Hello, everybody, and welcome to a brand new series on heritage radio network called the culinary call sheet where we give a peek into the back kitchen of culinary media. I'm your host, April Jones,

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Absolutely what was once niche or a little silly, as I'm sure you remember, Darren, when we started out, this man has now become such a massive playing field for so many creatives using food as the medium.

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We'll be covering everything from how to style your food, to how to license IP, to developing your own ideas, and some tips from the masters of how to host your own show.

Yeah, it's a little bit of conversation, how to and how do you do the things that you do in color media, which I'm so excited about? I love so many of the guests that are coming on this season. We have talent from Food Network from Vice media eater refinery 29,

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broadcasting live from Roberta's in Bushwick, Brooklyn, you're listening to heritage Radio network.com.

Hello, and welcome to cooking issues as a Dave Arnold, your host of cooking issues coming to you every Tuesday live on the heritage radio network from Roberta's pizzeria in Bushwick, Brooklyn from 12 to approximately 1245. Calling all of your cooking related questions to 718-497-2128. That's 718-497-2128 joined as usual, the studio witnessed Aisha hammer Lopez, how're you doing? I'm good. Yeah, good. Well, we haven't been here for a couple of weeks have a lot to talk about a lot has happened in the in the last couple of weeks. Well, the most important one being. And I guess we'll talk about this more towards the end of the show. But we opened the bar at Booker and DAX at SOM is now open for business. And you can come to 13th Street and Second Avenue where we've put our, whatever it is foot where our mouth is money where our mouth is whatever. Yeah, we're trying all the techniques that for years I've been saying you can use in a bar or restaurant. And we're actually doing it and see when it's working so far. I think she's been doing pretty well. Yeah, yeah. Enjoy the drinks. You've been there as a customer a couple times. They're delicious. Yeah. Anyway, we'll talk more about that later. And that's the reason we didn't have the show last week. I apologize. We're going to try to do the show last week on Tuesday, but it was our first day of friends and family. And let's just put it this way. getting everything ready was what we say a poop show. Is that the fancy way to say it? Yeah, poop show. Yeah. Yeah, poop show. Even though it was our friends and family who were very forgiving, folks, it was still quite a poop show. We've ironed it all out. Come come come to the bar. But the weekend before that week before that, rather I was in Sweden, which I'd never been before. Very nice. In Sweden. I was brought there. By the absolute people. The Absolut Vodka was like, Do you want an all expenses paid trip to Sweden, and then get to go to an ice hotel? And what are you gonna say to that? But yes, right. Just anyway, so I went and I found out something interesting that I didn't know our friend, the bartender slash writer in New York Times Toby Cikini. Did you know he he basically invented slash popularized the Cosmo because I did not know that. I learned that of course, you know, a proper Cosmo. If there's such a thing as a proper Cosmo. It's actually an okay drink. Right? It's just you don't lose mustaches, giving her vegan face because she doesn't drink vodka drinks. So it's basically in the stashes vodka slash vegan face. It's actually look, everyone has the grabbing and it's fairly neutral and a mixed drink. vodka so it's just a question of like, you know, any whatever I'm not gonna get into it. A Cosmo tastes fine. But in order to make a proper Cosmo you need Absolut Citron, which is why absolut was talking about it because the popularity of the Cosmo was coincided with the launch of Absolut Citron here in the US but but the point of the story is, is that you would never peg Toby for the Cosmo guy. And by the way, I know there's a lot of argument as to who invented the Cosmo. Like there's these people out in San Francisco that say they do I don't really care Absolut Vodka basically says it's Toby. So if they say it's Toby, I'm gonna go with that. In fact, Dale DeGroff another one of our friends who was at the thing at the time did not dispute he actually probably made it more popular because he was serving them to Madonna and Madonna drinking them in public. I think this was a major spur to its popularity. It was Sex in the City. I believe Madonna came before Sex in the City. This is the problem with you being a two year old that made it mainstream. Sex and city was much later there was already a popular drink they Sex and the City chose it as their iconic drink because it was already a popular drink among the inset in New York City of models and types like that. Two year old. She's not actually too by the way. So anyways, you would not expect this guy to be the Cosmo guy because he's kind of a tall professorial dude who speaks you know, in very measured tones and wears tweed jackets. Would you expect that from the Cosmo guy? No. Anyway, last thing I'll say about Sweden, is that I got to ride a dog sled. dog sledding is pretty awesome. dog sledding, do you know that they they don't stop to poop or pee. They just pee and poop where they basically shoot it out while they're running. And then they also they don't stop to