Hello, everybody, and welcome to a brand new series on heritage radio network called the culinary call sheet where we give a peek into the back kitchen of culinary media. I'm your host, April Jones,

and I'm your co host, Darren bresnitz. Part of why we started the show was to offer an unofficial mentorship for anyone who's interested in learning about all aspects of food and video, whether that's TV, social media online, or just something you want to do for fun.

Absolutely what was once niche or a little silly, as I'm sure you remember, Darren, when we started out, this man has now become such a massive playing field for so many creatives using food as the medium.

It's something that has driven us professionally and personally, for so many years. What excites me the most about this show is that we're going to sit down with some of the industry leaders to hear how they made it and what drew them into this industry.

With 20 years in the culinary production game ourselves. We're hoping we can give through these conversations an insider's view into personal stories from the field, as well as an in depth behind the scenes look into some of the most popular food programming. In today's evolving culinary media landscape.

We'll be covering everything from how to style your food, to how to license IP, to developing your own ideas, and some tips from the masters of how to host your own show.

Yeah, it's a little bit of conversation, how to and how do you do the things that you do in color media, which I'm so excited about? I love so many of the guests that are coming on this season. We have talent from Food Network from Vice media eater refinery 29,

we've met some of the best people in the world both in front of and behind the camera. And we're bringing them all together to share their stories, their delicious adventure and their unique journey into this crazy world.

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Today's program is brought to you by Heritage Foods USA, the nation's largest distributor of heritage breed pigs and turkeys. For more information visit heritage foods usa.com

I'm David volti. Host of the speakeasy you're listening to heritage Radio Network broadcasting live from Bushwick, Brooklyn, if you like this program, visit heritage radio network.org for 1000s more.

Hello, and welcome to cooking issues. This is Dave Arnold, your host of cooking. It's just coming to you live on the heritage radio network in reverse pizzeria in Bushwick, Brooklyn, calling all of your questions to 718-497-2128. That's 718-497-2128. Mr. Schad hammer Lopez is currently on route from Chicago at the James Beard Awards. But we're joined in studio today with Peter Kim, the President Director,

Galactic Emperor man I

told you earlier lawyer emeritus Yeah, you are actually the lawyer emeritus and the lawyer emeritus Yes, of the Museum of food and training.

Basically, you are looking for legal counsel to justify all of your nefarious actions.

Not on the air Peter. And Veronica, who's a new intern at the museum and hails originally I guess, from Brazil, but it's currently living in Miami. Yeah, it feels in here like Miami feels in this room. Like we're in Miami, bringing some sunshine to New York or more the humidity and the sulfur state. That's the other thing people don't realize I've never been to Florida is the entire place smells of sulfurous groundwater, or is that just me that believes that?

Can't blame me for it though?

Yeah. No, I don't know. Maybe. Maybe you did dump all of the entire ground with sulfurous minerals. I don't know. You know, that smell that Florida Water smell when they water the lawn so that Florida Water? Well? Yeah. Do they have on that side? The giant Palmetto bugs. First of all, is everything just built in clear Palmetto like it is over in Sarasota or is it different?

Well, I'm actually from North Miami, so I am pretty much in the clear of Palmetto bugs. Thankfully.

Nice. Yeah. But they're, they make our cockroaches look like. I know. Like, you know, like nothing like weaklings. Yeah. Although we do have the giant water bugs here in New York that are on the lower floors of our buildings only. And they don't congregate in huge packs. I call them travelers because they just kind of, you see, when you kill it, you're not worried about infestation because it came somewhere from the pipes down from the depths where the alligators grow. Also, thinking of water bugs needs covered in water right now. I biked here and joined in the engineering booth with our old pal Jack Hensley. Hey guys, how you doing? I'm pretty good. Good. So have we have a bunch of stuff to get to so I'll just get to it. Although please do call in your questions to 718-497-2128 That's 718-497-2128 Sad news to report. Most of you who are plugged into the food, internet sphere, probably already know but Josh Ozersky died yesterday. They still haven't figured out kind of, like why he died. But he was found in his hotel room. Yesterday morning, he was in Chicago actually for the the Beard Awards. He's only 47 Very sad, you know, very, very kind of larger than life figure. And I've worked with him a couple times over the years on things, so you know,

yeah, much respect. Yeah. And

he actually did a show here for for a while back in 2009. And 10. I remember that. Yeah. Mr. Cutler. Yeah. You know, I could tell some I won't maybe venture I can tell some crazy Josh stories. Like he's a creative like he was like, a larger than life. A legit kind of larger than life. Individual had a couple of same early champions, as I did, like Jeff Jeffrey Stein garden. Yeah, you know, it's just no BS. Crazy. Well, like, Well, depends on how you define it. Yeah, he's here. He's like, you know, like his writing was over the top. He was over the top. Anyway, he's definitely going to be missing the food world. So it's a sorry announcement have to make. So rather than go launching my normal stuff, why don't you talk? We have a museum benefit coming up in next week, actually, yeah,

