Hello, everybody, and welcome to a brand new series on heritage radio network called the culinary call sheet where we give a peek into the back kitchen of culinary media. I'm your host, April Jones,

and I'm your co host, Darren bresnitz. Part of why we started the show was to offer an unofficial mentorship for anyone who's interested in learning about all aspects of food and video, whether that's TV, social media online, or just something you want to do for fun.

Absolutely what was once niche or a little silly, as I'm sure you remember, Darren, when we started out, this man has now become such a massive playing field for so many creatives using food as the medium.

It's something that has driven us professionally and personally, for so many years. What excites me the most about this show is that we're going to sit down with some of the industry leaders to hear how they made it and what drew them into this industry.

With 20 years in the culinary production game ourselves. We're hoping we can give through these conversations an insider's view into personal stories from the field, as well as an in depth behind the scenes look into some of the most popular food programming. In today's evolving culinary media landscape.

We'll be covering everything from how to style your food, to how to license IP, to developing your own ideas, and some tips from the masters of how to host your own show.

Yeah, it's a little bit of conversation, how to and how do you do the things that you do in color media, which I'm so excited about? I love so many of the guests that are coming on this season. We have talent from Food Network from Vice media eater refinery 29,

we've met some of the best people in the world both in front of and behind the camera. And we're bringing them all together to share their stories, their delicious adventure and their unique journey into this crazy world.

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Today's program has been brought to you by white oak pastures a five generation Georgia based beef and poultry farm determined to conduct business in an honorable manner. For more information visit White Oak pastures.com. broadcasting live from Bushwick, Brooklyn, you're listening to heritage Radio network.org.

Hello, and welcome to cooking issues. This is Dave Arnold, the host of cookies coming to you live from Roberta's pizzeria on the heritage Radio Network every Tuesday from 12 as well 45 joined in the studio with Natasha hammer Lopez and of course Jack and Joe in the engineering booth How you guys doing? Microphones are working over there, but they're doing how you doing status good. Yeah, Natasha is trying to find someone who's willing to move the crap out of our studio area in Brooklyn in the back of North Park. To to our new space on 54 Eldridge Street, which Intel eater actually showed up they did not believe that we were not trying to open another bar there. Yeah. And when they showed up with like, here's one desk. Here's another desk look a third desk and they're like, Oh, so it's not going to be and we're like no, no, no, it's third it's you know, it's Booker index equipment company. It's our test our test place but anyway, turns out that movers here in New York unlike when you move it yourself, which is what Natasha and I had to do last time, make you put everything in a box. Its equipment How the hell do you put a big piece of equipment in a box and we're supposed to just go get giant like washing machine boxes to put everything they said or shrink wrap it so he's that like or shrink wrap it Yeah. What does shrink wrapping doing you covered in plastic? And but how's that helpful other than I get to destroy the earth a little more. They're their trucks. They don't want they don't watch the trucks with the equipment. The insides of the truck. They don't want to scratch the inside of a moving truck. Right. The weird stuff that they're moving. Mm hmm. This is it. This is happening in the real life. This is what's really happening. Yes. Okay, then.

They are Mike works and we're doing well.

Yeah. Nice. Good, strong. Good. I was a little worried about you. I was pretty sure that there was still air in the booth, though. And that you were breathing. Hey, do

you know about our fundraising party? Can I shamelessly plug that right now.

You are You must plug away. Yeah, you're.

You're doing drinks.

I am. Yeah. Oh,

whoo hoo. Mezcal. And we've got absolute. We've got a whole bunch of stuff. September 9 That Roberta's from five to 8pm It's our first fundraiser. How much are tickets? 150.

And where do they purchase said tickets? That

is heritage Radio network.eventbrite.com.

Now nice, and we'll take some of our techniques and put your money where your mouth is with our

beverage, Gramercy Tavern and Del Posto I think Brooks is doing desserts and I'm Michael Brooks we'll be doing it wrangled bro. Yeah, Brooks will be there. Nice. Yep. Back 40 West China Pacific go inside Park St. Barts in Yeah. inside pocket St. Barts bunch of other chefs will be really cool.