drink so they just eat snow while they're going. Wow. And that there's no rains it's not like Yukon Cornelius. There's no kind of whip or anything like that. You just basically tell the dogs go left, right. They all run anyway, dogs getting onto the cooking questions. I don't know how Joseph I apologize. I'm going to brutalize your last name because it contains an enlightened position. I'm not used to but Joseph Petter. Do you think better? I don't know he eth Oh, uma Petter. Anyway, writes in about meatballs, Dave I'm planning to make meatballs this week and I'm trying something new. The meatballs will be around 3.5 centimeters in diameter that's like an inch and a half for us in in inch land right something like that. Cooked cvwd was not really suited because he says there's not going to be a vacuum seal so it's not to destroy the texture so Joseph you're not really cooking suevey You're cooking low temperature right? Soviet it has to kind of be under a vacuum and remember I make that distinction specifically because the health department gets in you know gets all hot and bothered when you use vacuum here in the in the city, but not for low temperature. So I tried to keep the term cvwd under vacuum separate from low temperature which is temperature control cooking, or some people call it exact cooking or there's a bunch of different terms people use anyway. I'm going to cook them low temperature 56 degrees Celsius, which is a good temperature for meatballs. If there's a high port content people might freak out. It's not going to be a health issue. But it's just a question of what people want 56 is going to basically be a rare, you know, medium rare kind of a meatball so if you want it to be medium rare, it will taste great. It's just a question of visually whether you want it to look that way or not. Okay. Cook them for about 30 minutes I will cook them actually longer if you want to tenderize the meat at those temperatures. See when you're grinding that you're tenderizing it but in fact you can tenderize the grounds even further so we when I do a hamburger I'll cook it for several hours at 55 or 56 to really tenderize and cook the meat anyway for 30 minutes and afterwards the meat balls will be deep fried to finish them off at 350 degrees Fahrenheit for about two minutes. He's just like I am he fries and Fahrenheit and fries and Fahrenheit and cooks in Celsius crazy just like me crazy Anyway, go higher anyway 350s little logo like 365 And you don't need a full two minutes although you can. I think they should give good results. I was wondering what you think okay, well when I cook meatballs, this is a technique I use but you have to fry them before you cook them in the in the ziplock bags. And the reason why is otherwise they'll stick to each other. What you want to do is get oil fairly hot and you want to flash fry for like 30 seconds the meatballs pull them out, do not let them sit on a tray that will break under their own weight. So that point because you heated the outside, so you want to put them directly into a bag. I usually put them into a bag with butter, but you probably could cook them directly in your meatball sauce if you want. And that's the way you cook them to stop them from breaking apart. Once they're cooked. They won't be as fragile, you could pull them out, flash fry them, I obviously would bag them in something like butter and not in the sauce if you're going to do the flash fry afterwards because you can't fry the sauce it'd be a nightmare. Another point 56 is going to be a little low for some of your customers you might want to go a little bit higher like 57 which is normally where I go. And another point that I make other than saying cooking longer than the 30 minutes that you're cooking is if you mix salt in and you almost always mix salt in with your meatball mix when you're when you're mixing it. It's the law longer they stay when they're cooked, kind of the firmer they're going to get. And the less you're going to have that kind of a low temperature effect. But on the other hand, the saltier and more delicious the meatballs will taste. So you have to kind of trade off how much salt and how much mixing but you never want to make your meatball make you want to make your meatball mix right away, fry it, make your meatballs right away, fry it and then put it in the bag. And that's going to kind of give you your best results and the more salt and the more kneading you do to your meatballs, the more they're going to get firmly packed like a like a, like a sausage or like a puck and the less they'll be like a hamburger. So it depends on how you want your meatballs. Some people like their meatballs very loose. In which case you're going to want to add more, more wet more filler less salt less needing or firmer, in which case more salt more more needing and longer keep times that makes sense. Yep. Okay. On to the next question. Naveen, our good friend, Naveen from from Harvard? Who was the TA Heti I think right? Yeah, head TA in the Harvard Food Science course, friend of ours and a vegetarian that Natasha ruthlessly berates him for for no apparent reason, or reason. What apparent reason?

Is the food TA.

She's a food here. So what why can you be a vegetarian?

How was he able to taste all of the wonderful things that those awesome chefs who go up there

do? First of all, it's not about that. It's about teaching like science and cooking. And you're there. There's not like they're making a lot of food for people to taste

still science and cooking. Anyone needs vegetables?