next Wednesday. So we've got the annual mo fed spring benefit dinner coming up, and well, I'm biased, but I think this is really the most exciting dining event in New York City. We get this is actually a concept that Dave put together. And it's witnessed with hammer Lopes with the Saucier the hammer Lopez and Patrick Martin's as they've wiped the moisture off his face. But we get it. We get eight of the best chefs in the country to come together and put together a meal. But it's not just any kind of meal. We do museum themes like food of ancient Rome or space food or what else have we done day we did caveman food? It's been a while yeah, Wiley did caveman food.

Speaking of James Beard and winters TV dinner.

Yep, yep, exactly. TV dinner by Michael Anthony who just won the James Beard Award for Outstanding

chef we did ancient Rome with a whole ostrich by another. Mark Ladner

just won best chef in New York City. And congrats Mark Tosi did. Chef Christina did space food. She's just one for outstanding pastry chef. So we have a lot of big a lot of big, big people. And this one is giving a rundown who it is. Yeah. So this year, we've got a great lineup. We don't mention here. I'll kill you. Yeah, we've got Aaron blue Doran. From Kathy balloon. We've got Elizabeth Faulkner. We've got Alex going to Shelly she's gonna be doing what would Jesus eat, which I think is really one of the more exciting topics. We've got Matt's restless,

but we know what he drinks. He know he turns water into wine when the Keg is kicked at the wedding that we know.

And then I can then turn wine into pee.

Wow, we just got in trouble with a whole chunk of our listeners there. So

there you go. Anyway, and then we imagine epsilon one of the cofounders of Noma and now the he's at the helm of Acme. He's doing weeds of New York. We've got Andy Ricker, your friend, my friend, Pac Man, and he's doing rotten, rotten food. And then we've got

remember like we gave him that because like I know for a he likes doing things like fermented short ribs and stuff like this. So we gave him and the concept here while he finished he don't forget you want.

Yeah. Marcus Samuelsson and then we've got

steam again. What's his theme? Oh, yeah, he's

doing so around the turn of the 19th century, the Emperor Menelik was one of the most beloved emperors of Ethiopia, held all these giant public banquets for 10,000 or 10,000 people at a time. And so he's doing a meal that is an homage to that. Then we have Bill telepan He's taking on the story of a ancient assassinate this called Sick boss. I don't know if I'm pronouncing it correctly, but

nobody knows it's old. Yeah. That title is actually stolen from the language of food, which is a book out by a jurasky about the his history of certain like linguistic approach to linguist reason menu candidate.

And then I've got Bill Yosef, the former executive pastry chef at the White House, taking on the topic when the white house burned because in 1814, the British troops arrived the White House to burn it down, but they found bizarrely enough a meal laid out for them. That was a meal that President Madison and Dolly Madison in the first lady had abandoned in their haste to leave Of course, they save the portrait of George Washington.

And they say Americans aren't polite. We left dinner fit

exactly, exactly so they ate it they drank it and they burn the house down. Seems to

bridge it's the bridge who caused the problems that fence I'll be in Britain actually. Next week as well right after the benefit I fly out to London. I'm doing cocktail demos, etc. townhouse she is. So again, now you got in trouble with the other half. Oh, yes.

There we go. My goal is alienate pretty much everybody. Except for you. And then so anyway, so tickets, we just got a handful of tickets left and oh, yeah, booze by none other than some schmuck named Dave Arnold. Also, maybe a James Beard Award winner.

They will be James Beard award winning authors cocktails. Most precise same printer cards giving us something different as well.

We got Pernod Ricard for liquor, we're gonna we're gonna have Geoffrey Porter, the wine director at Del Posto is getting an incredible lineup of wine. We got sparkling wine and champagne. We've got an eye in the Stasi will be there. Yeah. And it's in the corner with a bottle of champagne. And then we'll have a selection of six wines available during the dinner. This is going to be essentially a pretty blowout affair at Carnegie Hall, top two floors, rooftop terrace looking over the city. Now it's expensive. Yes, it is. It is expensive. But of course, it's to support the development of the Museum of food and drink, which is itself a worthy cause. But

the first time we did this, we were incredibly stupid. We charged $250. And how much would you have to pay for that meal? If you want to go get it?

I mean, there's no price, you could pay for it. Right?

