallic, they form complexes with iron and other metals. Which is why and I think we talked about this, remember, they sell those deodorizers some guns, that this stainless steel hand deodorizer thing, I don't think they sell them anymore, because I don't think they really work because those are made of stainless steel, stainless steel, not nearly as effective at complexing with Allium compounds as good old fashioned carbon steel, because it's been passivated with a, you know, an anti corrosion layer on the front. But this is why I was saying that, like, if you're trying to get onion smell off of your hands, things like steel, wool, things that rust might be a good, a good thing to try. I think that's what I said, but it's been a couple of years since we did anyways. So my assumption is, is that you're getting some sort of a thing of a crap with the with the carbon steel. And by the way, you know, there are lots of things I don't know whether this is related to the flavor, but because alliums onions garlic oysters are extremely complex. And so you know, one of the things that provides that kind of off color is a series of pigments called Anthro Xanthine is not anthocyanins and those Zan thins. And they're also things that make potatoes turn dark when you cut them, you know, when you cut a potato, and and you know, soaking in water because you're low quality person, and you let it sit out there and it turns like pink and and then Brown. And then that brown color doesn't go away when you cook it. So when anyone ever looks at your potato, they can be, oh, this person is a jerk. They don't care about the food. They're serving me. They don't care about quality and they can't observe day to day things. They don't learn from existence, you know, I'm saying. I mean, it's okay. If if I saw that someone's house would be like, Wow, so you've never cooked a potato before? You know what I mean? Like because like it's obvious Jack, you slice the potato, right?

I mean, yeah, not well, but

Well, I mean, look, there's it's one thing to have bad knife skills. This is entirely acceptable. It's another thing to not notice that potatoes turn into crap when you let them sit out when they're cut. Whatever, that's obvious. Yeah. Certainly who's so tomato seeds. The only thing I can think of offhand and this is probably wrong because they don't have maybe you can search you want to search for tomato season is that the increased acidity is causing more reaction with the with the blades? Because my feeling is is that a lot of those blades are made out of like three or four which is, you know, slightly rough stubble at think they're not really made of really high quality you think they'd be made of some sort of like wizard steel, but they're not. I think they're mainly made out of 316 and three or four of I don't know, we'll look into it, Mark. Anyway. Now we got a follow up question. Mmm, wrote in a while back on making sugar free ice cream. And what I said was, I don't Why do you want to be sugar free? Do you want it to taste a sugar free? Or do you merely want it to be sugar free and for what reason? Do you want it to be sugar free? Okay, so he or she wrote back because I can't remember and E mm is completely genderless right? Unless it's Emma nyama Mmm. all capitals. Thanks for dressing my question on the air. The reason I asked is once or twice a week I get requests for sugar free desserts, mostly from diabetics styles. Can you do a Wilford Brimley in limitation? No. No. Well for bringing anyone Jack Wilford Brimley. Nope. You don't I'm talking about though. I'm Wilford Brimley, and I got diabeetus he's the guy who he's like, spokesperson Yeah, no, I know the commercials. He's He's like the spokesperson for like taking care of your diabetes, but he doesn't pronounce it diabetes. He pronounced it diabetes. With a mustache. Yeah, but the giant mustache and Wilford