Hello, everybody, and welcome to a brand new series on heritage radio network called the culinary call sheet where we give a peek into the back kitchen of culinary media. I'm your host, April Jones,

and I'm your co host, Darren bresnitz. Part of why we started the show was to offer an unofficial mentorship for anyone who's interested in learning about all aspects of food and video, whether that's TV, social media online, or just something you want to do for fun.

Absolutely what was once niche or a little silly, as I'm sure you remember, Darren, when we started out, this man has now become such a massive playing field for so many creatives using food as the medium.

It's something that has driven us professionally and personally, for so many years. What excites me the most about this show is that we're going to sit down with some of the industry leaders to hear how they made it and what drew them into this industry.

With 20 years in the culinary production game ourselves. We're hoping we can give through these conversations an insider's view into personal stories from the field, as well as an in depth behind the scenes look into some of the most popular food programming. In today's evolving culinary media landscape.

We'll be covering everything from how to style your food, to how to license IP, to developing your own ideas, and some tips from the masters of how to host your own show.

Yeah, it's a little bit of conversation, how to and how do you do the things that you do in color media, which I'm so excited about? I love so many of the guests that are coming on this season. We have talent from Food Network from Vice media eater refinery 29,

we've met some of the best people in the world both in front of and behind the camera. And we're bringing them all together to share their stories, their delicious adventure and their unique journey into this crazy world.

So to be the first to hear our episodes when they launched this fall, go to wherever podcasts are streaming and hit subscribe and make sure to give us a follow at the Culinary call sheet on Instagram.

broadcasting live from Roberta's in Bushwick, Brooklyn, you're listening to heritage Radio network.com.

Hello, and welcome to cooking issues. I'm Dave Arnold, your host of cooking issues coming to you live every tuesday from 12 to 1245. From the back of Roberta's pizza we in Bushwick, Brooklyn, Brooklyn. Here today in the studio of course with Anastasia the hammer Lopez as always on on the Stasha i She's doing something murder on the computer. I don't know probably having to do with the event we're doing for 300 people tonight. Is that true or false? No for Thursday for Thursday's Museum of food and drink event which I believe is sold out. But if you know someone you can get tickets, I if you beg and plead. You can get tickets although we are theoretically sold out. Is that true or false? Yeah, that's true. It's true. So I shouldn't even talk about it. But if they're gonna donate a lot of money, we'll take people. I see that we're at that point now. Yeah, what's a lot? Over 1000 Oh, Jesus. Oh my god. Anyway, you have to email nostalgia for that kind of for that kind of information. You'll go on the blog. What not anyway, calling all of your questions cooking or on cooking related, I guess are technical or not 2718497. You just wrote this wrong? She's trying to fool me. I happen to know the last. The last four starts with two. Yeah,

so you kind of know the phone number.