Nice. Nice. And it's here at the at the Roberta's pizzeria. Yep. In the backyard. Yeah. So if you've never made the trek out to Brooklyn, now's your chance. Now's your chance to cross that river.

You can meet us and maybe indeed, Jesus may be working. I'm just putting that out there. I don't know. Oh, we

may have to make it happen. I might have

to make that happen. Yeah, you know, I'll see what strings I can pull. It's not an easy get ya

mustache here. You're gonna come to the gate, right? Yes. Yeah. So you can come see Natasha and like, I think everyone should wear their best hipster outfit to come. Dasha at the end I can get pictures with me and indeed Jesus. If indeed Jesus actually shows up well, he's works on Sundays. That's what we it's he's anti anti Jesus. No, go You gotta get your your your your Bible straight. First of all, this was to work but like one of the things that if you read the if you read the kind of, you know, the apocryphal gospels, like one of the things Jesus used to get in trouble for all the time was healing people on a Sabbath jersey. Well, now that those gospels never made it into integer integers, you speak but yeah, so he used to do things like you know, cure people on the Sabbath. That's one of the things he got in trouble for. You know, curing people at work. Work. You think that stuff just happens caring people work, anyway. Okay. Let me catch some stuff from before that I missed for a couple of weeks ago. Berryman Casey Roenick I don't think I got this question on Twitter. Clearly, I'm over cooking or people are over cooking shrimp and shrimp boil. I didn't talk about this. And I said, I don't think so. shrimp sausage, corn, onion, potato, garlic and saturon spice. Perfect Suvi timing recipe. They're talking about this? I don't remember. I don't remember whether I talked about or not. But I think he might have did I? I feel like it might have like don't cook shrimp Suvi just cook all the parts separately? Perfectly and then recombine them at the end. Yeah, yeah, you're right. I did. I talked about shrimp shells. Delicious. Delicious. shrimp shells. It's right. Yeah. Okay. All right. All right, Barry, I got you covered. But I know this I did not mention Pavlov at path one love or path one have on the Twitter sent in a picture to us of how he cooked 25,000 lobsters in a five day period at a festival in Maine, using something that looked like a steam giant kind of steam cleaner, huge pieces of equipment. And his exact quote is I felt bad until I ate them. Hopefully he did not eat all 25,000 The most I've ever eaten in one day is 10. And that was the same day I found out I was allergic to cherries. So they thought it was lobsters for a long time that I was allergic to until cherries season came around the next year and sent me to the hospital again. Crazy right? Anyways, so I had something else to say about that. Oh yeah, when I was a kid, check this out for any of you that don't know clean aircraft equipment for a living. There used to be an in Oshkosh every year in Oshkosh, Wisconsin. There's what's called a fly in where all all kinds of experimental aircraft lunatics from all over everywhere. And also the old warbird nobodies and everything show up and they fly in and Oshkosh airport is for that couple of days the busiest airport in the world. And you go there, and my dad used to fly see planes a lot. So we used to go to the seaplane party, which is a little off the way because you had to have a lake. And those guys had a giant like brought beer brought in 55 gallon drums and corn that they would cook in the steam cleaners that they would use to steam clean parts like giant steam cleaned corn. That's what I used to eat as a kid. Maybe that's part of what influenced me to get to use dumb equipment to cook with. Do you think yeah, possible, right. Okay. Now, on to current questions. Hi, Dave, Natasha, and Jack, shout out to indie Jesus. And I'm going to have to add the a shout out to Joe. Remember guys give the shout out to Joe. He is a singer. In a way he's the frontman of some sort of like hardcore punk band True or False? True. Why have we not heard any of the music on the radio program?

Maybe one of these days.

So if you don't give him a shout out, he is going he is going to come find you. Pretty much. Right?