So now we're charging something that's like, you know, we're charging museums style, like benefit prices now, because we're older and wiser. But I'll tell you something. The great thing about all these will give him give you the price in a minute before now how much would you pay? But the thing is really low, low installed. Yeah. And we can do that, frankly, we could do that. We could probably do that through installments. Yeah, we could take the installment plan. Yeah, we'll take the installment right away. But anyway, but the point is, we hopefully also you also get a little like, you know, a spiel and tastes about what we're going to be doing in the museum in the upcoming year, directly from Peters mouth. But the way we structure the reason we structured the benefit this way is nine times out of 1010 times out of 10 really, unless you only go to 10 benefits here, and one of them's ours, the, you know they have a chef come in, and the chef's are, you know, maybe they get a couple of chefs. Or maybe they have big tastings. But typically the chef is doing something that is a some version of what you might be able to get at their restaurant. And we do exactly the opposite. It's actually a huge kind of challenge that our chefs take on. It's a huge commitment, which is why we're so grateful to all of the chefs that have done it over the years, the ones that are doing it this year, in fact, I mean, look to see a bunch of them, we we invite the chefs who have done it to come and just as guests and expect to see some of those heavy hitters there at the at the benefit as well. But you're gonna get stuff that they don't cook otherwise. And so you can't really ever by any of this stuff, you know, it's not something that they would ever do normally, so we're making them get out of their comfort zone.

Yeah, so one night only, I mean, like, you know, like the giant authors that marked it anyway. Now, how much would you pay? Yes, exactly. So tickets are $750 ahead. And we're trying to build a museum here. Okay, so, so 750 ahead. It is, you know, we do put a lot of love into it and tickets are available at benefit that mo fed.org I think we've only got like 10 or 11 tickets left. So definitely hop on and get it pronto if you want to go

but definitely the secret ingredient here isn't love it's money. Yes. Yes. The secret ingredient here is money. Yes, yes.

Yes, exactly. So yeah, benefit that more or

less right. And Jack is our Kickstarter still going? It is we have seven days left. All right. Do your plugs. Get all the plugs out of the way for for Giustino. Sake. Yeah. Donate. Donate, donate seven days left or this website explodes. You're gonna Are you gonna really just say Donate. Donate. Donate. Donate. Donate. Donate Sunday. Yeah, like that. That's just baiting you. All right. All right, here we go. Anyway. Yeah. How close are we jack? We're about $7,000 away. So you made half the money from last week? Right? And we have seven more days. Yes, people please. People please. People come on please. Do you want to be able to have a website so that like the stuff that you call in to 718172128 actually gets put on a website that works and has new and interesting content? I don't know do you do this the jacks puppy dog guys. Jackie molecules is crying some sweet sweet h2o out of his out of his two dogs and you're

crying some sweet sweet A's to have your for

like enough with like I biked here Enough. Enough. All right. Today is Cinco de Mayo and in honor yesterday, for those of you that listen to this or like follow the tweet when I was in Mexico. A couple of weeks ago, I bought a next thematic grinder which allows me to make masa well, better than a Corona which I detest. And better than the Cuisinart which I'd test for this application better than actually you made the ride nixtamal me what a pain in the bucket was a pain in the bleep. Yeah, that tasted good.

Yeah. Outstanding. Yeah. Liquid in the trash at the end of the day.

People are the worst usually about people people. They're the worst. Not you, dear listener, that everybody else that one next to you is not listening. He's the worst. Yeah, the worst. Or her? Maybe Maybe she's the worst. I don't know. I don't know who's sitting next to you. Yeah, yeah. Anyways, so the issue here is a it's hard to get some really interesting corn. So I observed a lot of tortillas not a lot but as many as I could while I was working tortillas being made in Mexico came up with my grinder. You know totally, you know, somehow packed it into my bag. Got it under the weight limit. You ever do that trick when you put in your bag on the on the scale or put on the edge and you lift a little bit? Yes. But the other hand, you hold it down, you lift a little bit