Pretend I know. I kind of know it. I know when it's wrong. I want to look it's like spelling. And when I see it, I know that because isn't spelled that way. But just spelling it out isn't the same. You know what I mean? Calling all your questions 27184972128. That's 718-497-2128. Anyway, today's show is brought to you by again Chris Anderson from the monitors pantry. Good news. For all of you looking to get ingredients people out there, he was able to get his hands on some petalinux s SPL. The Miracle enzyme which we use for French Fries Recipe on the blog, www cooking youtube.com enzymatic peeling of fruits to get really amazing peels with no albedo, that's the white crap, or to do auto suppressing. We also use it for clarification or self clarify things like apple juice, but you need to centrifuges to do stuff like strawberry puree, although I have weighed around that. I haven't posted about this yet, although I will because I found out that I'm still way behind on my contractually obliged posts per week. And they're trying to ship me off to do a demo for the school and they won't pay my obligatory day rate because they say I'm behind so I'm gonna have to now go ahead and do all those things so that I can then stuff it in the appropriate people's faces anyway. True or False? Yes, true. Anyway, they're listening. Oh, yeah. Come on, please. Anyway, I'm going to read it The thing straight up right so you get today's show is sponsored by monitors pantry supplying monitors ingredients for the home cook whether you're looking for hydrocolloids, BH modifiers or even meat glue you'll find it at modernist pantry and if you need something that they don't carry just as Krista Anderson and his team will be happy to source it for you with worldwide shipping modernist pantry is your one stop shop for innovative cooking ingredients. Fan of cooking issues order during today's show we'll get oh H of transmit emanates again. They're running. All right, see, they're running the pack next. Yeah, but what's the number on that? I have they're looking at my thing, but apparently they're still running the trans contaminate special so fans of the show called one Jack just handed me to think well see whether you get it and see whether you get it try to get some free some free crap try to get transglutaminase for free. They said ci 53 in the promo code ci 55. Yeah, but ci 53 Is the Miko you'll get packed. Alright, listen for it. Let's say you want to stick shipping. It's just like a drug dealer. They give you the free first sample. Now this is just freedom and not many of Jane on pectinate free domestic shipping on pickets for those people that call in during today's show. You will get if you enter cei 55 I'm sure he'll have it maybe for a whole week. I don't know. If you enter it you will get free domestic shipping on pack the next SPO the ultra enzyme anyway. Oh, I like that. I like the reverb on that. That was good Jack nice. Anyway. Oh, it says maybe you could talk briefly about how you use pick the next for the benefit of the audience. But it looks like I already did that. Yes. Anyway, I'm very happy to someone who's finally carrying this thing and that you know who's a real person that ship stuff out and it's not us just shipping the stuff out of the school? Because that was a pain in the butt. Yeah, you hated that. Yes, a lot lot. Yes. Anyway. Okay. First question comes in from longtime questionnaire Colin. First a response to what we said that could last week he had suggested maybe you could use an ultrasonic homogenizer which is a quite a violent tool as a toothbrush. And he says, Well listen, I know that you're not supposed to stick your teeth on it and rattle your brains into little bits. I don't have his actual comment here copy but he still thinks maybe it'd be fun. I say again, do not attempt Do Not Attempt Colin but for his other question. Going back to the museum, a food drink fundraiser that we had a back in went that was that may, march, march. Back in March. While he did a dish I gave wildly caveman food. Every chef had a theme that they had to do historical or fun like, you know, while he ate caveman and mills had would have food as now he had diet fad diets anyway, so for caveman food while they did an amazing looking dish that looked like it was just a split bone. It was done with high tech stuff actually. But it looked like twigs and branches and bones look very caveman. It was awesome. And one of the things he did that look like little twigs was a gnocchi mushrooms that he had dried and turn in these twigs I take that's actually the only thing I got to taste off that dish. And it was good. I'm sure to stash it had a whole one. No food that day. Even you had no food and station. Now just to let you know how hard and starch was working dystocia would stab a co worker in the ear and let every piece of food you're cooking burn rather than give up the attempt the possibility of taking any morsel of food even your meals on plus that you need for the dish. So it just goes to show how dedicated she is to the museum that she did not try that dish anyway. I said I had just the Anokye mushrooms and they were good. So Colin writes in when he made the tweaks for his caveman day dish did he use fresh and gnocchi then seasoning dehydrate them or did he use a Nokia he bought pre dried Mike Collins while he of course he bought fresh and gnocci season them and dry them Come on. Come on. They were fresh, which is what I recommend you do and so the question is what other than marketing and gold dust makes Quattros purification kit different any idea what their formula was? Okay, for those of you that don't know certification is turning fluids into tiny balls made popular by Ferran Adria is an industrial thing that make flake fake blueberries and X y&z For a long time typically uses sodium alginate which is a gel that is you know, has a lot of good properties from from a structural point of view, and a lot of bad properties from a taste point of view because it tastes beef, although I do like the balls when they're properly made, but it's hard anyway, so quatro thought they're going to get into what some people call molecular mixology a term I detest and abhor sounds gross and I think it's dumb and they made a kit there will teach basically anyone any regular bar person to make little balls out of quatro and then add quadrille balls to dishes and I believe they mix some gold dust in to make shimmery, quatro, shiny, tiny balls. I think that's what it was shiny, tiny balls. I'm not sure what they added to the kit where there was a magzter unit or something like that, but I believe that they were just using I hope they were using calcium glucan eight and not calcium lactate. I mean a calcium chloride is their salt, because it's basically alginate plus calcium equals equals alginate plus calcium equals a gel. So you make an out you make an alginate mixture with your quatro you drip, dip it into the calcium and boom she sets. Pretty sure that's what they were doing. I don't don't think they were doing reverse verification because it's more difficult and they were trying to train people to do it who had no training with hydrocolloid. So I believe that it is just Marketing Gold Dust alginate and calcium hopefully, calcium lactate glucan a because at least flavor list of the thing and I believe a scale you get a scale so you can measure this stuff out. You're assumed to that when a Stasha No, I've never had a quadro tiny ball cocktail. But you know, I'm willing, I'm willing to try one. Although I have my doubts about the tiny ball phenomenon in general. What about you, you'd like tiny balls Oh, fresh balls came from fresh blood fresh balls came fresh. Oh, Natasha ordered for her boyfriend. The product fresh balls, which cooks across the world, apparently tells me is much much better than putting like cornstarch or whatever else you're going to put into your pants to keep yourself fresh during service. Stacia looks horrified. Well, Natasha brought it up. I mean, I have to say I was not going to mention this at all. Oh, Attorney balls is an alginate food product that is absolutely wholesale and family oriented, not like the alginate balls at all. All right, then. Yeah. And you know, I don't want anyone writing or calling in and saying that I suddenly took the show to a bad place. When I believe is Mr. Chu brought it up. And then you know, you're not allowed to bring up an inside thing to our viewers without me explaining what's going on. It's unfair to the listeners. It's moving on. Alvin writes in about centrifuges, okay? Because I just did a post on centrifuges. Okay. Now I want to centrifuge actually, I want one before ever since I had corn butter at Myhrvold lab in Bellevue, Washington. That'd be Nathan Myhrvold monitors pantry. What size should I buy? Where to look? Perhaps Ebay. I think you mentioned once on the radio show about finding one super cheap because of a misspelled auction is one of my favorite things of all time I got a centrifuge for almost nothing because they spelled it like when they spelt like Central Centrair feud or something. Something wrong I forget. centrifuge some of the some crazy funny ones super cheap because of a misspelled auction. The approximate cost I got it for under 100 bucks. Plus shipping sick. Awesome thing works great. By the way. There'll be you know not to make you jealous or anything works great. Please answer on the radio show because they listen to the podcast religiously. By the way, will you guys be at the star chefs ICC, which is the International chefs Congress not to be confused with the renaming of the French culinary is building the International Culinary Center. Although that is confusing, right? Confusing. Do you find it confusing? Anyway, anyway? Well, Alvin, we will not be there as participants this year. We don't have to work it we just get to show up.