I am extremely scary person as well. Yeah,

yeah. I mean, you you probably don't know him. Unless you're here in the studio. It is mean you might know him separately. But other words, yeah, odds are you don't and he's it. He's a scary man. He'll come find you. I'm just telling you. It's telling you should give him a shout out. That's all. Okay. So Eddie Shepard writes in I have a quick question. And also below a free well free for me, not for you anyway, getting a link to the copy of my ebook. Okay, as a longtime listener, and having asked the odd question on the show before I was hoping was okay to ask a question slightly away from the tech side of things and more on aesthetics and subjectivity. I wonder to what extent you thought about the presentation of food affected the experience of eating it, whether it's something you see as critical to a dish, and if there are any examples or anecdotes you have relating to food either looking horrible and tasting amazing, or vice versa beautifully presented, but let down and flavor it I personally think that the setting you're in and the aesthetics of a dish can potentially have a big psychological influence on your enjoyment of the food. But also the flavors. First and foremost, if I can make a delicious dish look nice, then great. I will but of altering its look compromises flavor, I wouldn't I wonder what your thoughts might be? And also, if there's anything you might favor stylistically in food presentation. Okay. It's a great question. I think there's a very famous Spanish chef, very famous, Mercurial Spanish chef actually, that knows and I were doing I think it was Mills and I might have been even before Mills, was it? No, I think Mills was there anyway, is this huge event we had at the French Culinary Institute years and years ago. And all the big wigs were coming for Ron and one Rocha and all these guys, this is none of those guys, another very famous mercurial Spanish chef. And not that one rock is actually not he's like a totally mellow guy. He didn't yell at anyone the entire time, man is a complete, he's very, he's a he's a gentleman, one row come Sunday, I will get to go to his restaurant anywho and Jordy to the brother, pastry chef, very nice people. Anyway, the so this guy is well known for kind of like hyper presentation with you know, like, lots of tweezers and whatnot, you know, tiny, like, early on adopter of the the, like the micro mini micro micro micro green tidiness, right. And he literally said during his demonstration, and it stuck in my head forever, that it is not only important for the food to look good, it must taste good also, and this stuck in my brain, and I have not been able to pry it free because it's exactly backwards. It's exactly backwards. It is important. Like, it's not only important that the food tastes good, it's important that it looks good, too. That is a true statement. Right. But I kind of my problem with food that's for presentation only is I think it leads to especially we're in an era right now, where, you know, a lot of food work is done on the internet. It's done in books, it's done on television programs, and it's done in demonstrations. And so there's a lot of work that's done that where you can tell that it was done for the look. And not necessarily for the for the for the taste, but like I call it, you know, cooking for demonstration, it's like you specifically make it so that it looks good in photos or in books or in in demos. And I mean, I'm not saying you should shy away from the presence. But that's why in a demo, I think it's important to give tastes out so that people actually know that what you're focused on is cooking and the flavor. Now, I think that you know, look, if you're cooking at home, it's one thing it has to look appetizing. I don't really do a lot of plated work at home, except for I used to on special occasions, but I don't really do it at home at home. It's it's more about, you know, something that looks appetizing, but you know, in a homestyle. But when you're doing a demo or a dish or a cocktail, I think it's very important to have to have it look enticing and appetizing or in a cocktail scenario that have the presentation of making it be something that wets the person's appetite for what you're making. And that looks good, it looks compelling. And there are dishes that obviously the your enjoyment of them is incredibly augmented by how they look things can be enchanting, captivating, just in their look. And then that makes it makes an already good tasting thing tastes better. But you know, nothing is worse than something that they've obviously spent a billion years making it look great. And there's no flavor to it, or, or the flavors clash and they don't work. I mean, you've had that happen. Stars, right? Do you enjoy that? No, she's not paying any attention. Okay, got this guy to move on? Oh, well, okay. All right. So mustache is not paying attention what I'm saying during the radio show, but did in fact find places good guy is gonna move our stuff. So kudos there. Now, there's another side to it, which is also true. And you allude to in your question, and that is that I have things that we have made that are freaking delicious, like delicious. Great. And yet I won't ever serve them. Why? Because they're hideously ugly. You know, like a drink that looks like a murky brown mass and not like brown and a good sort of whiskey way. Like just nasty. And so yes, there are there are situations where, you know, looks Trump how good something tastes just because I won't be able to get past someone's lips. Same way. Like I can make you a piece of chicken that looks like it's still bloody cooked through all the way no one will eat it. Why? Because it's visually repellent to them. And so I think both both are important, but I think you're going to steer yourself right. If you focus on flavor first, and then after that, like you know, like how can this presentation be? The best best achieved, right? I mean, that's my feeling. Now the second thing we have infirmity is Eddie just has a new book available, I believe exclusively on the iPad through your through your iTunes. And it's called modernist, what's called modernist vegetarian, right? Modernist vegetarian. I mean, look at the exact title of the book because I downloaded it. Modernist vegetarian, right, by Eddie Shepard. And so it's, it's, I read it, I read it fully, because I only got it this morning. But I looked through all the recipes, and a lot of a lot of interesting recipes, some that you can use without a lot of heavy duty equipment. Some require a lot of heavy duty equipment. But you know, very well, very well clean photograph a lot of interesting stuff. And I think, you know, one of the first times I've seen someone exclusively tried to do a modern, a modern take on strictly vegetarian. So kudos, everyone should go check it out. You can get a free sample on the iTunes sent to your iPad, and then decide whether you want to pay the paltry meager price of I think it's like 699. So it's not a giant, it's not a giant investment. One thing he uses quite a bit actually, that I haven't used, I'm ashamed to say it we haven't experimented with it is the pure coke be 790, which is you know, something from national starch and can be used to make like films and letters and glasses and stuff. We haven't really played with that. I don't think too much styles. Maybe I shouldn't be. I hate it when someone brings something out like this. And then I'm like, Man, I haven't. I shouldn't have used that more. So we'll try to get some practice in with the pure code P 790. And we appreciate that gave me a shout out on a couple of techniques in the book. One thing is on your methylcellulose, I'd like to know, are you using F 50 It looks like you're using F 50. Remember to always call out the brands and the mess of the cell that you are using. Alright. This is a shout out to Michael in Oakland, I still have your lucuma puree problem on my mind. But I'm going to wait to answer till I get back from the Columbia because I'm going to mess with Luca Luca variants while I'm down there and figured out really good solutions for you. And with that, let's go to our first commercial break. Call your questions to set 184972128 That's 718-497-2128