Brimley and I've got diabetes. That is so like we used to walk around like we still do it but your index and once Moscow bid is made it's because like I forget who it was. It wasn't Nick. It was someone I know. Oh, Leo Ro vacek from Nomad we were hanging around at at Nomad and EMP and you know, fantastic bar man. Like he got served a drink once I had way too much sugar at tails, the cocktail teasing goes diabeetus and that's all he said. That is diabeetus I'm not sure about okay, I know having a pan of sugar free gelato would not so much out of the display case but we offer catering gallon sizes. I'd like to see someone tuck into a gallon sized container of gelato. That's rough man. Think about that. a gallon, a gallon. That would be that's not that's not four pints. That's four freaking quarts. That's eight pint containers of ice cream folks as a boat ton of ice cream. Let me tell you something people with diabetes ordering this catering size gallon of ice cream. You do not have the ability as an individual human being to consume a gallon of ice cream before it goes bad if you do you got issues. What if it's for a party? That's fine. I'm just saying that's a lot ice cream. People and a half gallon, probably what is that could take down a half gallon before it goes bad? Yeah. Yeah, that's it, that's fine. I think the maximum quantity of ice cream you should buy is probably a half gallon for home use in a normal situation because you want to store ice cream in your freezer as little as possible. Most home freezers, like they open and close a lot. And they go through defrost cycles and all these kinds of things. So they're not good for the long term storage of ice cream. You know, plus people put things that aren't frozen in them, which drops the temperature of the freezer, and then you get re crystallization problems. And so, I mean, you can always get incredibly highly stabilized ice cream like did you guys notice recently that Breyers ice cream past like five years it started putting stabilizers in their ice cream because everyone realized that Breyers was good if you live right near Philadelphia, and you can get the briars, like right when it was made. And then like a week later, it sucked and once you opened it in your fridge, it turned into like Breyers ice crystals instead of Breyers ice cream and so back when I was a kid they used to have advertisements like little kids with lisps I don't know why people think that like kids with lists are like the you know the cynic qua non of purity and American Americana but they were like this kids reading off like nothing wrong with list. I'm just saying like why has to be it always has to be a kid with a list. You know what I mean? And, and so he's reading off the ingredients, he can pronounce him and he's reading off the ingredients and other ice cream. He's like, caring. I don't remember exactly what it's like reading off like Carageenan Guarulhos crapping, like Breyers doesn't have any of this stuff. And secretly they added all that crap to it because you know what makes the ice cream better anyway, that's not what we're talking about. Okay, I'm not sure about diabetics and the sugars naturally found in fruit. I did a quick search and read on the American Diabetes Association website that yes, diabetics should eat fruit, but do not specify how much or what kinds are safe slash not safe. I guess I would like to accommodate this request one day with an artificially sweetened vanilla flavor not using our Madagascar vanilla extract as sugar as an ingredient or maybe chocolate. Some information, we use a carpet Johnny lb 202. I've never used that one I've used a smaller they'll be 100 batch freezer, pre jail base and stabilizers, whole milk, sugar and corn syrup plus as many local fruits as we can get our hands on throughout the seasons. Thanks again. Cheers em and Okay, looking. First of all,

