Hello, everybody, and welcome to a brand new series on heritage radio network called the culinary call sheet where we give a peek into the back kitchen of culinary media. I'm your host, April Jones,

and I'm your co host, Darren bresnitz. Part of why we started the show was to offer an unofficial mentorship for anyone who's interested in learning about all aspects of food and video, whether that's TV, social media online, or just something you want to do for fun.

Absolutely what was once niche or a little silly, as I'm sure you remember, Darren, when we started out, this man has now become such a massive playing field for so many creatives using food as the medium.

It's something that has driven us professionally and personally, for so many years. What excites me the most about this show is that we're going to sit down with some of the industry leaders to hear how they made it and what drew them into this industry.

With 20 years in the culinary production game ourselves. We're hoping we can give through these conversations an insider's view into personal stories from the field, as well as an in depth behind the scenes look into some of the most popular food programming. In today's evolving culinary media landscape.

We'll be covering everything from how to style your food, to how to license IP, to developing your own ideas, and some tips from the masters of how to host your own show.

Yeah, it's a little bit of conversation, how to and how do you do the things that you do in color media, which I'm so excited about? I love so many of the guests that are coming on this season. We have talent from Food Network from Vice media eater refinery 29,

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Hello, and welcome to cookie users. This is Dave Arnold your host of cookies just coming to you live from number two pizzeria Bushwick Brooklyn on the heritage Radio Network every Tuesday from 12 to around one or so. Here in the studio as usual witness Tasha hammer Lopez I do is does good are you doing all right I'm multi computer today I've got my iPad and my iPhone in one hand and my computer and the other because a little bit of a Research Quarterly you this morning. Which quarterly you is my son Booker's term for anything that's a Cluster B because it a chordal you named after the I don't think it's after the famous surveyor or the politician who was related to the surveyor but I think it's after the actual stop on the subway. Yeah, but it's one of those few words that says Now you You and I both use quarterly you to mean professional email. Yeah, to mean cluster. You know what, and nobody ever. Questions. No, no questions. So it must be one of those. Like, it's not that it's not amount of PA that's not exactly right. But it's like a vocab word. They

think they didn't study for a test, right? They're like, Oh, what's something I don't know? Right? But

if so accurately describes, you know, like, complete Cluster B that you know that it's like, ah, Corleone, so you know what I mean? Because it sounds like it's all tied up and messed up. You know what I mean? Like trying to spread it Cortelyou quarterly, you want people to use it. So use it, use it, use it, use it and you know, when you do think of Booker, his birthday today say that and DAX DAX and birthday, Dax and Booker's birthday today Booker and DAX three years separated same birthday because I'm just that efficient. No, it's or I should say my wife I guess is that efficient? She's like, we're having babies. Exactly one day and that's it. Now that day Yeah. Both both born same day three years apart. Fun, fun times. And like they get in arguments about like, I'm going to have the birthday party separate this year am I not doing well it turns out that we're not going to have their birthday parties together but now they are again, but that I used to have I used to every year I don't have my my amazing pizza oven although I could probably still you know fix my new oven in time to do pizza but for every year it's been make your own pizzas but you know I've had the 850 degree Fahrenheit pizza oven. I can match there's still a couple days left I can modify you know the but to like I want I want crappy come Marshall mind when I say my kids like crappy commercial pizza, I'm not referring to like other fine pizza makers like, for instance, the folks that Roberta's who make a delicious fine pizza that I'd be proud to have at a birthday party that my kids were. I mean, they like the lowest of the low. I'm not going to call any particular people out as making a low quality pizza. But whatever it's pressing, they're like, I prefer low quality pizza.

But how do they have that low quality pizza?

They've got to first I don't know how to. We live near. We live live near a major national channel a chain of low quality pizza purveyors. And I don't know they somehow they saw it and I got hooked on Who knows how the hell hit kids get hooked into things, you know what I mean? But now they would actually prefer it. And I mean, I'm not tooting my own horn. I'm not saying I make the best pizza in the world. But it's a whole hell of a lot better than this crap that they request, you know, it's got this commercial pizza, the crust is always terrible. Sauce is always

wastefully go now says they have better ingredients.