do it on the edge or put my knee up against it. Yeah,

what's up? slickster? You stay with me? Yeah. Because you know what? They don't know how much they weigh me. They don't know how much I weighed. They don't have a weight limit on me when you put a weight limit on my bag. It's they're they're jerks. I'm buying a grinder. Yeah. You know what I mean? The other trick is like normally when I bring something that's a billion pounds, I'll just put it in my I've trained myself over the years to look like I'm carrying a normal weight backpack when I'm in fact carrying like a backpack full of lead bricks. You don't I mean? And so if you can, if you look like you're like, when you're going through the line, they're like, Nah, man, we gotta weigh that. But if you just look like you're carrying a bag, you can collapse as soon as you get through security. But like, it just has performs Yeah, terrible. He's purple. You know, his face is white as the driven snow and his arms are purple. This is absolutely normal. Like you know, you know he had a body transplant for grimace or something. But but you know, that being as it may. The point is, is that you couldn't carry different countries have different rules about what's kosher, so I probably could have gotten the grinder through American TSA even though I couldn't get the powder syrup because they're usually okay with electric motors. As long as it can't be interpreted as a weapon. But I've had electric motors be problems in Colombia and no one could tell me with a straight kind of story what the Mexican rules were going to be setting my chances I had to check it anyways. Anyways, anyways, okay, so Sigmund Am I come back I want to get the good corn. I was talking last week at the the other beards, the one that was here with Rick Bayless, and he's like, Well, where should I get the where should I get the good corn from? He's like, you idiot. Go to go to Montana. I was like, Duh, because I know them. Why wasn't I thinking so I went in fact, yesterday. I did a fast maximization people so it's not the best but expect more to come I did met up with Jorge Garcia from Massey ENDA, who gave me some of the most awesome kind of corns I was tasting and drives really interesting corn so the one I did yesterday was a white believe that from Bucha con which was just had an incredible kind of corn kind of almost like a almost like a movie theater of corn taste right out of the dry uncooked Whoa. Yeah, so Nixon was yesterday so now my game needs I need to get my next My next thematic kind of tuned in more needs to be broken in need another couple of pounds of masa and I need to get my tortilla press in order man I have that Victoria the regular Victoria tortilla press and shift week everyone says it's great, but I look at it and there's too much slop in the freaking hinge. Right. So like, it pinches it in an angle. So the tortillas a they're too thick on the ones even if I double flip them, I have to quadruple fique freakin flip them to get them the way I want. And then I'm always over pressing the one side it's closest to the frickin handle. Why don't they just machine the thing with the right freaking thickness for what I want? So I'm gonna have to build some spacers where else get a better press? Because the lady who liked it the best that I saw in Mexico, man, I didn't see any of the sweet sweet old out, you know, Abuelita is doing with it. Yeah, that's what handpan that's awesome. It's crazy. But like, these guys weren't using the little Victoria like hand press that I was using. They were using two sheets of giant cold rolled steel with it with a big pipe on it. And there was like the bat bat bat and they were like totally even throughout. So I'm gonna more on that later. Over the next few weeks. I'll talk about when to get put in honor of the Cinco Demayo I brought in some treats from Mexico for us. Yeah, so I have I don't know if I've talked about these before, but these are from Puebla, these are commodities you know, these know. So apparently, these, these nuns under the Santa Clara, Santa Clara or something like this, these mounds use this like this, like fancy sweet potato that grows around Puebla, and it's only made in Puebla. They call it commodities and they make these sweets with flavors in them. So when we look at their different flavors, you can read semi Spanish, so you can tell me and then Jack, you can have some of these and then also I brought in my favorite Mexican confection masa. Oh, nice. marzipan is like their take on marzipan, but it's actually it's just made with peanuts and it has a texture of how this is what Hava which was it would be sorry, all of the grease in the Middle East. This is what Hava wishes it could be for those of you that aren't allergic to the peanut that you learn to the peanut not allergic to the peanut and have some peanut Jack peanut peanut product. Love it. Yeah, here have one come take one cooking issues recorded in a studio that may contain nuts. Okay. Now let's get to some questions. You like that? Right? You try that? You try it? You guys are so so I would have finished the whole box by now. Thanks, Dave.

I know man, you do do Hungry Hungry Hippos. But, you know, I like to say everything's chino. What? Jerk. It's called mindfulness. Dave it's a new thing.

With flavor. Yogananda Come on, come on. LMR Well,

we had to do the smarmy accent is that? I just wanted

me that's just my normal voice man. Like, why we were like about to dry out on the outside but the inside has like a kind of an awesome kind of a texture. They're only made in Puebla, baby. Why don't we take over A quick break now all right we'll come right back with some actual questions on cooking issues.

We're back and we are back and we don't have to do a commercial because we're brought to us by us. Yeah, that's that that is it because nobody loves us enough to support us anymore. Syllabus. We're just switching it

up cooking with us. It's supported by absolutely nobody.

Yeah. Let me ask you a question though. I was wondering the other day who's the largest supplier of parentage and Rare Breed meats? I think it starts with H. G. I don't know. I can't place it. I can't place it.

On my tongue man. Yeah,

no, no, no. I am Patrick Martens. Alright, Peter, do your Patrick Martin.