I mean, don't get you don't get you don't need half the things in the world you eat but you don't like yeah, I eat whatever. Anyway, Naveen writes, and it was great to see you at Harvard last year did we did a couple of lectures last year at Harvard. Several students told me how much they enjoyed your demos during the science and cooking class must been somebody else. My demos were a poop show. Right? Big Show anyway, there is a group of them who are inspired to do more research into cooking related science projects as part of a spring class that they're doing. So I was wondering if you had any ideas for them, which could be free r&d r&d? For you? This is actually a complicated question, I'd have to think of what would be kind of appropriate for an undergrad to experiment with with the kind of level of cooking that level of cooking equipment that they have. There at Harvard. I mean, there's a ton of research that I would love to do. That involves lab equipment that we don't own, but not cooking. And you know, some of the similar stuff that Ariel our friend Ariel is doing over in, at UC Davis with checking her food reaction, doing qualitative tests on food, for instance, she's working on what happens to lime juice as it's stored over time. There's a whole bunch of tests like that, that I like running. I don't know. I'm gonna novena gonna have to give that some thought. And also, if anyone out there has any interesting projects, maybe email them into us right now, and I'm going to give you more thought on that. I'm going to come back to you next week with some good ideas. By the way, speaking of r&d, one of my former interns, Liz button, who has a restaurant in, in North Carolina, came into the bar last night for research. You like that? That's nice research on going to drink. Yeah, that's some good research. I have to get that research. Anyway. Okay. We have a question in actually without a name. So I'm sorry, I don't know who you are. But says Hello, Natasha, Dave, Jack and Carlos. Jack. Actually not here today. Not here. Lazy. Just kidding. Just kidding. One, my wife and I are going to be in New York City for the week of March 6 for our honeymoon. Wait. So are you already married? Are you going to be married? Did you take a delayed honeymoon?

Probably delayed everyone does the wait really? Why? They don't have the money. They don't have the time.