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and a Welcome back to Cooking issues. Okay. Matt writes in Hey, David stars. I recently bought a centrifuge on the eBay. And I was wondering if you guys had any suggestions or resources for cool things I can do with it. There are a few ideas and monitors cuisine but I want to take it further. Also, do I need to buy special bottles for the rotor or will basic mason jar etc do the trick. I see there a centrifuge bottles for sale around the web, but they are expensive. And I hate to lay down that kind of cash if I can go cheaper. Any thoughts, Matt? Okay, do not put a mason jar in there. Do not put a mason jar into your centrifuge. A couple of things I need to know before. Before I go on, congratulations, first of all on the centrifuge purchase. You know, I use a centrifuge every day. And we do mainly juice clarification with it, you're gonna need to go out and buy the enzyme pack the next Ultra SPL which is available at modernist pantry.com Even though like are they What's the story that no more love for us? Anyways, anyway, you can buy pecks next Ultra SPL at modernist pantry.com And you're going to need that with your centrifuge to do a lot of the clarification work assuming that you have a lower speed centrifuge. Remember the guys at Modernist Cuisine have a centrifuge that can easily do like 48,000 times the force of gravity. Most likely yours doesn't do that. If it does do that. You definitely shouldn't think about putting a mason jar anywhere near it. Second thing is is the centrifuge you need to make sure that the rotor and bucket Is are in good shape, that they're not dented or messed up. Thirdly, you need to clean the hell out of that centrifuge, you need to bleach the hell out of that centrifuge, and you take the rotor and pressure cook it to get rid of any sort of biological craziness that might be going on and then bleach the hell out of it again. I think that large amounts of bleach soaking will kill almost everything I need to, I need better information on how to properly sanitize something against prions, for instance. But you if you don't know what was in a centrifuge, you have real problems. Second of all, I don't know what kind of like, again, what kind of centrifuges you have. But the bottles that go into centrifuge rotors are, they're tough for a reason, they're gonna go undergo a lot of stress. I spin directly in my buckets, right? Although I'm the only guy that does it. Everyone else is like, really, you spend directly in the buckets? I'm like, Yes, I spend directly in the buckets. Never let detergent touch your buckets. You know what I mean? Because the detergent can negatively affect the aluminum buckets. I have purchased the expensive centrifuge bottles, and I have found plastic bottles that work in centrifuge rotors, but they tend to fail somewhat. So like, back at the FCI, I had a superspeed centrifuge that I could do like 22,000 times a force of gravity and safely. And we used to use ketchup squeezes in in that thing, and the ketchup squeezes that worked, okay, rice does. But every once in a while they would collapse. And then they would collapse. And then guess what they've collapsed. So it's a matter of be careful, go on to cooking issues.com Look at the center few sections specifically related to safety, you need to be safe with a centrifuge need to bounce a centrifuge before you spin it. And don't put anything in there that can break in fly apart. And because there's a couple of things, right, there's not just like the broken glass and your centrifuge, if you break something in a centrifuge, and then you go unbalanced and your centrifuge becomes unbalanced, which then becomes a secondary danger. So you have to really make sure that everything is okay. And in tip top shape on the notion centrifuge, though. So here's the thing. I think I mentioned this on the radio show a couple times, is that when whenever I go do demos, they're always like, Yo, come to a tech demo. And I'm like, Okay, well, can you get me can you get me a centrifuge? And I was like, No, unless it's Japan, unless it's Japan, they Park Hyatt Tokyo, baller ball, even the starship by the way, this this dasya does not like basically thinks that everyone is like a useless moron. Pretty much. Right? Yes. Yeah. That's fair to say. Yeah. So for her, especially people that help us out in demos, no offense to those of you that have helped us out. But like, what, like the Japanese guys at the Park Hyatt is the only time I've ever heard her say, Man, these guys are on top of things. They're good people. They're good people. They're good people. They're and like, sort of started like, that means you walk on water. That's like, that's it? You know, I mean, you're like, you