Now you're getting a chance that you're getting a little hook into what they what they like if their ingredients are better. That begs the question better than what what was it? Yeah. What was it before? Like, if this is your better ingredient? Like if this is like is it like, you know, this is your you know, the top of your line there? You know, like what do you do? You know what, I'm not even gonna get into that and I was caught your questions 271849721 to eight at 718-497-2128 joined in the engineering booth. We have both of you guys over there. Now we have Jack and Evan, we have

Jack and Evan. Yeah. Hi, guys. Happy New Year. Dave.

Happy Happy New Year. Yeah. Well, I forgot we called you out about New Year's last time on the last show. I forget what star said something kind of. We know the star show now. Whatever. Yeah. Now, how are you liking the Manhattan? It's awesome. Everyone who lives in Brooklyn is like yeah, I love it here in Brooklyn until they move to Manhattan or like, Oh, yeah.

Where are you? Exactly? Not exactly.

I'm not giving the exact address here. But like, right on First Street. Actually Second Street first,

have you Right, right. Still Still near that near? The l can't give up on the L Right.

Close enough? No, because that'd be the 14th.

He's first and welcome to 14. I mean, I walked here from 29th Whatever today. Not that anybody cares. Okay, we got some questions in from last week that I didn't get a chance to take care of. So let's take care of some of them first. John writes in Hey, Dave, hammer and crew. Slowly but surely making my way through the back episodes, which make the subway rides go by pretty quickly. Although I do get strange looks when I burst out laughing from something you said. While I appreciate the hopefully it was actually intended to be funny and not like the semi serious things I occasionally say, just became a heritage radio donor to keep the great program. Hey, thank you. I have two quick questions. In a previous podcast, you entered the show talking about sand bitter, and alluded to a recipe to reproduce it. But of course ran out of time. We'd love to know your thoughts on how to reproduce that. Well, of course. You know, the cooking issues crew loves anything, Campari or Apple related. And sand bitter is the small edits made by Pellegrino. Right, Senator? I'm not sure I think so. It sounds right. But it's read like Campari, it has the same basic kind of flavor compliment. No, it's not the same. Please don't send me any nasty things in, but it's got the same thing. So the question is, then, how to make that flavor yourself. And so, you know, I didn't have an actual recipe recipe, just an idea for it. But we tested out some, some ideas yesterday. So Campari and therefore also sand bitter, that bitterness is mainly from Wormwood, right? I mean, the weren't the like, if you if you were to just taste a straight decoction of wormwood. You would notice that the, the bitterness of it, that particular bitterness note is the bitterness note from the end of Kumari. Right? So, so there you have it. There's also I think, some gentian in it, which is another bittering agent. And, of course, the citrus peels. Now, I believe Campari and Sam better use a use a a bitter orange peel like a Keynote or something like that, which I didn't have available to me when I was testing. Now, of course, there's also all sorts of other flavors that they layer on top is top notes, but the base notes are the citrus peels, the wormwood and possibly I think gentian we added it to the recipe we tested. So now without alcohol, how do you do it? The best way is a heat sleep now I can get into more kind of technical stuff, trying out the ISI infusions, whatnot. But I figured for our first guests, let's try to do just a straight old fashioned heated teas, right? And you can heat it fairly, you're not going to maybe you're going to affect the aromatic somewhat as opposed to a long steep but doing it in water. figured it'd be a good first approximation. So we did five grams of each of those three. Each of those four flavors grapefruit peel, orange peel sweet oranges from the US they we didn't have the good stuff. We got to what's called the dual specialty shop which is similar to Colossians here in New York, Wormwood, F and gentian all at five grams per 200 mils, we nuke them in the microwave so they wouldn't get too much boil off and then let them steep under mild agitation for five minutes and then we made mixtures of those together and we use 100 mils of the grapefruit 100 mils of the orange 15 mils of the warm wood decoction five mils of the gentian to that we added 20 grams of sugar to take it to about a 10 and a half bricks solution and a pinch of salt to round it out chilled it and carbonated it now it's it's a it's a it's a gold in a brown it's a beach a gold in a brown what commercial use they used to say golden brown all the time. But in my head since I was a little kid like I can't say golden brown. I have to say a golden brown but the Sona remind me what commercial that was. But so that tasted pretty much like sand bitter now what it like Campari Kumari when they make it comes out light brown. So you know, they color it with color, they used to use coccinea like squished up bugs stuff, but they don't use the squished up bug stuff anymore. So then we tried Though, interestingly, I feel felt that it needed more grapefruit than that, and more and more orange than that. So we tried just doing a straight bass of 220 grams water 20 grams sugar point, one point point one to five grams of genuine point 375 grams of warm wood 3.75 grams of orange and five grams of grapefruit peel for you know, five minutes deep aroma heat tea and it was good but it didn't taste quite as much like sand bitter as the other one we needed. It was probably a little too much grapefruit and then needed a little more warmth more than that, but just so you know, that's what we tried out and so John, you can give that a test for your SAN bitter alternative and of course like I said, you can add the top notes and stuff but that's pretty much the base. I think even stars actually been there because she was she was not there and we tested and she was at the Stanford what is it