Wait. So they want to get married on particular date, but they don't have the money and or time you think it's more money or more time? Usually time? They don't want to schedule the way the wedding for when they have tired, right? Okay. I'm trying to understand, because you gotta remember. When I had my honeymoon, I was like three years old. I was 24. And I had nothing but I had no money, but it's not like I was gonna make money in the next couple of months after that. And I had time with Italy. Italy. Anyway. It was like 17 years ago. Anyway. We're going to hit Roberta's for lunch on Tuesday. Roberta's honeymoon. Anyway, did Jesus Oh yes. You have to get served by indifference. He's so she's requiring actually stoking the fire but he's like in the motorcycle Jesus. Now he's got like the Greek fisherman's hat that like you know, motorcycle dudes from the 50s and 60s to where you know, no talking about looks. He looks he's in rare form today into Jesus. And you just indeed Jesus decided before he came to work today what the temperature was going to be outside because he's got like a shearling jacket on he gets outside. It's like a million degrees in New York today because of global warming. He's still wearing the warm jacket just because of the look. Anyway. Love that. Love that anyways, please get served by nd Jesus and yes, you can actually watch the tape our show if that interests you. You, if you're here between 12 and 1245, you sit in the outside area, you can watch us tape the show. Okay, and he imagines our secret operation will be up and running by then yes, it's the bar. The secret operation is the bar and it already is up and running. So we can talk about it. Anyone can call in any questions about the bar right now they want to at 718-417-2128. And we're planning on hitting a couple of the Momofuku properties while we're in town. Anyway, that means our project, hopefully, the milkbar Cookbook inspired my actual and next first question, what is the deal with glucose syrup? What I understand is that is it a mix, it is a mix of water, glucose, maltose, and other longer chain maltodextrins. Sounds like the ratio of those determines the sweetness and the viscosity and the total solids content, which are all important to prevent fermentation. I guess fermentation means of the syrup. I've got recipes calling for D 40, and D 20. glucose syrup. But at the store, I can just buy normal corn syrup, or more expensive clear corn syrup, which seems to have no flavoring added. Any idea what the likely dextrose equivalent of these things in the supermarket is I've already have a big bag of dextrose. It was mean to buy a bunch of adsorbent. Anyway, can I just mix up some homemade glucose serums from powder, dextrose, maltose and maltodextrins? Are their standard ratios for the different d e's. I think that is more committed to stock powders and sticky syrups. But does anybody actually do that? Okay, here's the here's the problem, there's a lot of terminology a lot of terminology issues, it's gonna be very difficult for you to make glucose syrup from powder just because the bricks level of a lot, it's really silly to call it bricks, but the solid content of those glucose syrups is upwards of 80%. They're extremely stiff, extreme. So you're not going to be able to make one of them without applying heat, probably. You're not just going to be able to dissolve it and make it you're going to have to heat it and then take it to a certain temperature the answer for which temperature which I'd have no idea. You're, you're better off. They last basically forever. So you're better off buying a pail of it from like modernist pantry if they sell it. I don't know if they sell it. They say they'll stock anything thing. So you should go get it. So and for those of us that don't know what we're talking about glucose syrups are very unfortunately named thing. Glucose is obviously a simple sugar. And it is sweet, right? So Sucrose is made up of glucose and fructose together. It's a, you know, a disaccharide. And that's what it is. Glucose starch, by the way, is made up of a repeating long, long repeating chain of glucose units. When you break down starch, you break it down into like starch, maltodextrins, and dextrans, which are, you know, longer like shorter numbers of glucose units glued together, right? All the way down to maltose, which is a sweet sugar, which is to glucose is right? So Sucrose is a glucose glucose and fructose maltose is to glucose is and then you break it all the way down to glucose. Now glucose, unfortunately, is known by glucose and dextrose. I don't know why they can't just have one name, but they have to right. And the dextrose equivalent of a glucose syrup is the percentage of sugars is not their glucose because that'd be or dextrose that'd be too damn easy, right? It's the percentage of the things in it that are what's called a reducing sugar. Glucose is a reducing sugar. Because I guess because of the aldehyde unit on the end of the of the thing anyway. So it's all very complicated and different. Different sugars, different things with different d e's, right? Because they have different sugars in them. Certainly, something can have a contribute to the dextrose equivalent but not contribute to the sweetness, right? So nothing makes any damn sense. There's no direct relationship between sweetness and dextrose equivalent or anything dextrose equivalent, typically, though, may not typically always the lower the dextrose equivalent, the less sweet the product is okay. And also, the lower the dextrose equivalent, basically the less broken down it is. So the higher the dextrose equivalent to more it's been broken down to glucose and typically the sweeter it is okay. Now the reason I think it's silly that they call it glucose syrup is because it's not very sweet at all. You know what I mean? It's hardly sweet at all. I use it all the time and things like ice creams, I use D 20 glucose syrup when I want to take an ice cream and I want to get the texture right, but I don't want to have it sweet because it's really not sweet at all a D 20. Compared to normal sugar or you know a very sweet corn syrup. So I'm not being very helpful I wouldn't use N zorb. It absorb it is a particular kind of malt and so the reason it's the composition of those things is basically they take starch and they break it down into various soluble Things like maltodextrin, maltose, dextrins and glucose absorb it is going to be an expensive way to try and make you you could instead of trying to make a syrup, try to get the recipe by adding straight powders. But it's going to be really complicated. I wasn't able to find anyone that does that. But I can look more into that I can come up with anything for next time just make any sense when we have to get to a break. All right, one second. One second. And the last comment is the show's great guys. Thank you very much appreciate it. And Jack is doing an amazing job with the music. We'll see how Carlos does today. But how about bringing back doing it to death and bad bad whiskey for one more show sometime? We'll think on it. Thanks so much. A big rocket into

it and welcome back to cooking. He was calling your questions to 718-497-2128 That's 718-497-2128 The Beatles version of that song has George. We mean That's George. You said it was the Beatles.

Yeah, I know. But it's George singing it. Yeah, Beatles.

Okay. Yeah. So, obviously I liked the Chuck Berry version better. And Stacia probably likes the Beatles version better because she's a Beatle head. What do you think?

Beatles, Italy.

It's all I think that's true. My question is how do you get a rocking pneumonia like in what sense is pneumonia rocking like you like you try to breathe you can't because your lungs are filled with fluid. Like what's what's so rocking about a pneumonia? I think the lease rockin disease. Rock pneumonia. No, I got a rockin pneumonia I need to shatter rhythm and blues. From rock music he would prefer a rhythm and blues or rock and roll comes from rhythm and but it doesn't make any damn sense. Okay, it makes no damn sense. And nothing is less lung clogged than rock and roll. Think of a think of more as lungs are clogged with rock and roll. And with rock and roll is non clogging. It's a non clogging situation. It is not ever anyway. And I say the Beatles are saying that their lungs are clogged with rock. Can you break? Give me Give me Give me Give me a big big give me a big bad break on the butyl I do not hate the Beatles.