Man. You can't do that. I can't do I don't know what you're talking about. You're the one who has a good imprint.

You're liar. usa.com That's heritage foods. usa.com. I see because he's because because Patrick would get mad. He's probably calling and saying what are you doing? He's too busy selling selling meat right now selling heritage meats, right. Sam Geiger wrote in a while back with cold packs. Squirrel. That's right. cold pack squirrel wants to know. Hey, can you discuss the best way to cook squirrel? That have been cold pack Ken. Thanks, Sam. Guide Sam. I hate to break this to you, buddy. It's cold pack can suckers already cooked? Yeah, you don't need to cook it again. But I think I was reading actually a lot on squirrel the success of squirrel meat canning and I've never done it. I knew a guy in I swear to God, I knew a guy in North Carolina who used to pay his landscaping crew in squirrel. You know what I'm saying? Because I've only had squirrel and mixed in with stews in North Carolina. So when you're making a squirrel that way, there's really no way for me to tell you I know what squirrel tastes like. It's like when someone gives you little tidbits of alligator that are been coated in like a half inch of batter and fried within an inch of its life. Right. Right. So what does that taste like? Taste like fry? Right? Exactly. And it's pretty surely yeah, I've had bigger pieces of alligator and it's kinda like, like, like, it needs to be really fresh. I had like previously frozen refrozen like kept in somebody's like swamp cooler alligator. And in big sharks, you don't want that

is it like snake for somebody that I imagined being like snake. I've only had

snake in small chunks with a taste like fry. I've never had like a whole grilled snake. Oh, I'm sure it's good ol snake. Nobody's gonna be fresh right there. I'm sure it's a delicate meat that is abused too much by freezing and refreezing. That's the only large chunk Alligators have ever cooked tasted have been cooked that way. So And similarly with squirrel. I'm gonna go ahead and say that I've never I've never had it in such a way that I know. I could say this is what squirrel tastes like. My guess is it tastes like rabbit I hear that how squirrel tastes is vitally dependent on how it was skinned whether all the glands have been taken out of the squirrel. That said I mean me I'm sure it's like, I'm sure it's like rabbit so if you use it any way you would use like a canned kind of a rabbit and he kind of a white meat strangely all the colpack canning. They can in in kind of liquids not in fat because I think they're worried about the fat thing because I think it'd be good to have it like React I would want like put some pork fat up in that piece and make it react style right when that'd be delicious. If anyone out there has made a start to the hammer Lopez's here and move my bag please. And my helmet please. I would love to have some squirrel react. You

know what I call that squirrel yet?

All right. Well, I don't know you're a good one. It's not a Piper level pun, but it's okay. Welcome back to the land of New York. Well, you're wearing like something very tropical considering you're just in. You were in Chicago, not Hawaii. Do you think you were going to Hawaii? No, I

bought the day when we were late. After moving remember?

No, but Oh, yay, yay. We're in the process of moving Booker and DAX lab, by the way, up to Connecticut. So do you have any we talked about Mark, we talked about who else do we mentioned? Christina Tosi?

Right, Mike Anthony,

right. Anyone else? We know anyone else? Winners, friends of their friends of the program.

Oh, wait while you got inducted? Oh, yeah. He

didn't win. He was it was a slam dunk. That's just like a lifetime achievement. It's

still it's an accolade. But I mean, it was like, America's best bacon is an award. No, no, it's like an America's. If it wasn't the salmon restaurant?

What? Depends what you're using it for right Benton's bacon, as a culinary bacon. Say members isn't eating bacon. Okay, fair enough. And you said What were you saying Ben was when he forced us?

No, it was like the America. He knew he was winning. It was like a wily kind of a word.

Yeah. You know what? I whatever. The only time I ever won something like that. They didn't tell me ahead of time.

No, the worst part of this award was this program. So in Mark's speech, he thinks sobriety at the end, right? Hold on, and then all these other chefs. Were like, oh, man, I don't think I'm gonna drink tonight, man. It's you know, and I was like, I can't take a bottle of champagne and a straw now because

well, it wasn't really a party atmosphere anyway, with Josh and everything right? Or was it? Not everyone knew. I've been in situations like that where people are trying to have a festive thing. And something really awful has just happened. And some of the people know and it's very tested at

a moment of silence. So for tomorrow,

because they knew that ahead of us from Chicago. Yah. Yah, yah. Yah, bad year for food all the way around SHA two from egullet was this year, right.

I don't know who that is. Yeah. Well,

good for paying attention to the world. He went on after EAGALA to be one of the founders of quirky.

Oh, the air conditioning company. They are not an air conditioning company. That's just you know what I mean?