called? Stanford alumni. Women, New York network board. Say that again? Yeah. Stanford women network New York Board meeting young young No, not young not young. Not Yeah, well they think they're old but

well and so they had a what what they call it board meeting, but I was like also a mixer right?

Yeah mixer with with icebreakers

icebreaker that's what they call an icebreaker and what did they serve for their icebreaker? Ice water? Whoa, whoa, starts Yeah. Just as if you're gonna be on the board. And you're gonna have something a year have an ice breaker. You know, ice water does not an ice breaker make you got to take that thing over. You got it? You got to take that thing over. All right. Second question John had in regards to spice stores for home use what is your current system I have been using four or six ounce round paint or cream jars, jars jerrells. From pearl paint and storing them in a drawer which serves a dual purpose of keeping out light and away from heat. However, I'm running out of drawer space and now looking for more options. Hope all's well, John. So the problem with spice storage is a lot of times it's good to keep it away from light some some spices are light sensitive. For me the big problem is you need to see what's where spices are like I have a bunch of stuff and then you end up not using the spices you have because you don't know where they are in my old kitchen, which I just left I had a bunch of knife magnets that I mounted under my cabinet in a strip like I had like six feet of or five feet of knife magnets. And then I bought jars with metal tops and just smack them up so you can have a line of spices in I haven't done that my new kitchen yet we're still figuring out exactly how right now I'm not so happy with my spice storage I have a very narrow shelf pantry on one side with foreign shelves that go all the way up and it's nowhere near a window so I don't worry about light and I'm going to have spices there but the problem is it's not dense enough the shelves are bottle height right now and I need to make them shorter so I can go but I usually put them into small small containers as small as they will will go unless it's something that I use a lot of at a time like coriander if they do a lot of infusions of coriander and those things that keep in court containers. But I don't have as good a solution as I had in my old kitchen yet with the knife knife. Might you know what I'm talking about with a magnetic knife? Right? They make fantastic spice storage things. People used to come and be like where'd you get that? I'm like it's a knife rack. You jerk you jerk. I didn't say that because why would I say that? It's not they're not jerks just because they didn't hide it. Right. Matt Makari wrote in because I don't think I answered this about gelatin did i i