I think a lot depends on a lot depends on who you're dealing with. Right? So like an actual, like, person who is like diabetic who knows about, you know, what's going on is not going to, if you eat fruit, PS, you're eating sugar, DHA, right? And fruits have all the same sugars in them that we normally associate with sugary things. So they have fructose, they have glucose, and they also have sucrose in them, right? It's just the question of how much so like someone who has, like the trick with with diabetes, and I don't really know that much, because, you know, I don't have anyone in my family. It's diabetic, and I'm not diabetic. But as far as I can tell, the trick isn't eliminating all sugar. The trick is managing the amount of sugar you get, so that you don't have a spike in your blood sugar level, which is why people focus on the glycemic index of certain foods, including carbohydrates, what can spike your blood sugar levels of glucose quickly, or what causes it to spike? Because that's what's going to cause problems for diabetics that said, so, so for instance, you could up the fructose, which is sweeter than sucrose, right? And also has not only is it sweeter than glucose, sucrose, rather, but it also has a lower glycemic index. So you can radically lower the glycemic index of something like an ice cream by sweetening it primarily with fructose as opposed to sucrose. And we'll go into that in a second. But the point is that you can do that. Now. The flip side of that is, is that you can't No one writes, like no one writes on on a on a label, right? This fruit has a glycemic index of 23. You know what I mean? Like no one writes that on it, right? Instead, they just write sugar free or whatever. And so and then, like someone who actually cares about this stuff, has to base their their information on whether something is sugar free, so you can have an ice cream, that would be fine for someone who has diabetes to have a moderate amount of not a gallon, but you know, a moderate amount of that is flavored with fructose, but then you couldn't write sugar free on it. You can write sucrose free, right? That's kind of weaselly, right. So then what people do other when they don't do that is they'll add a texturizing agent, and then they'll add some sort of fake sugar like Splenda. You know, it's like, also you say you can't use the real vanilla because it's got sugar in it, even though you're using probably a fairly small amount of that vanilla. Right. And, and it contains, it's not, I would guess it's not the main amount of sugar that's in your recipe. It's coming from the vanilla. I bet you don't have to alter the sugar balance of your recipe that much based on the video you're using. I could be wrong, because I don't know the vanilla that you're using. My point is that you run into a situation a lot where in order to do the right thing by a customer, you have to do the wrong thing by a customer and what In order to try and help the customer by giving something that they can enjoy, you have to actually ruin it by turning it into crap by using ingredients that are bad, even though there could be some sort of middle bass thing that they could, you know, have instead. So that said, what I recommend that you do, because remember, you're playing with a couple of variables here, you're playing with the taste, which is the sugar, right? With sweetness, rather, you're dealing with the glycemic index, which is how much the product is going to spike blood sugar levels. And then you're and by the way, you can add things that are not sugars, for instance, sugar alcohols and other things like this, that do have an effect on people's gut could possibly have an effect on people's glycemic index, although I don't think much actually, I don't think sugar alcohols have that much of an effect on the glycemic index, I'm not sure they can make give you the runs, whatever anyways. And you're also working with a texture because sugars lower the freezing point depression of ice cream base, and that's how they do things like that's one of the reasons why ice cream has the right textures. If you increase your sugar, then you decrease you increase the softness of an ice cream at a particular dipping temperature. And if you decrease the sugar you make it consequently harder. So the the ultimate website to go to on this is WWW dot Dairy Science dot info which is the University of Guelph run by Professor Douglas golf, his his website on dairy science, specifically, I would look at two articles. One is called the science of goat unquote Goldilocks ice cream. And that's I guess, you know, cast, right, you know what I mean? And they have they go into how to calculate freezing point depression, right? So then you're gonna need to go and look on any there's a number of websites that will give you a glycemic index as to things but you want to shoot for a specific freezing point depression, and then shoot for a specific glycemic index. And things you can use other than sugar to depress. So if you're using Splenda, and you're using maybe one of the sugar alcohols that and you can read up it's it's specific freezing point depression ratio compared with sugar, right? So if you know that you want a sweetness relative to let's say, 14 to 15% by weight and a batch of sugar. That's the sweetness of what you're shooting for. You're looking for a sweetness index similar to that, right? And then you're looking for and then you rate that also as the freezing point of one sugar. Right? Then you're looking to find other ingredients that add up to that and they the instructions in equations are all on University of Guelph websites. So you can add alcohol, which lowers the freezing point, in addition to some sugar alcohols and then an artificial sweetener like Splenda should you have to do that, although I highly recommend fructose problem with fructose, by the way people, aside from the fact that it is an actual sugar and that you'd have to write it on the label as such, and that's some people who are, you know, in advocacy for diet. Diabetics don't advocate fructose because they believe it has other problems, even though they all recognize that it has a much lower glycemic index and therefore is better from that standpoint. There's a bunch of studies and the research isn't exactly clear yet. What are you noticing? So fructose, alcohol, a little bit of salt, alcohol can be used to balance out the whatever freezing point depression you don't get when you're adding fructose you can get with alcohol. That's my 18 cents on that good. Goldilocks, by the way, yeah, that's a good one. Yeah. Nice. Well, you call her? Oh, caller Yes. Caller you're on the air. Hello, Dave. How are you?