Yes. Okay, next question in from Trudy said, Hey, Dave. Oh, yeah, Mr. Mustache. I gave her a whole packet.

I have a whole.

She's done with the sweet potatoes done with it. Hi, Dave, Natasha, and Jack and now also Peter and Veronica. This is Veronica. By the way, Anastasia. She works with me. Hi. Hi. I have a high look as is a good word. I have a hydrocolloid conundrum. I like conundrums. They're good. I've been trying to invent slash create a frozen mousse pudding concoction, a frozen mousse pudding concoction, right? Say that would you say that with your most snoot totally mouthfeel problem all right.

Well, Bella, also need to put my monocle

on do that properly. You don't have your planners peanut monocle. And a lot of times I usually pack it but monocle packing. All right, playing around with a combo of ag RS Xanthan polydextrose psyllium which I've never used. I mean, I know what it is. And flax basically everything I have on hand. I haven't been like that's like a juice bar stuff right? You're down to psyllium right? You

pay no, no, no, I don't pay attention. You just you're the one that tells me all the juice. Yeah, I know all that. Yeah, but I don't know.

What about you? Are you Veronica you do strand person you choose person.

I'm in desert person.

Thank goodness desert desert. God bless desert. You know that a lot of places now are toning down on deserts because their margins aren't as high they'd rather flip the tables. deserts have hired because they ingredients in desserts usually have you read that article? There's a bunch of articles on this. I didn't

but that's just because I'm not their customer. If I was there, I would I would order enough desserts to make their margins pretty

high. Yeah, well, it'll be like just like chocolate and cream and stuff. It's just expensive stuff. You know what I mean? A lot more expensive than mashed taters. taters is cheap.

I don't know what's prompted that right?

Well, I can walk into like try to make like whatever I'm just saying like you know, this is why this is why that's like one of the most ubiquitous sides is because it's free yeah rice potatoes beans all you know fundamentally free I haven't had much luck though since it always comes out slimy What's your is a you hate things that are slimy styles right? Okra? Oh my God does

that okay that we wish no it wasn't okay that slimy

oh my god that yam that Japanese slime. Yeah, what's it called? Oh, Total Row. Isn't start with an M N.

Tiki yam that's a great ID and then it's yeah, it's so another

the whole one is called like now nine. Oh my god. We had the most like HR unfriendly moment and the French culinary where someone had peeled the entire it's like a two foot long phallus There you go. And and you peel it and it just self slimes like it's made out of personal lubricant

to do something After

the star, she she squeezed it and shouted across the room and he just shouted against the wall. It was like, oh, everyone's like, Oh, like that. That's pretty much how it went. Yeah, see you guys next week. Yeah, anyway, haven't been having much left though, since it always comes out slightly. So this is the problem with the show. This is why, like we like aren't nominated these Yeah, because like, I'd say the word slimy. And then for like three minutes, we're talking about yams. I got a mental issue. I'm trying to reduce the Xanthan as much as I can, since I think this might be the problem what it is xanthan gum slimy. It's not really slimy. It's snotty, like Xanthan is like snot. And also like, even in like relatively small concentrations, remember Xanthine suppose we use very small concentrations and relatively small concentrations. It has that like, jiggly that jiggly. Like you know, where like, you twist like a container of it and the outside starts rotating but the center stays still for a minute and then it like like it like has that back motion that like shoulder flick back motion to it. It smokes. It