think you did. Today you can get over I think if I

answered it we'll figure it out over the break whether answered about free stone gelatin. And if I did, then, you know, whatever. Matt anacron wrote in about clarifying lime juice. I watched a couple of videos on the web where he talked about clarifying lime juice, you mentioned that pectin X Ultra SPL doesn't work because the pH is too low. My question is, could you raise the PH enough for it to work without significantly impacting the flavour, maybe using sodium citrate or something like that? Is that a dumb idea? I'd like to, there are no dumb ideas, just dumb people. I'd like to be able to clarify lime juice without a centrifuge, and I'm not very good at massaging the bag. Well, not very many people, Matt are very good at massaging the bag a good way actually around massaging the bag, if you don't mind doing the Ag bar, but don't aren't good at getting a good yield out of it is use a salad spinner and that's what I teach a lot of people to do is is you have to make sure that whatever you're draining cloth is that you tie off at the top into like a Santas Christmas sack or use like a squirrel or like a note bag or something like that and tie it off and stuff like that Natasha gets an image note bag, nut milk bag, tight off the top, throw into a salad spinner and give it a good spin. And that's a good way to ensure that you don't fall over squeeze a bag when you're trying to do quick agri clarification. Now if you I wouldn't try raising the pH on it. I don't think you're gonna have satisfactory results. If you don't mind losing a lot of product. It also depends on how clear you need it if you just need it to be clear, because you're carbonating and you don't need to be crystal clear. Here. Here's how it works. So my normal centrifuge technique is I add pectin X Ultra SPL even though it doesn't work 100% It does help in clarifying lime juice, which is you know, very acidic, I add pectin X Ultra SPL and Kiesel Sol right so Kiesel Sol is a wine finding agent and they call it D ones part of a tooth two part system right so you add the SPL and the key sauce all together you can get it any homebrew shop Kiesel Sol and Titus and together so I add two grams per liter you don't want to add more and you don't want to add less. When you're working with charged things like that if you're way over away under you can you can reduce the efficacy or even like make it anti effective you can stabilize things if you add too much. So you want to add two grams per liter of that. You want to stir it thoroughly Wait 15 minutes, and then you want to add two grams of courtesan which is from shrimp shells it's polysaccharide a solution to that same thing and stir it now if you let that settle, that will will clarify it will settle out it will still be slightly cloudy, slightly cloudy. If you then add and he let it sit for an hour or two it will settle out and be slightly cloudy. If you add after another 15 minutes after you add the courtesan another two grams per mil of Kiesel soul a stir it and let it sit for an hour or two. The stuff on the top will be crystal clear, right? But the problem is your yield will be very low, it will not settle nearly as much as the one that you only did the Kiesel salt and Kurdistan two, but the stuff that's at the very top will be crystal clear. Expect yields on the order of 30% though, of crystal clear stuff and you just pour it off the top make sure you do it in a round container. So if it's if you want to test that it's very easy to test and maybe just the, the, the, you know, not perfect clarification of Jesus on Titus sandwich gets very good yields on the order of like 60 to 75%. Maybe that's clear enough for you but give it a shot. Let me know how it goes. Okay, Josh from Coolidge antiga wrote in what a gwaan that's what he said for like, what's going on? Was wondering what what no means antihuman was wondering if you can explain any differences in low temperature cooking between North Atlantic lobster and spiny Rock Lobster. Also, would you explain the butter poaching that I did? How do you kill the lobster? And finally what's up with using dry lupini beans they take forever to get the alkaloid taste out? How do you cook them? I don't have an answer on the lupini beans yet. I gotta I gotta work on that. Also, I might add. I don't have a firm answer we had before on the question about making your own koji from from what's it called? Homemade from wild products instead of using somebody else's starter. I supposed to get in touch with the guys at Momofuku labs who do this all the time but we kept crossing paths I haven't gotten in touch with them. And I haven't able to find anything definitive other than people who didn't seem like they can make authoritative statements making authoritative statements online. So I'm gonna hold off on that apologize on the coaching thing we'll get back to the PT means now on the lobster I'm going to be also unhelpful I don't want you know here up in in the in these northern areas that we only get live you know, you know Canadian Maine lobster or you know home Morrison you know the American style lobster, we don't Don't get any of the spiny or Rock Lobster types live typically to cook with up here. That's a long way of saying I don't have a lot of experience cooking them, I will say this. Because, you know, I've had I've cooked them not live. And I find most of the time. And I've also cooked, you know, regular, you know, American style lobsters not live. And I've never really liked cooking with frozen lobster used us you ever had a good frozen lobster that you'd like to know, I'm back in fact, I did. I remember once I did a class at the French culinary and I was doing lobster low tech lobster. And they you know, I could only get the frozen for some reason cuz I had to teach it that day. And I've never had a worse low temperature product in my life than the the frozen lobster. So anything I've done with the with the Rock Lobster slash spiny lobster is not, I'm just gonna go ahead and say that it's not, you know, not necessarily applicable. Now, I will also say this about regular lobster is that I tend to not like the low temperature, I tend to not like low temperature cooking on on lobster in general, I used to try to do it at like 60 degrees Celsius, you want to keep lobster cooking times. And this is going to be true by the way, even though you know the lobster like the like the northern lobster like the you know, the Claude lobster and the non Claude spiny lobster, they're not actually that closely related. Did you know that? No, they're not really that closely related. I mean, they're both crustaceans, but they're fairly separate. Like the spinal officers are the ones that you see on the internet that they they march in long lines and it wears like, like the American law says much like mustache and myself like to keep themselves don't like they really congregate with others of their type. So yeah, so they're not like hyper closely related, but all crustaceans share certain cooking axioms that need to be axioms that needs to be needed to be looked at. So for instance, the exception of shrimp, which I think actually freezes pretty well, although sweet shrimp, fresh fried shrimp is pretty damn good, right? You ever had those live live shrimp that cook right away, they mostly they eat them raw, that's why they're good. But the you know, the the lobsters any of those things I wouldn't like I say eat frozen. But if you cook them for too long, even especially low temperature, but if you cook them too long, in general, they get incredibly mushy and unpalatable. So when you're doing any sort of low temperature work with with these creatures, you're going to want to you're going to want to keep the cooking time under 15 minutes, I'd say 1520 minutes. So when I do large, large lobsters and I've cooked lobsters up to about 25 pounds, like you know, northern lobsters, what I'll do is I'll do a steam, I used to do a pressure steam kill, then would cut it for a couple of minutes, cut it open, and then cook all the parts separately keeping cutting it and keeping each cooking time underneath that kind of like, you know, 1015 minute time window for creating machinists. Now what I do now my typical technique now is because the studies have shown that there's people that are interested in crustaceans and whether or not crustaceans feel pain in the sense of pain as opposed to just nociception nociception is things that nociception means that when there is something that we would consider a noxious stimulus, let's say heat, or, or, you know, someone punching you in the face, you avoid it, right, that's nociception the ability to avoid what is what we would concerns to see as not noxious or dangerous or harmful stimuli, right? nociception This is different from pain. So pain is a mental state, relating to your feelings, right? So you can feel pain. So So for instance, I can create a robot with, you know, sensors that can avoid heat. And that is kind of a nociceptive sensor system, but the robot doesn't feel pain. So the question is, do crustaceans feel pain? Right? And?