Every year, I've never seen any of the demos because we're working the whole time. Right and Sasha, right. Anyway, this time, I'll be hanging out. And getting liquored up at the whoever the wine and beer sponsors are, I'll be going to the seminars given by my bartender friends and watching chefs demo and learning stuff, like a normal human instead of running around like a chicken with my head cut off. Right? Right. Should be fun anyway. Okay, nowadays, question. Okay, you want a four or sometimes three, you want a three to four liter benchtop centrifuge, if you can find one, refrigeration is not necessary. But refrigeration is helpful. If you're only going to run one or two batches, it doesn't matter. But when you're running and thing all the time, and you don't have time to study really chill your products down, they can heat up somewhat, somewhat drastically in in a centrifuge. Because of all the friction of the things spinning around, you want to make sure what you do is you look up whatever rotor you're using, and you, you can look up on the internet, there's all sorts of calculators to help you figure out how many times the force of gravity, any particular rotor is generating at a particular number of revolutions per minute, and you can look it up, you want to get about 4000 G's, to be able to get the best benefit out of it, including all the stuff you do with enzymes and things like that, you're going to want to get yourself some pick the next SPL, of course, so that you can just clarify everything like a mammoth Jama. Now the reason I recommend for leaders is because a four liter you're really spending about three liters at a time. And I find that it really is a convenient size. Because if you have less product, you can spend two buckets instead of one, we have sometimes even spun one bucket of product and then the other bucket just had like sugar in it as a weight to keep it weighted down. And it's just a really good size, we can put a lot of product through it. It's you know, pretty economical to timewise to run. So I really, really like it. You could maybe get a three liter fuse. I didn't enjoy using my one that only had 500 by six it's like a liter and a half or something like that. What is it what is 500 by six? That's three liters, but it didn't seem like it did three liters and those little bottles. Maybe it was 250 by five anyway, it was like a liter and a half years and I didn't really like it. I had to spin it so many times to get enough product to work. You know what I mean? And plus you need to have a little bit of air at the top anyway, so you end up losing I would get a three to four liter benchtop centrifuge. If you Apparently someone told me at the class I taught last weekend that the price has gone up substantially on eBay since we've been screaming louder and longer everyone needs to buy one. And so I don't know whether my particular model there's one you know C whatever it is C C 12. C 14 is still a good deal but you should be able to get one for about 1000 bucks in good working order 1200 bucks in good working order. I never paid more than 200 for mine, but I'm willing to wait around and wait for something broken and fix it. brand spanking new there eight grant and so that should give you a better give me an idea is that good? Good answer stuff. Yes. All right. Now let's go to our first commercial break and while we're doing that, pick up your phones and dial your questions to 718-497-2128 That's 718-497-2128