brings all the boys to the yard. And and it's

not better than yours, which is weird. I come to the yard and they're still like, no, I'll keep I'll keep. I'll keep the other milkshake that I already have. Anyways, I think this and that might be the problem, but I can only reduce it so far before there's no more thickening effect. See, here's the thing you shouldn't really use Xanthan as a thickener you should use Xanthan as a as a stabilizer, right? Not an emulsifier but a stabilizer. While I finished reading your thing before I get sick, I had this terrible habit of just going off into tangents. It's I can't get rid of him. Sorry. Don't say this is why you know they had me write a book because they're you're forced to follow some sort of linear thing if you go to tangents at least like they you put them in footnotes or something you want. I mean, whatever. I also have Aguilar, I got a god, but I'm not sure how to throw that into the mix. I have yet to use any eggs. Since I'm trying to keep it vegan vegan face. What stars you just you know, I was so happy you made it here but then you disappointed with the last vegan face. You know, I mean? Want to keep it vegan, if doable. I know this post problem lacks specifics, but I just want to learn more about what gums will help and which won't since I'm really fascinated by hydrocarbons in general. I've also been wondering about guar gum. Is this redundant? If I already have Xanthan? No, it is not. thing with guar is soy guar is very closely related to locust bean gum, but guar used to be cheaper now that fracking is there. It's not bad. Guar has a very specific beanie taste and it tastes like like not check. Black eyed pea flour you ever had black eyed pea flour. Anyway, there are certain like African dumplings made with black eyed pea flour. And so I used to have black eyed pea flour around and it tastes like ground dried Black Eyed Peas. Right? Which is okay, if that's what you want. But not if you have a distinctive flavor. Yeah, which is unpleasant and ice cream, let's say. So you have to get a higher more purified form of guar called flavor free Glar. And you can get that from a couple places. The one I use is from tea ice gums flavor free guarentee with 1000 or 4000 or someone's been a long time so they've had to buy it because it lasts a long time. konjac I haven't used a lot of contract contract a lot of people use it. I haven't used it a lot, which has got a small amount of I have yet to death Joanne methylcellulose CMC gum arabic and Lucas being gone will any of these help? So these are like a long list of different hydrocarbons. Each has their application here. Which would you prioritize in terms of usefulness in the kitchen? I can't afford all of them. And so I'm looking to equip myself with the best swiss army knife. Okay, first hydrocolloid that I've learned to use 100% inside outside upside down is Aguilar, why? Because it's super friendly. You can buy it anywhere. And it can do a lot and so for for your situation. You could either do a light set Aguilar, right so you could whip it into a into a moose with a light set Aguilar and then let it set right and we'll set it'll gel in that moose form, use a small amount of Adguard you can get a really nice texture like 2% I say 0.2% two grams in a two grams per liter of Aguilar will give you a nice like very easy to break gel that will just hold that gel there. Well it's been foamed up after it sets in sets that are relatively gel and probably even better for that. And you could use roughly the same amount because gel and sets faster than Nygaard does, but both of them will work. Ag are not freeze thaw stable, which is good. Why? Because when it melts in your mouth, right, the structure of the Ag bar will be obliterated because it's not freeze thaw stable. So that's good, but then things like guar can stop when it's frozen. There's still liquids in there, because you haven't fully frozen it because if you did, it'd be hard like a rock which is not. So it's things like guar will act as a kind of stabilizer to stop the liquids and solids from separating From the cells, Xanthan will act as also in a similar way to the light egg or would act as a kind of thin gelling agent don't use enough Xanthan for it to actually be a thickener use it like very low percentage is like a quarter of a percent like two and a half grams per liter something like there just to add a little bit of extra setback a yield point to the to the thing. What I recommend is this. Go on I don't agree with everything he says, obviously, but go on Martin leashes website which is kind most download the latest version of his hydrocolloid thing and then just flip through zillions of his of the recipes that he grabs from all over the internet. And all people kind of get a feel for what you like, try one or two them, see what you think. I definitely don't agree with all of that with all of it by any standard, but go check that out. And obviously check out there's huge custard and putting sections in the Modernist Cuisine. And if you don't own it, you know, there are still some reasons for the local library. Do you know that? Yeah, you can, for instance, if you don't all Modernist Cuisine, you can go there. And look at it, right. Yeah, although I've got a patient caller on the line patient caller, you're on the air.

Calling from Los Angeles. Hey, I have a question about

pina coladas. Oh, nice. Pina Coladas. All right. What do you got? Oh, yeah.

Coco Lopez, right. Yep. And if I don't want to use that, let's say I want to like try and make my own at home or add something to like coconut cream. I'm wondering what I could add, like, should I just kind of add chemicals on the back of the container, or is there anything you'd recommend?

Yeah, so by the way, for a while, we thought we'd start calling the Stasi Coco Lopez, but she didn't like it. So we stopped. But the I'd have to pick that one up. Yeah. So Okay, the first thing you need, obviously, is you're going to need a very fatty like coconut milk product very fatty. And you're also going to need so you want to think a lot of sugar. And you're going to need a stabilizer now, coconut fats in drinks are have for me been notoriously difficult to stabilize fully. Using like the normal stuff that I normally use, which would be like mixtures of gum arabic and Xanthan. I haven't looked at the back of cans of coconut cream in a long time. So I'm not sure what do they use? Do you have one on you? Do you know what what they use?

So there's coconut sugar water polysorbate 60s over 10 mono is federate propylene glycol, alginate, mono and diglycerides emulsifiers citric acid guar gum, locust bean gum.

That is quite a list. Wow. That's, that's hardcore. Well, and the reason it's Hardcore is because coconut fats are difficult to stabilize in low tech, especially in low temperature drink applications. I don't think you need to go that hardcore, because they don't need to stay emulsified that long. I would. So obviously, they're adding an emulsifier. And also a several stabilizer several emulsifiers and several stabilizers. You could try using what I use, which is just a mixture of gum arabic, and mostly gum arabic, which we're using as an emulsifier and Xanthan, but it's not going to stabilize fully. How long does it need to stay there?