Or is there avoidance of noxious things? Just nociception? There's a lot of there's a lot of heavy duty work being done by people on either side of this saying that, yes, they can. No, they can't. And a lot of it's based on whether the research has been done is based on whether hermit crabs you know, can make choices about what shells they go into, depending on what level of pain they have to endure what level of noxious stimuli, whatever, it's it's complicated, but the fact of the matter is, whether whether they feel pain or not, when you boil it is a long way of getting to it. Every crustacean that I've cooked, live and tested, if you administer anesthesia to it before you kill it, it tastes better. Right? And so then the thing is, is whether or not they feel pain. If you remove their ability to sense noxious stimuli before you kill them, they taste better. And so and And similarly if you kill them quickly by knifing them through now they don't have a centralised brain like we do they have a series of ganglion that go around but if you sever the you know both the the ganglia and the top and the and the esophageal ganglion underneath, you sever those with a knife. They also taste better than if you don't The problem is is that as you know, crustaceans don't have enough testing with crabs on the anaesthesia. I've tested crabs I've tested, you know, lobsters a bunch of times several varieties of crab. The problem is, is that the the blood system of the animal in the flit and a lot some of the flavor is contained in an open circulatory system that's called the Hema Hema Lind hemo litho. Wherever it wherever it is hemolymph I can never pronounce it. Terrible, you don't have that and the press that kind of crap. It's better if it's not right in front of me anyways, and so you don't want to lose that flavor. So what I do typically it nowadays is I, I cut through the ganglion over a closed thing, save those juices. Then I take out the meat as much as I can without mangling it I take the shell that you can remove Remove the gills because they're nasty, remove anything that I think is going to be nasty cooked down the shells with oil, butter, and then I combine that with the juices, put them in Ziploc bags and do a quick poach out in high temperature because I actually prefer high temperature cooking, like you know simmer like 84 crustaceans for under 10 minutes because I have the pieces cut small enough for to do it and I'm sure that will work on a rock or spinal spiny as well as it will work on a regular lobster. That was a long way answering that.

What was that gross thing that we have on the sushi at zero? That was like a shrimp.