dancing to the music is played by the DJ already the culture and the eyes Fox household or the shape right we're out here on the float song Mr. Mr. Ed. Keep kasama have such a dancing with mommy.

Just to give you an idea what kind of personal style she has. She wanted to cut the song off before he said dancing with my baby. No soul. No soul in that lady. Right? I guess yeah, we're getting some nods from the from the room over there. And don't come in and ask for ready Jen? Well, he knows not to cut it off before he says dancing with my baby. Come on. Please. Come on anyway. And you know what's funny? mustache he used to work for MTV and like loves bands loves going to see bands kind of doesn't like to be in the audience likes to be side stage. And yet she like an actual song comes on couldn't care less.

Anyway, it's not true when it comes to hollow notes. No,

it's true hollow notes. If you'd cut if you would cut off man eater at a bad time she would like all of us would be dead. Because that's our theme song. Oh, wow. All right. So Johnny writes in with lots of questions. I really enjoyed the discussion last week about which blender brand to purchase and Dan's promotion of induction cooktops. Do you guys have an opinion about brands for induction burners, I own a couple of Cook Tech's, I've been happy with them. But I'm wondering if there are others that I should look into. Unfortunately, Johnny, I don't have enough experience cook tech. I know a lot of people that use cook Tex, they're out of Illinois, I believe, you know, they're a US brand. And so most people build them in. I haven't heard a lot of horror stories about cook Tex versus other induction units in a commercial environment, which I'm assuming you're in a commercial environment, because most people who use cook Tex are in commercial environments. The main problem with inductions early on was everyone wanted the Holy Grail, which is induction units over a an oven induction range over an oven. And no one I don't care whether it was French companies or cook tech or whomever, no one made induction units that simply wouldn't burn out when they were put over an oven because they've just you know, the electronics weren't cooled effectively enough. And they would always just burn out. And that was what happened. That was the last time I checked into that was maybe four or five years ago. So I'm hoping that they've solved that problem, although I don't know if they have or not. The other problem I've seen with with induction units, cooktop, qliktech. And otherwise is just shattering of people like putting a heavy pot on something and in a commercial environment, or dropping a, you know, dropping a pan down on it, and boom, They shatter. And so those are the two things that I know had always been the Achilles heel, not of cooked acts in particular, but of all of these units. And so I'm hoping that some of those problems will change, I think when you're looking into when you're looking into induction units, one of the interesting things is you can configure them kind of whoever you want. And so you can buy dual units that are either side by side or front back. I thought the front back units were pretty cool because you could treat you could stack them like a regular range, which is awesome. And you can just make any number of burners you want but the guys at som who have one have a problem because they won't accept a big stock pot. So just figure out what you want. And I think could take as a fine brand to go with. I'm going to get back to some of Johnny's questions in a minute because we have a caller caller you are on the air.