He Dave thinks the Beach Boys are far superior

to the Beatles. I did not say that. What I said is well known fact that at the time, there was kind of like a rivalry of who could be more of a badass. And when Pet Sounds came out everyone was like oh my god Pet Sounds like the most important blah blah album blah blah, blah. And then Sergeant Pepper came out and then Beach Boys were like now. Yes, basically that's the that's the Rock and Roll history in a nutshell and cooking issues. Today's show is sponsored by modernist pantry supplying innovative ingredients for the modern cook. Do you love to experiment with new cooking techniques and ingredients but hate to overspend for pounds of supplies and only a few grams are needed per application? Modernist pantry has a solution. They offer a wide range of modern ingredients and packages that make sense for the home cook and enthusiast. I have a question. Isn't the home cooking enthusiast the same person? No. Who's an enthusiast is not a home cook,

home, cook or enthusiast. Because some women who work or who cook at home aren't enthusiastic about having to cook for

their family finances yesterday they call him on his pantry to get some crazy ingredients. All right. And most only cost around five bucks saving you time, money and storage space which is big deal here in New York City. Whether you're looking for hydrocolloids pH buffers or even meat glue, you'll find it at modernist pantry. And if you need something that they don't carry, just ask Chris Anderson and his team will be happy to source it for you. With inexpensive shipping to any country in the world verified by us modernist pantry is your one stop shop for innovative cooking ingredients. Modernist pantry now carries the complete line of text jurists products by Ferran Adria, fans of cooking issues to place an order of $25 or more before next week's show will get a free textures ingredient to experiment with. Simply use the promo code cooking Ichigo sorry, ci 69 When placing your order online at modernist pantry.com Visit modernist pantry.com today for all of your modernist cooking needs. All right. Now listen, I love from all props to foreign love for On props. The My problem with the textures line of ingredients is that they don't say on them exactly what they are. So it's hard to sub other things out for it. And it's hard to develop recipes other than the recipes they've printed. So for instance, fronds gelatin, it's just called unafraid. It's called like jello or something like that. It's a mixture of two different Joanne's I happen to know what it is. It's like 25% of the of the stretchy hiatal stuff and 75% of the low Aysel non stretchy stuff. But I mean, that's my one issue. I wish that they would just tell you exactly what's in it. Exactly what's in it, because people would buy it anyway. You know what I mean? It's not like they'd have to worry study, people would go, but people want to buy his product that has been vetted by him. You know what I mean, but they just tell you exactly what's in it, because it's only going to foster better research by cooks. That's my only gripe. Would you agree or disagree, so she doesn't really she doesn't listen to what I'm saying. She just got she just agree with