Oh, son from Palo Alto. How are you doing? I'm doing good. I just had a question about I'm trying to make some Debian and ISI and doesn't really work. And I was wondering if you had any pointers? Maybe I'm doing something wrong.

So let me see whether I know what's happening. It looks foamy, and then it breaks after like three minutes and turns into like a very liquidy soup in the bottom your bowl. Yeah, correct. Yeah. You haven't heated it enough. So one of the things with Zabba yawn is that and I've never made it in the in the ECA. I always do it on a stovetop like old school, you know, like sugar, the egg yolks, white wine, whip it, you know? Yeah, yeah. And so you're sitting there and you're whipping it with a whisk right? And you think it's fluffy and you're incredibly worried that you're going to curl it and you're gonna make it taste bad because you're gonna, you're gonna overheat the egg yolks. And so you you get, what happens is it starts building texture based on the aeration that you're giving it with the whisk, not based on the fact that you've cooked the egg yolk enough and then as soon as it cools down, it loses its structure and turns back into a liquid again, you've lost the texture. The problem is you haven't heated it enough. So you can you can heat it Kremen glaze style and a zippy with a circulator. I'm assuming since you live in Palo Alto, you have 10 numbers and circulators. Are you wondering,

do you have one? Yeah. All right.

So you know, like, unless what's the what's the there's East Palo Alto and Palo Alto rights does? Yeah, I don't remember you don't remember, you know, isn't East Palo Alto. She went to Stanford. She went to Stanford, but she I guess never left

Campus Connection with that place anymore.

That place anymore.

Wow. Well, people who went to Stanford generally just forget about us Palo Alto anyway, so

yeah, anyways, but so, my, my impression of people who live in in the, in the non eastern section of Palo Alto, is that they all have kind of immersion circulators. But anyways, the, you know, what I mean? You know, whatever. It's just stereotyping people based on the tech industry, I guess. But so you could do the do you do it in immersion circulator? And what temperature do you use? So I did it 65 Oh, yeah, way, way too low, way too low. Because when you add sugar to an egg yolk, or liquids, like wine, or acids to an egg yolk or salt to an egg yolk, you radically increase the temperature at which it starts thickening. So I don't have a particular temperature for sabot Yone but just for an FYI Kremlin glaze. Now admittedly, there's a lot of liquid in a criminal glaze more so than in probably in his head. But yeah, and so like my my wife, and I've given it before, but my specific crema glaze recipe, just as an FYI, is 500 Milk 500 cream, 10 Extra large egg yolks, 170 grams sugar plus flavoring, like vanilla and salt. So that cooks at two celsius for like for like 15 minutes. So and by the way, once you reach a temperature at which egg yolks are going to start to thicken they they tend to continue to thicken in custody and on gluten and glazy and and sevillio unstyled basis, they tend to continue to thicken over time. But beyond they won't break as long as they don't go higher than wherever the full setting temperature of the protein is at that dilution and that and that ion level but they will take on ag notes as they cook longer. So like a crumb on glaze is cooked for 1015 minutes at 82 is great when it's cooked for 20 starts having a little bit of an ag aroma, especially when it's warm. So I would experiment with much higher temperatures something like somewhere like again, I don't know how much wine you're adding. But you could try at tune for 10 minutes 10 to 15 mins. Remember it's in a bag make sure it's agitated so that it stirs itself and then see whether that is enough. Or if it's too much. If it starts tasting curdled, and you start getting little like curds in it then you drop the temperature. Let me tell you one thing is it a secret I learned from many years ago from one and one ROKUS his book suevey, the original one the one Spanish that was translated into English and like like 2001, or whatever it is. When you pull the unglazed mix from the circulator, it will look lumpy, throw it onto a counter and smack it around with your hands so that it breaks it up and it will be smooth as silk no problems. The other thing is is that you can as long if you have a vacuum machines is actually really good. If you don't have a vacuum machine to it later, you can blend it such that you don't have to worry about the Eliza as well, because otherwise you would normally have to strain the Xeon to get rid of any trace of Halawa before you serve it. But if you quickly post it in a Vita prep, you can your opposing invader prep just like I do with an unglazed bass as long as you don't over whip it, you can break up the hollows and you don't need to strain it to get rid of any other particles. And I don't know how Palo Alto you are. But that means you also have a Vita prep that someday we'll all be that Palo Alto but but anyway, so but like a light blending can help get rid of that the only issue is if you don't have a vacuum machine. A lot of excess air in the bag can lead to I think all flavors. So for instance, I you know, most things I say are as good in a ziplock as they are in a vacuum bag crema glaze is not one of them, it's still good in a ziplock and if I had never had it in a vacuum right side by side tasted like an unglazed on in a ziplock versus on glazed under a vacuum bag, I'd probably say that they're identical, but they're just not, they're the one in the vacuum bags a little bit better. And I think that's because there's no air involved in it. So if you if you, you could then not use a you could put all the ingredients in a zippy exclude the air without using a blender like kind of smash it up on the counter by hand, make sure it's fully mixed and distributed. Maybe give the yolks like a little bit of a forking to break them all up before you add it. And then you could strain it afterwards. And that would probably be a network strain and whip it you know afterwards to get the kind of texture that you want. Anyway, some combination of those things should work but I believe it's the temperature that we should problem.