Okay, so not to call out Jiro who dreams of sushi all the time. But yeah, so he did squilla like a mantis shrimp. You know mantis shrimp and pan that was that was some mushy fitness right? Yeah. Um, you know, I have to be honest, like those things don't taste very good. You know, cooked like that. The thing was a mosh bag. That was like the worst I mean, I think that the trip is difficult anyway to cook but you know what's interesting is that the rock lofts are much more closely related to a mantis shrimp than it is to a large my memory serves because it's like if things go into Africa look at there's like where the crustacean kind of families break down but I believe that slipper lobsters and mantis shrimp are more closely related to spine ease then then our you know northern rub stirs are okay but break all right commercial break we'll be right back with cooking issues. Today's

Earth grass grass fed beef pasture raised on 150,000 acres in central California? Hearst ranch grass fed the free range sustainably produced humane Hearst ranch grass fed beef the authentic flavor of the American was Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah.

You know, there's really nothing like hearing you scream through the glass when that commercial plays. One day, I'm gonna send Brian Kenny, who's our awesome power over at Hearst ranch. A video of that. Appreciate

it. I don't even know you guys don't even take the when like the host reaction to the Hearst ranch grasping

I might have to start doing that. Yeah, do it. Yeah.

I mean, it's a good tune.

It's a tune. Yeah. I mean, you actually saw it live. You are one of the few people that got to see that song. Oh, yeah. perform live.

Yeah, go we gotta go live with the Hearst ranch. grass fed beef. That's right. Yeah.

I remember Joel Gargano I think did it cover that song for us once Yeah. Screaming metal cover Yeah. That's nice. Do

we have do we have that? I have to look for it, maybe play it on the on the outro played on the out? Yeah. Yeah. So Dave Kleiman wrote in last week. I don't think I answered this about gummy bears today. No. Yes, follow up question because remember I did the kitchen talk about like kitchen design, it's about a foot pedals. So he has this new faucet that he wants to put foot pedals on the brand of foot pedals I use I use TNS brass, but Chicago faucet also makes several brands. The problem with faucets if you want to adapt them, you have to choose a faucet where the mixing valve, the mixing valves are separate from the actual spout. So if you can, if you can get to where the spout is like so like I also have TNS as my faucets. And I chose from them a specifically a faucet where the mixing valve got put into a tea into the spa underneath the deck of my sink. And so what you do there is you just add, because it had a sprayer right, so here's here's a, here's a way to look at it. So most sprayers that you have attached to you know, non commercial not TNS like a spray valve one. But sprayers have a diverter valve in them such that when you open the sprayer, then all of a sudden the sprayer is connected to it stops the flow to the to the spout, the one that I have doesn't work that way, it's got a manual off and on for the sprayer. So I can tea in underneath at the spout and supply water where they meant to push water out to the sprayer. So I put an extra tee underneath my deck and attached my my foot pedals and I use a hot and cold foot pedal that the mixing is done there. So there's only one output from my foot pedals and plumbed it directly into the spout via the extra tea I added. So that's how that's how i did but every faucet is different. You need some way to get to the to the spout of your faucet that doesn't that you know before you have to open or you know in other words, it's independent of the actual mixing valve that you have on top of your deck with the fuss if that makes sense. What I'm saying is kind of okay. And he also wrote in last week, I want to make gummy bears only centrifuge fruit juices, and gelatins Can I do it with no sugar? How Yeah, sure is reduced the hell out of the fruit juices until the brix is where you need it to be so that you don't need to add any any extra sugars. You have to. So typically, I was looking at some commercial gelatin stuff, I forget where I got it got it from, but you're looking at, for a commercial recipe seven to eight kilograms of 250 bloomed gelatin, which is I think roughly where Knox is in that area, dissolved in 14 to 16 liters of water with 37 kilograms of sucrose and 45 kilograms of glucose, plus acid sugar and flavors. So you're looking like now it's very important there, especially if you choose fruit juices that you don't have one that has too much invert in it, right. So there's juices that have a high sucrose percentage, and there's juices that have already broken down into invert, which would mean that it's fructose and glucose, instead of sucrose. Now that you want some inversion, you want some, you know glucose and fructose in there, because it's going to help with modifying the texture and preventing crystallization. But if you have too much of that, and aren't sucrose in the mix, then you're going to get a kind of weeping it's going to be sticky and tacky. So these guys for their recipe, use 45 grams of glucose syrup, which isn't really glucose, I don't know how much sugar there isn't 37 of so let's say that's, I don't know how much percentage that's actually glucose. And how much of it is something else. But you're looking at least in the realm, at least in the realm of a liquid that is I'm gonna want to say like 66 or something like that, but I have to look at what kind of bricks of liquid you would need to get it to work, but I think it's somewhere in that area like 66 bricks, which means you're gonna need to do a lot of reduction. I'll do some more calculations, maybe someone else's, who listens as a commercial candy, you know, blah, blah, blah, and we'll figure it out. And that's pretty easy to do a reduction of a fruit juice down to those levels. But if you don't want to alter the flavor at those levels, you're going to need to do it under a vacuum and I've done it I've taken strawberry under vacuum down to see I think almost 70 bricks, and it was delicious. But you know, you need a roadmap for it, which is a pain in the butt, right? Yep. Yeah. Yeah. Okay, and did anyone figure out whether I answered that freestyle question.