lots of emails from people. Yeah, yeah. But we're

doing a show right now. We're doing a show. Anyway. I had another question about monitors pantry, but I forget. Anyway, it seemed like good people. Work good people. Good peeps. Good people. Okay. Yes, I'm an idiot. Okay. Okay, Matthew writes in Hey, y'all pork shoulder I called in about last week. Of course, that's three weeks ago now came out insanely good. I'm glad I went for 58 degrees Celsius for about 34 hours. I brine it in a basic salt and sugar brine for 12 hours before cooking, seared it in a cast iron grill griddle series here in the cast in a cast iron grill on a cast iron grill probably. Right, or a grill pan, maybe. I'm not sure and circulated it with olive oil, a bit of reduced vermouth and aromatics. My girlfriend said it was the best meat she ever tasted. Well, I'm not this dosha you're, you're a messed up individual. And this show is not going to go that way. So I'm just gonna skip on past that. My girlfriend said she has the best meat she ever tasted. So that was good. One thing that surprised me was that the meat was not as pink as I expected, it would be at that temperature. It has slight rosiness to it, but not in medium rare appearances I anticipated. That didn't really matter as it was incredibly juicy and tender in a good way. Okay. Two things. One, when you cook something, a 58 for only a little bit of time, like an hour, it's going to be very, it's going to be very pink when you cook for a long time and 58 It's going to be rosy, but you're going to lose some of that pinkness, that loss is also going to be enhanced by the Bing, I think the Bing is going to firm it and also give you that color change a little more towards the other side. So if you wanted to stay Rosier, I would not Brian it, but then you won't have the same flavor right or not cook it as long but then you won't have the same texture. So I just don't think you're going to get that color. Also Brinegar. So I can know where this came from. Because this is pulling out like information he gave me like, you know, eight years ago or something like that, but says that if you were to store that package in very low low temperature for a long, long time, the rosin is would come back weird, right? Anyway, he told me that a long time ago. Of course, I've never run the test because I don't store unfrozen meats for a long, long time, which is not my not my thing. My question today however, just going back to what Matthew was saying is about pork shanks. I'm going to be cooking about 30 Pork Shanks for an upcoming event I'm doing I'm leaning towards circulating them. I'm hoping if I max out my bath size, which is purportedly 30 liters for the SU V professional, I can do them all in one batch. I plan to brighten them overnight, sear them and then circulate them similarly to the pork shoulder for 34 hours or so but at a higher temperature maybe 65 Do you think this is a good time and temperature strategy? My goal is for them to be super tender and delicious, but not necessarily falling apart like a traditional braids. The second part of this question is on deep frying and post braise, the location of the event does not have great ventilation. I'd like to deep fry the shanks as far ahead of the guests arriving as possible. So if I smoke the place out, it happens when people aren't around. After frying, I plan on letting them cool on racks and then heat them up in a cider agrodolce glaze. Mortain glaze just before serving Do you think they can hold next page? Well, for a couple of hours after deep frying before serving obviously, they won't be as crispy but my only alternative would be to use the crappy boiler in the household type of and present at the event to posterior them at service time. Okay. And he says he would have called in his question but hopefully as I answer this question, he's eating Lulo and kurta. Hana which is good Lulo is the amazing fruit that they eat in Colombia that makes great drinks anyway I hope the Lulo is delicious. I am sure it is you know I cannot find frozen Lulo in New York I bought some it was okay it was I bought my local supermarket had like a package of frozen Lulu that I guess got shipped by mistake from Colombia. I don't know but it wasn't as good as a freshman. Probably make an okay drink. It wasn't great anyway. So first of all 65 Celsius, I think too high. I think you're going to want to do 62 or 63 Celsius. 65 is a little bit over and it's the point where you're going to get a lot of contraction and you're going to get a lot more moisture loss from it. The muscle, I would do six, I think 3034 hours might be okay, you might want to go look a little bit longer. And I would do it at like 62, maybe 62. In that range, that's gonna give you a nice not pink really rise nice texture, if you cook it for 34 to 48. Okay, but 65 seems a little high to me. And it won't fall apart, these things will never get mushy, but they won't break apart like a traditional braise. And the reason why is because the collagen even though it gets soft and turns, the gelatin doesn't melt out of the structure. So it doesn't literally fall apart because it hasn't lost its structure, the structure is just gotten soft. Okay, as regards frying them post braise, what I would do, you can you can pull them out of the bag, I would pull them out of the bag, give them a quick fry, before the people come to develop a little bit of a crust on the outside. And then I would throw them into a I would throw them directly into the sauce in Ziploc bags and keep them warm in your circulator. That's what I would do. Because you're going to lose the crust, but it's going to soak up this I wouldn't keep them on racks because the look it's not the crust it's most important on something like a braise. It's the kind of sauce and the integration. So I would let it integrate with the sauce, I would just put the crust to give you a little bit of variation between the outside and the inside. Anyway, that's that's my that's my opinion. The other thing is if you're going to cook it this way, and you want it to taste the most like tender meat not like a traditional braise, I would do the low temperature on the stuff without a sauce at all. And without salting it. Although if you're going to Brian it's going to be Brian is going to have salt in it. But if you want to taste the most like like fresh, like fresh pork, but only a shank uncooked, then I wouldn't salted at all. And I would just add the salt and everything else went right before you fry it. And then bag it with the sauce and the sauce. Okay, that's up to you. But if you are going to cook it with a sauce in the bag, then you're going to have to hyper hyper reduce that sauce or otherwise when the meat gives up his juices, it's going to taste poached, which is I don't think what you're looking for. Another thing I'd be very careful of is if you're going to max out your bags, your if you're going to max out the size of your circulator, right, you're going to have a problem because you could possibly have a problem because all of the meat is touching each other. And in the center, it's gonna take a long time for the meat to get up to cooking temperature, right. So if it's sitting there for and it takes a good 567 hours for the center of the of the packages of meat because there's no circulation there to come up to temperature, you could have a problem with lacto lactic acid bacteria growing in that bag probably won't kill you, right, but it's gonna smell terrible. And you're gonna get puffed up bags. And this is what happens all the time when people pack their circulators too tight, and they're cooking at a low temperature for a long period of time. So what's the remedy? There are several remedies one, don't pack it too tight. The second one is to take a pan of a pot of simmering water and put the bags in for like into the simmering water for like 3545 seconds, right when the meat is still cold, and you're killing the bacteria on the outside without doing too much over cooking. And then put them in the circulator bath and then you've killed all the bacteria on the outside and you're not going to have a problem right makes sense. Anyway, so those are my those are my comments. What do you think they're going to say anything else about that?