Okay, and then I could also probably serve that cold after assuming that works like in the winter. Oh yeah, no problem with that.

Oh, no. Like once you function once you once you get the egg yolks to the right temperature, they're they're good then you know, as long as they're not too thick, you should be able to put it out through your through your whip or like depends on how thick you've gone but usually it stays into a light horrible consistency and then the only trick is I usually when I'm doing things that are thick or if I'm doing fluid gels, I just put my finger over the tip of the whip or and snap it down towards the head before I dispense just to make sure that I'm not you know blasting nitrous out without getting the product out. You know what I mean? But should work? Yeah, definitely. Sure we're finding foothold a lot better. Oh, yeah, definitely. Thanks. Hey, no prob. Oh, also wait, if you mix it if you mix this stuff beforehand, right? You should be able to pressurize it in the ISI and just cook it in the circulator at the ISI swirling it occasionally. Not going to guarantee it, but it should work.

I mean, pressurize the NSA, then then put it in the bath.

Yeah, you don't have to pressurize it beforehand. You could probably do it unpressurized and and pressurize it after you chill it, but it should work. In other words, you might be able to get around not having the bag by doing it. Like that. Yeah, give it a shot list. As long as you don't have a thermal whip. Now let us know how it works out. All right,

cool. That's yeah, well, thanks a lot. No problem.

I have a second caller. All right. Squeeze it before the break. Yes.

Squeezy squeeze. Caller you're on the air.

Hey, Dave Arnold, this is a Martine from Peoria, Illinois, doing pretty good. So what I've been thinking about is, I'm trying to find a way to infuse my basting butter. What I wanted to see is, is there a possible temperature that I could keep butter in a circulator with aromatics without the butter separating? So therefore, potentially, in the kitchen have a different basting butter for each protein? would there not be flavored temperature? Would it break?

Yeah, yeah. Yeah, they're gonna break. So you want to, you want to do like a compound butter using a circulator. But never had it melt

to not separate milk solids. So when I'm facing with it, I can still keep the solids and I can still form the carwash flavors later. But also to not have the chunks of just making a straight up compound butter, which could potentially burn in the pan.

Yeah, that's an interesting problem. Let me see. I just

moved. So I haven't gotten the chance to experiment at all yet, but so I'm calling an African.

Yeah, that's a good problem. Let me think about this. You know, what I would do? I would I, and I see if I this can be done. So the question is, the question is, can you read functionalize, the milk proteins. So like, the interesting thing to do would be to, to to clarify the butter, right? Save the milk solids, right? measure how much water you've boiled off during the clarification process. All right, flavor, the butter, flavor, the butter, the butter fat, straight, and then somehow recreate the butter from that. So they quit. I don't know if that's possible. Here's how. Here's a way there's possible. If you made your own butter, you could just save that. On it's not going to have Oh, because it's going to be I don't know whether the weather man, I'm sure it's possible. Yeah, I've turned melted butter back into cream before using an ultrasonic homogenizer. So I know that I know it's possible to turn butter back to cream has a little bit of an off flavor, but not a lot. And I don't know I don't know. I don't know, for instance, that keeping butter in a bag in a circulator. Okay, here's another thing you could put like a circulator in a wok, I used to do this with oysters, you put a circulator, in a walk in, you said it at 60. You know what I mean? We're 65 something is not quite hot enough to melt butter in the bag. And maybe you get better penetration, like maybe you keep enough enough solidity so that the butter holds its shape and doesn't break, but that you get better penetration of the flavors, that's a that's another way to do it. Or like a wine cooler, you know, if you have a wine cooler or a wine fridge, is to vacuum bag it with the butter and a wine fridge. Or like I say in a circulator under water at a fixed temperature in a walk in, which works very well. It's kind of a little wager, but works very well just keep it below the temperature at which the butter is fully going to break and melt out. You know, like at a soft temperature range, like maybe like what do you think is seven decently this and Fahrenheit and then and then cold chill it to re solidify? Its, you know, totally and then peel off the aromatics or scrape them off of the outside. It might be worth a shot.