know, that's it. Okay. So, so centrifuge is tough to get now here's the reason why centrifuges tough to get They're big. They're expensive, and they're not yet in a lot of kitchens. So not a lot of kitchen, people have access to them. Now. centrifuge I use at the Booker and DAX and at the lab and at the school, they're all basically the same unit one that Wiley has same style unit. Most people are using KRET, Chad, and Christy tats on Christie Pope, same same kind, it's three liters. benchtop does 4000 times the force of gravity, right? And that's what I've always called the sweet spot in centrifuges. Now that is unreasonable. For most people at home because it's too large, it's too expensive, you're not going to use it that much. Right? That's clearly in kind of the divorce slash breakup with your significant other for bringing into the house kind of range of things to do is to bring a centrifuge like that into the house. Even I do not have one of those suckers in my house. And I have pushed very far with weird crap in my house before. There is a centrifuge I just purchased to take with me to Colombia, that I'm going to run some tests on this week and see whether or not it's okay, it's available amazon prime for under 200 bucks. And it only does I think 1300 times the force of gravity but I've done some initial experiments with peck the next ultra ultra SPL and other clarifying aids and I think I can get it to work at that level not as well and not as fast as the one that I have at poker next but pretty good. Also. The cool thing I mean, that centrifuge is very small. So it really does a small amount per spin it does 120 milliliters per spin, which is a little a little over four ounces. And this is useless for a bar because please four ounces Come on, but for testing at home, and for making a couple of drinks for you know you and your family. This could be a viable thing to at least let you play with centrifugation and what you can do with it. And so I'll be testing this week the $180 You know, 220 milliliter centrifuges weighs 10 pounds and is less than a foot on each side so could be good, right? I'll let you guys know next week whether it works or not. I hope it does because otherwise I'm out 200 bucks but didn't have the quote. Oh yes, the mustache really good stuff. This is why I have around be like, just send it back if you don't like it. Yeah. But, but this way, we can always have one of those things. We go do demos. Yeah. How much does it weigh? 10 pounds. So it's nothing compared to the crap we carry around. I'll carry that if you can strap it to my back. I'll carry the world. Okay. Okay. Rob Traip has writes in about a couple of things. Carpano Antica formula vermouth, which one of our favorites anyway, we use it. We use the hell out of it at the bar even though it's absurdly expensive. Not absurdly expensive, but it's not cheap. Right. Okay. I recently discovered Capano Antica formula vermouth, and I've been enjoying Manhattan's with it like never before. My problem is that by the ounce, it takes a long time to go through a bottle. You should drink more rum. That's the problem. Okay. I'm not I'm not advocating that okay. The bottle is kept in my refrigerator with a vacuum van stopper, but it takes on an oxidized flavor towards the end of the bottle and takes up a lot of room. How would you recommend I re bottle it I have a bottle capper for glass bottles and a co2 tank available should other lower proof liquors like Lulay cookie Americano, do Binay or aberle be stored in similar quantities or under refrigeration? And then just have a question we do with this one first, okay. is an excellent question. vermouth definitely does oxidize. And this is a problem we come across in the bar all the time I wouldn't use. Here's the problem of co2. If you purge out with co2, you're apt to get like a light tingling in eventually in the bottle. What we use in the bar, we make a bottle Manhattan, we do a bottle Manhattan, we dilute the vermouth in the whiskey and it ends up being a lower proof when we're done. Then the vermouth was on its own. I think it's about about the same but the upshot is is that it oxidizes even more in in a pre diluted Manhattan than it does in its own bottle. And so we have to have a way to keep them from oxidizing. So all of our low proof things like vermouth in the bottle, anything like that, not only do we store it very cold, actually a little bit below freezing but not below its own freezing point is we'll drop a little bit of liquid nitrogen into the bottle open. The liquid nitrogen will then rest the cap on top and you'll see a bunch of vapor coming out of the top of the bottle that's purging out the air and then as soon as it stops actively pushing nitrogen out, we cap it right