I think I think you did. See gelatin in the write up. Yeah. Yeah.

Well, if I if I did not, then cool Call us out. You know, call it call us for the you know, call us out for the jerks that we are. Right? We are jerks. Yeah, no in fact,

Hey Dave, what do you think of the someone wrote us in about canned soup sucking?

Yeah, give me the let me know what was the exact was the exact thing about it what is what does this

mean so much salt? Why does it taste worse than soup served in other ways? containers or bags? What makes canned soup worse?

I don't know. I've never done a lot of side by sides. Do you find canned soups to be bad stuff? I don't really use canned soup.

If I need them if I'm sick or whatever, if you need them

if you're sick, if you don't want to cook your own suit, right?

It takes a long time.

I think look, I think frankly the reason why people add salt to soups is not preservative there's no need to add salt to a canned soup, if you can soup to preserve it because they can that sucker maybe also now and I don't think they need to go under me a lot of problems with soups in general. And I've never done a bad soup tasting. But you know, they have to cook the they have to cook the snot out of them. You know what I mean? So certain things are not going to be mean certain things are delicious pressure cooked, in which case they probably be even better under those high temperature regimes, but certain ones aren't. But the salt is not there as a preservative. And it can stoop to salts there because people like salt in their soup. Like stars. Can you imagine tomato soup without salt? How gross would tomato soup be without salt? Really gross, right? Imagining Tomato, tomato soup with a grilled cheese sandwich. And then and then you're like, Oh, my God is gonna be awesome. And then there's no salt. That hurts, right? Yeah, it hurts.

I guess part of the question here. Dave was wondering if like bags are going to be the new way to serve soup. If like, you know, Campbell's might shift to bags instead of cans if that would make any difference?

Well, I don't know. Like, for instance, like it could be an arch. The question here is does is the cannon parting of flavor? And when people say that things taste tinned, what does that mean? Right? So like, what does that actually causing the flavor? How like everyone always says, Once you open you can you can't store you can't store the stuff in the candy more, it's gonna taste canned. What ever heard that? No, never heard that. I've heard that. I've heard that. And like, maybe it's true, maybe it's not the canned doesn't remember, the CANS that we buy are coated with crap on the inside of it does not typically supposed to be in most of these things touching the can it's touching this weird film that I don't really remember what it's made out of on the inside of the can. Look, I can look into it, if I can remember to look into it. So it sends me a text I can look into whether anyone's done an actual hardcore study on taste of cans versus not. If it's if there is a soup that doesn't respond well to being cooked at extremely high temperatures, right? Because it's going to degrade the vegetables or whatever other thing is a problem with this kind of thing, then you could put it in a bag. And you could do you could do pasteurization using high hydrostatic pressure. So if there is a soup that doesn't want to go through the processing that goes through canning to get if it's an actual processing problem versus the can itself, then there's the possibility of using a bag to do something like high hydrostatic pressure as a pasteurization technique that might have some sort of benefit but again, I don't know it because it's off the top my head

do you think soda tastes different in cans? I do. But I don't know if that's mental or not.

Most people who have cans of things for sodas and beers think that the stuff tastes better in a can

Yeah, same that's that's how I feel usually I think like a 20 ounce you know bottle of Coke versus a can of Coke. That can always taste better to me.