I don't think so. No,

should we go to our second commercial break Okay, let's go to our second commercial break cooking issue remember this was the land that it works by. It was the dream there was a room that was failed. It was alone now was proud of this house Welcome back to Cooking issues call your questions. 271849721287184972128 and the house that Jack built signifying that Jack is back in the studio. Hey, howdy How you doing? So I take back my laziness comments awesome. Oh, wow,

really? I missed all that

I was you know when you're not here I roughed you up that's how it works. Oh man, even though I wasn't here last week so like

you should hear we say when you're not here

Oh man. Oh, we're going to have one of our listeners is going to come in on on the week of March 6 on Tuesday and hopefully going to be served by indeed Jesus. We have to check his schedule. Right. Anyway. Ken Ingber long, longtime listener, Cambridge, England writes in and says that he's asked me several questions about the new coffee machine, the Breville 900 XL, which I say I've never tried. He bought one and he likes it. So maybe to try it someday. I don't know. You know, Dave Chang and, and Christina Tosi from milk bar Breville loves those guys. Brett like, if you walk into milk bar, commissary, right? It is basically it's like a Breville factory. There's like so many Breville things there. But again, I have no I have no comments, but Ken seems to enjoy his writing. And this is a little longterm Sunday I will try one and I will give my review on air of the new but

I think they're going to stop by the park this week.

revellers people really well did the gig with the Breville thing is that it was apparently designed by a like a barista, like an award winning barista to be good for what they want again, but you know, my problem is, is that it's the same problem we lost that sponsor that time is because if I don't know whether it was good or bad, I won't say whether it's good or bad. They'll just say, well, it's probably bad. I started true. But look, those guys I'm not going to mention any names but those guys who stopped being our sponsor after I started wisecracking made marketing claims that did not make sense to me. Right? I mean, I mean, you know, I do have my limits and stuff anyway. Okay, I have an interesting question from Julie Madras of Where did How do you think you pronounce that town in Wisconsin? Beloit? Beloit, it's not Belvoir. Hopefully. Hopefully, hopefully, it's not pronounced like the actual French pronouncing

people but French accent? Really? Yeah,

I guess not right below it. Anyway, Julie magistrates and I have been looking forever for a website that could show me all of the fish that are skin fish. And I pay attention skin fish, my mother has allergies to shellfish, and scale fish. And we find it very hard to get straight answers from the grocery stores, seeing how half of them are not. Half of them are not manned like it used to be in the meat department. So there was there's no one there to tell you what's going on. So I thought it'd be right. I thought it'd be right to you with your knowledge about food to see if I can enlist your help. We try very hard not to give her something wrong. And she just loves fish. All right. This is an interesting question. So off the top of my head before I did any research, right? It seems to me that it's actually not the scales. I'm going to let's ignore the shellfish because you have, as you noted, stay away from so the question is scale fish versus skin fish. Now, 90 might right off the top of my head. For me, it says 99% It's not the actual scales, right? That is the problem. It's just that scale fish are the problem, which means that all fish that in that same group are the ones that cause a problem. Sure enough, that's the case. Most fish allergies, right fin fish allergies are a allergies to certain proteins parvalbumin, certain parvalbumin, ZZ that are in in the in fish, and they cause a an allergy because your body or some people's body develop a specific antibody system and they have allergic reactions. Okay. Now, here's how the world works. Basically, you got to look at the evolutionary chain. So you go keep going back in the evolutionary chain, to the point where the first fish developed those proteins there that your mom is allergic to, and then any of the fish that branch off from that she's probably allergic to, right. So it turns out that what she's most likely allergic to is teleostean fish, right? And tele OS fish are fish with what's called RE scales. And so they're their scales, normal normal scales. So all you need to do to find out whether or not you should stay away from it. Most likely is to look and see whether it is a tele OS fish now what's a non teleios fish eels lamp raise sharks, right? Like any cartilaginous fish right typically not going to probably be probably be a problem. Anything it's not a part of that group. Now. There's also most likely a bunch of teleios fish that are okay. I just don't happen to know what they are. And for the research backup and this I found a an article that's called a quantitative Eliza for determination of fishing foods. By Christiane Fest and Kristian PLAs in 2007, when they were trying to figure out ways to measure with an Eliza test to look for these allergens that are in food. And basically what they say is that the allergic reactions are strongest for taxonomically closely related species, right? Due to the major allergen in fish, which is part of albumin. And that accounts for over 95% of all allergens of fish allergy. It's basically 95% of the allergies related to finned fish are because of this protein, right? And so part of Albumins are found in great amounts in the white muscles of lower vertebrates, and lesser and higher vertebrates. Anyway, so that is that so just look up and see what kind of fish you're dealing with. And you shouldn't have a problem, right? It's just like, that makes no goddamn sense. Oh, no, no, no, no, no. So Natasha, and you have to look up from your email for a minute, because we're going to talk about the bar now in the way, Bert

is setting me. He's upsetting

you. Why is he upset at you? Why is he sending why Canada's Canada's our good friend?