there are other commercial systems based on nitrogen that you can buy they're fairly cheap like wine savor things and that you can use to purge out the headspace if you've purged the headspace out of your drink and cap it you're good to go here's the problem. Nitrogen we use it in liquid nitrogen form so it's sitting on top of the drink and getting all the air out nitrogen itself is actually slightly nitrogen is slightly lighter than air so it's going to float out of the bottle and so you can't actually just dump liquid nitrogen into it and then wait a long time and then cap it but you can buy on the internet you can just look it up you can buy an argon based system so if you look at roughly the the molecular mass average molecular mass of air it's about 28.97 Right so oxygen heavier than air you need to purge it out heavier than the average air nitrogen slightly lighter carbon dioxide heavier so you could actually roll carbon dioxide in there slowly and purge out the air which is how I make carbonated cocktails but again and then we'll work a I'm just worried that you might have a little residual kind of a prickly thing although try it it might work you know like just like like snuff some carbon dioxide in there a couple of times to purge out the headspace and then cap it I mean, that would technically work. But Aragon is a real moneymaker rockin in at 39 39.9 as a molecular weight so it's heavier enough not quite as heavy as carbon dioxide, but much heavier than air. You can buy fairly cheap little argon cartridges and purging units on the internet on the Amazon and you can use that to purge out all of your bottles if you want to just do it the way that you say you're doing it. I mean that you have with carbon dioxide you don't want to purchase anything extra. I'd be interested to know how that works, but we I don't do it to Apple. By the way. Apple's the one thing on that list that I don't really worry about I also don't worry that much About my do B'nai but maybe I should. We definitely worry about cocchi Americano. We definitely worry about our delay and we definitely definitely definitely worried about our car Pano especially after it's been mixed with, with with the booze and diluted. I will say this. We have run tests for a couple of weeks with diluted vermouth in bottles that have been ln purged and I would like to say recommend argon or perhaps co2 And then kept with no oxygen and they are dead stable. At least under refrigeration. They're dead stable so you can handle it and and it's okay. Especially you said you had a bottle cap right? Yeah, you got a bottle cap or for glass bottles. Boom, you're done. I have to remember in my head whether Capanna will accept a bottle cap whether the Kapono bottle accepts a bottle cap, champagne bottles except the bottle category and the Capano bottle might not accept the bottle cap. Okay, listen, I'm gonna go to my second commercial break and then come back with Rob second question 718-497-2128 cooking issues