I don't know why by no why because bottles like plastic bottles suck for oxygen permeability, I mean of carbon dioxide permeability. So they you know, like the 20 ounce bottle if you were to walk into a coke plant or Pepsi, I'm not saying coke. You know what I mean? Although Coke, if you were to walk into one, no fans like Pepsi, I only drink Okay, when I drink. When I drink sodas, I drink diet sodas. And I think even the people from Pepsi would have to admit that Diet Coke is a better diet soda than Diet Pepsi. Right. And you don't drink diet so you don't know. I don't know what I mean. Maybe they probably would not. Oh my god, it probably just piss someone off anyway. Stars prefers Pepsi. There you have it. And I don't drink sugar for sodas much so I don't know. Anyway. If you were to taste one right off the line, right. Dr. Pepper we both enjoy Dr. Pepper. Yeah. The if you if you were to get one right off the line, they would taste probably identical Jack. But if you let it sit for any length of time the bottle is going to start losing carbonation much faster than the can. Can. It's also easier to chill down in a bottle so often you'll get under chilled under chilled sodas in bottles. And the same holds true for beers also cans are 100% Light tight. And so you know if you were to have someone that were to choose a bottle that wasn't good at a nonce gunking up And then they were to use real hops instead of those weird extracts that don't skunk, then you know you have those issues as well. So can light tight? Can gas tight, can easy to chill. And plus when you're done with it can you can crush it and hurl it. You know, if you if you grew up doing that sort of thing. Maybe I did. Maybe I didn't. Right. What do you think? Yeah. Okay. We have a question in. Hello, Dave, Jack, Anastasia and company. I have some questions for you. I think it's from Mark, but he's got an interesting name spelling of the name, right. Mark with the C and K. That yeah, anyway, I have some questions for you. I'm listening to your backlog. But I'm living in Italy and calling is a bit difficult. Can you guys call in on Skype? Or? I don't know what Viber is? Must be Italian, Italian Skype. So Jack, can people call in via Skype?

You know, we never take calls via Skype because they usually sound horrible. But in this case, maybe next week, we'll try to get one of these computers to I have to look into that

Skype ended up Oh, yeah. We got to get that Friday night. But the the the Now that sounds going through my head. I'm not going to think that the Yeah, but I mean, like we have we have a good number of international folk. Maybe we could set up a Skype thing for them. No. Yeah. Well look into that. Is it It always sounds bad even if you just do voice only Skype and not that not the

not the video that might might help. We could always do the phone Skype too. Yeah, because I touch that. And

I think it's the video Skype is the one that always hangs up, right? Yeah. And not mean hangs up like a I mean hangs up like okay, so it's possibility. Okay, so I wondered about the following when you cut up an onion and a kitchen machine, which I think means for us, like a robo coup or a Cuisinart or something like this, but I'm gonna start calling it a kitchen machine.

Not gonna be any big. No, I

like No, but that's the thing. That's what I love. Like, like, any sort of thing that holds things. I'm like, Ah, it's a bucket. You know what I mean? Like, get the bucket, you know what I mean? But now I'm gonna call everything the kitchen machine. I freaking love that. Like that. Like if I got nothing else out of today's show, I got kitchen machine. So anyways, when I already kind of been on the kitchen machine, it starts to taste weird, I'd say oxidized. Is that what happens if you make a sauce with those onions or a meat patties with it, you will still taste it. I don't mind chopping by hand. But machines can be handy when stress for time. Stay with alliums. Do you also have an idea that lots of garlic has an off taste I once read it was a fungal infection, anything you can do about it. I grew my own garlic and never had any problems. Maybe that's because it was gone in no time. Okay, so here's another question but I'm gonna get these to these first. So the second question with the fungal infection I haven't able to find anything yet on that but I didn't get a chance to go look at my you know alliums book by Eric block which is kind of the book on that so if there was an off taste due to fungal stuff, then there would be that garlic ages drastically and changes in flavor over time as it's held. And as you know, because you grow your own garlic you got to cure the garlic for it to be optimum but then I think past that curing point it can change over time and god knows how long the garlic in regular supermarkets been sitting there and just desiccating and turning to garbage garbage. You don't like most of the garlic you get in the in the supermarket. Oh, right. Yeah, yeah. So you know, that could be it too. But I'll do some researching on fungal infections and garlic. That sounds gross. Right so exercise does hates a fungus.