Yeah, well,

I'm gonna work on it. And if I figure anything out, I'll send me a tweet or something. Yeah, please do.

All right. Thank you. Good luck with it. And let's take a break and come right back with cooking issues.

White Oak pastures is the only farm in the United States that has has its own USDA inspected red meat abattoir or slaughterhouse and its own USDA inspected poultry abattoir, a slaughterhouse. We partner with whole foods to deliver our high quality meat and poultry from Miami, Florida, all the way to Princeton, New Jersey, one family, one farm, five generations out and 45 years of full circle return to sustainable land stewardship, the humane animal Stockman ship. For more information, please visit our website, white oak pastures.com.

You know, Jack, I'm always so enamored of the way he says about wall that like, I haven't listened to the rest of him. But he's like from Miami. All right. That's like the end of the country going south. All the way to Princeton. Princeton. Yeah. Hello. That's south here. What are we in the freaking Arctic? Like he's like New York. No crap on them. They don't deserve the products of my USDA inspected abattoir. It's pretty good voice.

Why don't pastures I

mean, that's good.

Say I like I love the way you'd like. I would eat any kind of poultry that man sells based on the way he says poultry. Give me some poultry. When you can cue it up. I know. It's like yeah, well, they will surprise you later. Yeah, just like poultry. I love them. But now I feel insulted. He hates New Yorkers. He's like Princeton. Okay. New York. crap on those people. Right? Anyways.

Red meat abbatoirs

it's so strong. It's strong. Okay. Hey, and we had a another butter. Well, let me get rid do Michael NAT Michael makin wrote in about the question of using using the Seuss feed and the circulator with remember that guy that we had in the class and he would only pronounce it sous vide. And he was all he cared about was was pickled onions, the onions, the onions, remember this? Oh, my God, Sue's feed. I swear to God, he's in a class with Mills and I for like, two or three days straight. And like he hears a saying suevey Like, like 200 300 times a day. You know what I mean? The difference between Sweet and Low temperature Soviets if you've made vacuum suevey This would be that CBT CBT CBT sous vide up until the very end of the class. Okay, this is from Michael nakin. Would you one of our favorite vegetarian cooks when you say you know Eddie Shepherd Michael Mackin. Does anyone else write in with vegetarian? These are people that we know. Anyway, one in the UK one in the US? And like very far separated. Right. So you got your West Coast Michael Mac and his West Coast, not Boston, right. It's new over there in the Seattle area. Anyways, so it's like, you know, they're kind of antipodal vegetarian chefs then. Okay. Just heard any shepherds call? Here's an updated version of my note on sushi and vegetables in circulators and vegetables. Okay, oh, by the way, he says sorry, I missed the question a couple of weeks ago about Stevie vegetables. I got hooked on a 28 episode yield lecture series about the Civil War. all better now. Now you shafted me Michael Staz like always says that I'm gonna like throw away all this food stuff and just go to the Civil War. Like it's because like, freaking David one rich made me read Shelby foots, you know, 8 billion word like three volume thing on on the Civil War, which took you know, forever like so many visits to the hopper to read that Shelby Foote thing, so much Hopper reading. And now you got hooked on it. I'm assuming you're referring to Professor blights Civil War 28 Lecture Series, because I had to look it up. And I saw this and now I'm sure I'm gonna go down to like a 28 lecture keyhole, thanks to you and stars is gonna have to like look and torture me about Civil War forever. You know, we were going to buy a grist mill in Herndon, Virginia, that there was for sale that was like totally falling apart. It was so cheap, because like, My My dream is to like, whenever like New York is getting me down. It's like leave it all behind. Just have my own water wheel. And just like whenever anyone pisses me off, it's just the waterwheel you know what I mean? Like someone calls me with some irritating thing. And she's like, I flick on the water to like, open the open the raceway and grind some stuff. You know, I mean, anyways, grist mills, they sold the grist mill, and then someone was selling a grist mill in Virginia

on it, because you don't really want it. Well, that's not the case.