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baby. And welcome back to Cooking issues we have a caller caller you're on the air

Hi Dave. This is Marvin would have calling from from Germany. I had a couple of equipment questions just clipping recommendations I was looking for so the first one was for what we would call in the UK a barbecue but I think you would call in the US a grill

Correct? Yeah don't don't tell don't tell a Southern American that a barbecue is a cooking instrument because then you have to like listen to them for half an hour about grilling versus barbecue you don't want to do it

yeah so a charcoal grill basically so we I had a weather before and it was it was okay had it a long time but I'm getting need to get a new one basically because I moved countries and let the old one behind so is there anything particularly that's any good or avail much of a much enough

that's a good question the knock on grills for isn't Geoffrey Stein garden hates Weber's hates them because you can't adjust the coal height effectively in them you know what I mean? We will never will Weber's are good at with that kettle shape is kind of allowing a pile of coals to radiate out to kind of other side they're also relatively inexpensive which is I think why a lot of people use them. And you know for me, like the problems with grills you know I prefer like a nice heavy grate that can that can really absorb a lot of energy and then and then give it back but a lot of it's about versatility I always want the biggest grill I can possibly get But the flip side of having a giant grill is that you know you basically need to fire the whole thing or or you lose lose a lot of heat a lot of the grilling I tend to do a lot of super high heat grilling, like very fast especially like finishing off superheat and stuff like that. You know So at any rate like larger grills give you more versatility because if you're going to do a high low situation or have the coals on one side and cook in the other you have more space to do it with but the problem is is they tend to consume a lot of charcoal so yeah if you're only going to be like how many people you cooking for

no more than sort of I mean eight at the absolute max but usually more like but sometimes down to two.

Yeah, I mean to me like that's a huge difference right like cooking grilling for eight and grilling for two is a giant giant difference. You know, I've never used any of the smaller like theoretically more fuel cars conserving grilles like, for instance, the egg that a lot of people seem to like. Yeah,

so those are our key and Alex's blog. Right?

Do they like him?

Yeah, but but they're expensive.

I mean, how's it cold cost in like hardwood? Charcoal? How is that expensive in Germany are no,

no, not really. But like, I think the eggs can be up to like, five 600 euros. That's quite expensive for a grill.

Yeah, I mean, I enjoy it. Like, you know, I've grilled on a grill is really a lot about how you handle it, I will go for one with a big with a nice like, I like cast. I like the cast iron grates. They're not necessary, but I liked them a lot better than those thin wire craps. And I usually go for a larger size just because it gives me more flexibility, just be willing to suck up a lot of extra charcoal, because you're going to go through a lot more charcoal than you ordinarily would. I have never used a grate that has like, I mean, a grill that has a really nice system for adjusting the height of the grill surface. But Bobby Flay told me once that he had one that did that, and Stein garden once told me that he had one that did that, which would obviously be useful because it would allow you to get different heats without having to lift the thing and shuffle the coals around, which everyone knows is a messy pain in the butt.

I know it's sort of a dirty concept for food snobs, but like gas is.

Yeah, you know, like I like. So I've used gas assists in. Look, here's the other thing, right? I mean, like, everybody knows that. Coal is great, but sometimes just want to fire the sucker up and run.

Right? Yeah, cuz it's steady. And it takes time to heat up and stuff. So yeah, I

mean, you've used chimney stars before, though, right? But you've used a chimney starter before, right? For coal. Yeah,

yeah. But it's just as if it was gas, I'd use it more often.

Right, right. I mean, I used to have a unit a long time ago that I could go either way with and I don't know whether I was legally allowed to go either way, or whether I literally just threw an extra grate over top of the burners and went went crazy. I think it might be the latter. So that I could do I'm a big fan of flexibility. And so you know, if you're going to use the grill more often, especially in the summertime, if you have a gas thing on it, you fire it up. I mean, the one issue with most gas burners is that they just don't have the oath that you need. Right. Yeah. And so you know, and few you know, as I as I do believe kind of the Modernist Cuisine mantra on what's going on, which is that the flavor of grilling isn't really from the coal itself, but from fat dripping on said coal, vaporizing and coming up, then if you have enough power in your burners then you can do something like Chuck lava rocks onto it and then use those lava rocks to get that kind of feeling of the of the stuff hitting it and going now I think that most people's gripe with the gas grills, is it just not hot enough to get that kind of thing to happen? You know what I mean? Yeah, but no, I don't I don't think you're a bad person for wanting a gas grill. You know what I mean?