Oh, he says, it looks like rebels giving you your own 900 XL. Right. And I was like, Yes, but I didn't want to say that they're giving it to us. 100% Because it's not for certain. And then you said, David's rate, stop reading your email. And I was like, email me in the militia.

Wow. Wow. You see now can you now you know what I have to deal with. On a daily

right on can side

squarely on Cancel. A listener? The listener is just like in a restaurant is your customer? They're always right. Right. Or wrong about this? Anyway, excellent answer. Jack's not sure.

A lot of different listeners on this network.

Anyway, I'm coming down quite squarely on on Ken side on this one. Anywho. So let's talk about the bar for a minute. All right. So what do you want to say about the bar? Nothing. It's

a great space is usually a wait so make sure you get there early.

Or cut? Where can we call in advance? Can you call unless you have to show up? For that yet? Yeah, our bar manager is Tristan Willie who is that? You know death and COEs sister Barbara and Margo and also at PDT he's having a great time. I think we have we're pulling out we haven't pulled out all the stops yet. We still have some stops left to pull. You know, if you were using Oregon terms, we still have some stops left to pull. But right now we have four carbonated things on the menu and I think we do a pretty good job of carbonating I don't have not haven't put on my new carbonation system yet first of all, I'm building a new one that's going to be like it's going to be really good let's put it this way it's gonna be really good I was gonna say it's the Cadillac of combination systems but that makes me look bad because it's better than it's like a Maybach it's the Maybach of was that good as they call that a really expensive car. Anyway, it really good carbonation system putting in for now though, we're using old school bottle carbonation, the same as everyone uses with the carbonator caps the liquid bread carbonator calves just because that's the best system that I've used so far. The system that I've built my first generation system that I built is maybe 80 to 90% as good as that, but has the advantage of being Allah minute but until I'm 100% as good as the bottle or better, I'm not going to use it. That makes sense. We have finally illegally a legally wrote a VAT product on our menu. We have the horseradish which goes into our lady of the night, which is a really, I think it's a good cocktail, which also as it's basically a clarified Bloody Mary, but just you know, everything's clarified wishes, clarified the tomatoes clarified, the serratus clarified and then use the horseradish distillate. So we have Rotovac, we have the centrifuge, we're figuring out how Bar Prep works to have all of those things prep for a bar. It's kind of halfway between the kids reppin a bar prep, but it's pretty interesting. And I think we've ironed out most of the kinks as far as service goes. So I welcome any questions on kind of flow at the bar, how it's working, or what we're doing, and we're liquid nitrogen chilling almost every day and glass, right? That's the bartender scene. Enjoy that right? People seem to Oh, and we have the red hot poker on the menu. I've never had a red hot pot, the red hot poker for those of you that don't know what I'm talking about is basically a it's a poker that is red hot. It's a stick that I build, that heats up to about 1500 Fahrenheit, and you plunge it into a drink and a drink catches on fire. And I've used them at the SEI before but they've never been on this long this often before. So we're really putting them through their paces and seeing how to make them make them work streamlined it they now cost less than $100 for me to make a piece and so hopefully, we can The bartenders don't seem to mind it right? No. No one's gotten burnt. Anyway, it's a lot of fun. So come in have some red hot poker drinks have some have some liquid nitrogen chilled glasses, but most of all, add Booker and DAX at a new bar. We're just trying to make delicious cocktails we use a lot of tech but really the tech doesn't matter. It's all about delicious cocktails. On a final note, now that I have that thing started up and I have all of a lot a little bit a lot of other things in motion. I'm going to try to get the the blog back up and running again. The stash is giving me my whatever face she has two phases. The vegan face slash vodka face is a face of kind of disgust like she just stepped on a roach. Whereas whereas this other leg is it look is a look of whatever you know, whatever, right? That's the blog starting look, but I got to figure out a better name for it. Anyway. It's good to be back. Sorry about the two week wait, be back next week. Sure thing cooking issue.