That's not the case. It does look to me the other day, could we I sent the guy an email him and a guy in Vermont. I said, Have you sold your grist mills yet? And and they said, Yes. And styes looks at me without missing a beat and goes, some other dude is living your life for you. It's not right. Anyways. Okay, back to Michael neck. And I think that the list you made a vegetarian applications for CV was pretty amazing. And I agree. Well, thank you. I agree with you that eggs alone are a good enough reason to own a circulator. And by the way, have you seen the CVS a calculator that Doug Baldwin and I built on the www dot HSN chefsteps.com? That's just f.com Yes, I've seen it. It's good. I like it. And I love what I do. Shepherd said to those mushroom burgers are baller, I can tell you from personal experience. I agree with you that in general precise temperature control isn't that necessary with typical vegetables. And that bagging to retain or add flavor is the bigger advantage although the kitchen team at ChefSteps has done some work that shows that 85 Celsius gives you better color than 95 Celsius for things like asparagus. So there's some upside in there and not having to manage the stovetop simmer too carefully. That said I don't bust out the circulator for veg on a daily basis. Actually, I'm more likely to use the microwave in many cases, but besides all the ideas you mentioned some other vegetarian uses I enjoy is a kanji there's a kanji recipe. So he does the kanji in the bag also by the way beans I never got it right but beans in the bag. I don't know if I mentioned this is similar to like, how do you say flask in Italian says Have you forgotten your Italian already? Yeah, it's something like like fiasco it's something like beans all the fiasco that says you only have a fiasco or something like that. I love it because it sounds like it's a fiasco that's where you put the beans and the oil and if you're trans rate fiasco Yeah, and like the Tennessee and the rosemary and whatever in the in the bottle you put it in the oven you cook it blah good. And you had to shake the beans out of the bottle no one knows what I'm talking about here seriously? Okay, and that'll be a good application but you got to get the you got to get the water level right and the water level for being depends a lot on how old the beans are and how dry they are and what kind of pain it is which is why it's difficult recipe but anyways, Michaels got a recipe for a kanji there. I love kanji who doesn't love kanji Do you like kanji sighs Yeah. Oh, surprise, good. For sure. Toki kanji and a challenge on on the herbal ratio site, and also where Michael wants to infuse a lot of flavor as in his Sichuan cauliflower also on a voracious.com from 2013 Sichuan spicy cauliflower recipe dot HTML Okay, now let's get some questions Andrew Hunter wrote in I have a question for cooking issues about pigments you like that word pigment? Not really know. Do you don't hate it like you hate fungus? Or Spore? I have a question about I think pigment sounds gross pigment. I like pigs anyway. In wine for an event, I want to figure out a way to serve clear wine. Is there any way I could possibly remove pigments from wine without substantially altering the taste slash mouthfeel I don't know a ton about the relevant chemistry but my preliminary research on the Wikipedia suggests a lot of a lot of the same phenols a color the wine also provide wine like flavors. So I'm pretty doubtful that this is feasible, but I figured I'd ask feeling that is there a good way I could fake it flavor isolates that aren't colored plus watered down neutral spirits, the quality of final product doesn't have to be particularly great. If I essentially get to buck chuck that looks like water. By the way, you see the two Buck Chuck article. There's an article on I think it's on the Huffington Post about like how nasty I think it is on like how nasty to buck Chuck is in terms of like that there's like mice that they just scrape up everything including like mice, and like rodents and rats and whatever and bugs and spiders and just throw them all in the fermenting vats because that's how it's two bucks because they just like you know, everything gets fermented. And as and like they were like horrified by it. I'm like, yeah, that's how that that's how that rolls that's $2 wine. It's $2 wine, you've purchased wine that is $2