I prefer charcoal but gas is just you know, it just it's just more convenient. And then the second equipment recommendation is my wife broke my immersion blender which isn't too bad because it was crappy. But she's she's cheese she said she'd buy me as kind of a combo compensation and birthday present. Pretty much whichever one I want. What would you go for? Seeing as I don't think you've you and Dave Chang to build your new one yet?

No, I haven't. i I only have not crappy ones but I don't have really the good ones. I don't have a good one either.

I mean probably the power mix.

I was about to say the Bamix seems to be the one that it's the only one I've heard people say that they everyone loves having an immersion blender but I've never had anyone say that they actually liked the one that they have. The exception is the Bamix the downside of the Bamix is that it it obviously the the shaft doesn't pop off of the band next to clean is kind of the one the one downside it has the upside from my just never having used it is that it's got a lot more clearance around the bell for for fluids to go in and out. And one of the main problems or the first main problem with with immersion blenders is splashing in improperly sized cups with not enough liquid The second main problem with them is cavitation around the bell in thicker products for instance. You know I use immersion blenders to do pancake batter you know stab but I do you know what I mean? And and you get a lot of cavitation issues with the standard stamped steel bells that are on most kind of consumer grade immersion blenders and in the Bamix four prong open kind of blade guard I think is not going to have as much cavitation problem as those. And so if I had to go out and spend my 99 bucks on one, I'd probably get that not having not having tested it, I might take the jump and get it that I also, like, you know, like some of the other ones like, I haven't have a Kitchenaid now, and I don't hate it, but I don't love it. It came with a bunch of other attachments, which I don't even know where they are. I've never used them. Yeah,

they're more expensive over here. So like the price difference between a Bamix and the KitchenAid. There really isn't going to be one when you buy it here. So

really, yeah, and that little chopper that they sell to me is fundamentally useless. The whisk is fundamentally useless. Have you ever seen someone use one of those? Nothing looks more ridiculous than using that whisk on the end of an immersion blender. It's crazy. Yes, you know, whatever. It's it makes no sense. And eventually, the the eventually that the connection starts going wonky where it clicks in. And so now mine makes awful grinding noises when I when I when I'm using it. So all set I do like being able it makes makes me allow allowed me to be a lot lazier to just pop off the end of the stick and put it into water. So I'm not gonna lie to you and say that is not a benefit. But I might go with the man next, the next time around Robo coup makes an incredibly expensive commercial one, where the actual Bell pops off to clean, which seems like it'd be nice, but I believe Bamix also has the feature that you can remove the blade. Is that true? I think so. Yeah. Yeah, that seems like it's going to be a bad idea. Because it seems like something's gonna break there. But the biggest downfall, even with the removable stem immersion blenders is trying to clean underneath that blade, which is a huge hassle. And so the ability to remove that blade, assuming that it's not a failure point for the mechanism, which obviously has possibility of being it'd be a huge boon to cleaning, I do test cleaning out the bottom of the blades of immersion blenders.

I had one equipment recommendation for you. You mentioned tablets, and that's what I do for a living. So if you're looking for a small scale tablet, press, the, the thing you want is called a Reaver IV a mini press

downstairs, you get that rip a mini press, you

probably they're quite expensive. They're about 10 grand, brand new. But if you can pick one up from a pharmaceutical company, sort of from an auction, you probably get one for way less than that, because there's pharmaceutical companies going out of business left, right and center so and if you get one it will probably be pretty clean. Because they have to have logbooks and stuff for when you're using them to produce products. So I wouldn't worry too much in terms of too much in terms of contamination, as long as you can kind of get it all visibly clean. And then and then wipe you know, clean it with some some solvent or something like isopropyl alcohol or, or something like that. You'll probably not be too bad to go.