Just for like 20 minutes or like a time?

Yeah, I'm gonna have to. So of that list. Some of them need to be cooked and some of them don't. Right. And so presumably, if you're going to go through all the trouble, you don't want to cook the hell out of it. Because you want to have a fresh kind of a flavor, right? Yeah, I would guess. So. It's like, huh, it's a tough problem. We had a coconut I'll tell you what, at the bar, we finally came up with a recipe for a stabilized coconut like or shot that we used. I'll figure out exactly the ratios I use. Jack, can you remind me to talk about it on the next program? And I'll just give you the recipe the next week on the air. Is that sound good? Yeah. We still haven't got anywhere. Alright, cool. So we'll get that recipe for you. And I'll either tweet it on cooking issues or we'll put it out in the air next week. Alrighty. Okay, so the other question we had from Trudy was regarding fish bloodlines. I don't have a problem with the taste of the fish bloodline, since I actually liked the fishes but I was wondering what this part of the fish is actually composed of. Is it basically proteins and water? That's what jellified pig's blood consists of when I used to eat at Chinese restaurants. Why do you no longer eat it? Why do you have a different Chinese restaurant? What do you what are your thoughts on the people like Pete Peter I like blood. Yeah, yeah. You'd like me to pick blood? Yeah. Yeah. All right. I don't.

I've never had also big fan of Buddha Noir.

Yeah, it's totally different though. Yeah, totally different. You know what? I like it when it's got enough. I don't like it when it's so freakin rich. I like it when it's got like enough stuff in it that it's not like so rich. Like when you're just eating like a block of just, like bet with a bow with the least amount of stuff. Blush is too much for

me. Yeah. So actually, there's, I think it's Hungarian. They make the version of the blood sausage with rice in it, right? It just helps us sort of cut it and make it nice, rich.

Yeah, yeah, it sounds good. But about Miami got a lot of blood sausage down there in Miami.

I don't know if we do but I definitely have an ad it can't speak for my people.

Now the north, the North Miami and North Milan. And she's from Miami, by the way.

I have a friend from somewhere.

Strong, strong words that starts trying to be nice people. Oh, yeah. Okay, is there anything in it? That is bad for my dad who has heart heart health issues? Okay. Let me get to it. So what you should do is, I will just read this to you that you can find it. It's called fish and seafood composition and nutritional aspects. But in the document seafood product teachers Resource Guide by Jacqueline Wheeler. It's available as a PDF on the University of Rhode Island's website. And by the way, when we're talking about we're talking bloodline, I'm assuming we're talking the same thing. We're not actually talking about blood. So when you're talking about clearing the actual blood out of a fish you're talking about oh my god, by the way, don't forget if I have time shed shed season. Does anyone out there does anyone out there know how to bone a shed? There's an old there's an let me finish this is crickets crickets guys hear you're the worst. You know, I love you in the way that you're the worst. Anyway, so I'm going to read just read you this page, Trudy fish muscle, we're talking about the muscle that's along the outside of the fish. And that's basically kind of a fat storage mechanism for fish, especially ones that swim hearts. So white fish fish, they have less of that bloodline along the side of them tend to store almost all of their fat in their liver. Whereas fish to have a larger what they call bloodline aside tend to store a lot of stuff there. So it's different compositions, not actually blood. But so and so here I will quote from a quote from section seven a dark muscle and white muscle. Fish muscle does not have a uniform color. This is my reading voice. Yeah. Some muscles are white, while others have a reddish or brown color. This dark color is usually observed just under the skin, the proportion of dark to white muscle differs continuously from head to tail. The portion also varies between species increasing with the swimming activity of the fish and sometimes approaching 48% of the body weight. There are often differences in the chemical composition of dark and white muscles with respect to protein and lipid contents. The dark muscle has greater concentrations of hemoglobin and myoglobin than the white muscle. The presence of dark muscle is related to the activity of the fish. Those fish that swim continuously throughout their lives usually have a larger proportion of dark muscle than those who often rest on the sea bottom. It appears that white muscle controls short spurts and darting movements while dark muscle is used for slow continuous movement. When freezing fish that dark muscle is sometimes removed in order to prolong the storage life of the fish. The dark muscle spoils faster because it contains human compounds, which can act as Pro oxidants. It has been observed that dark muscle oxidizes 100 times faster than white muscle. Therefore, consumers should be careful not to store dark muscle fish for long periods since adverse flavor changes may occur due to oxidation.