I Dave. This is Derek from New York. I have a question about tinctures. And basically, I was wondering if the rapid infusion techniques that you talked about on the blog. Is there a way to do tinctures with that so you know, you don't have to wait six weeks for seven tincture, whatever.

Okay, well, so here's my feeling on that. So the rate of infusion What kind of proof of alcohol are you using very, very, very high?

Well, since I'm in New York, it can't say great alcohol. But I guess the highest thing I know I can get is like solely 100, or something like that

you can do 151 is the highest proof you can get here and they sell a third, someone that is slightly higher, those illegal, but you can get 151 here, you can't get, you can't get higher than 151. So but you can go to New Jersey or Connecticut and get it and get the Everclear, regular Everclear. It tastes bad, regular Everclear. You could try to source some like lab or perfume grade. And if you convince someone that you're a business, you can get lab grade 200 proof, which is we don't get to how to get the 195 USP lab grade. It's really pure, it's awesome stuff. And if you find it on sale, it's not that expensive. Okay. But back to your question. I think that the the flavors you get are not going to be exactly the same. If you want a if you wanted to taste like an old school tincture, then you're probably going to need to make an old school tincture, will you accelerate the infusion by doing rapid infusion? Yes, 100%. But the the exact ratios of, you know, different compounds, compounds that are extracted under the different kind of time and pressure regimes might not be exactly identical, maybe it's going to be better, maybe it's better. Maybe it's worse, maybe it's just different. I think you have to test it. So if you've made a particular tincture before, right, you can make one using the rapid infusion technique. And and I think have a good result. But it might be different. Another thing is, is that when I have rapid, right, I'm typically doing rapid stuff in the one to five minute range. Now there have been people who have tested trying to do more traditional tasting like several week tinctures by keeping the stuff under pressure on the order of eight hours or overnight or one day, and then venting the vessel. And I think people have had some good luck doing that. And that might taste closer to a traditional tincture. Because you're basically the amount of time it would take the liquor to percolate through and get an intimate contact and kind of displace the air that's inside of some of the products that you're steeping would be you know, basically you get through that part of it right away. And then it's just, it's just the you know, the the the marrying wants us together and then you know, shooting it out that you get, so that might be another way to do it. If you want to give that a shot.

Yeah, well, thank you, Dave.

Hey, no problem. Thanks for calling in. I love questions on infusions and tinctures right. Now, let's see if I can get my iPad. Oh, I have another caller. Caller you're on the air.

Hi, um, maybe I have a question. If I so a lot of recipes call for chicken or vegetable broth. And if I don't have any in my apartment, and I can't really like run out and get any What can I do? What can I use instead of that?

But you want it to taste like that? Well, I

mean, I guess so. I guess it's not so much like if I'm making like a barley or something and I know that it was might be too bland without the chicken or vegetable broth.

Yeah. Me and you just can't keep it in stock because you forget. Right so it's like it's always

one thing that you have in your kitchen and you forget you forget to buy it until you don't have it.

Yeah, okay. Now listen, don't don't tell anyone who's not listening to this but that like there's whole groups of people who you otherwise respect in Europe who keep who use on a regular basis like Brodo broth bouillon cubes. Yeah, and there are higher quality ones then than the ones that we normally get in the US even made by the companies that make the same ones in the US because it's more of a respected product in certain places we show the shall remain nameless Italy and so in other countries like these broth cubes Broto the column right cubes, what are the column? Yeah, they are a they are considered a valid ingredients. So what I would do is, is if you're if your buddies are going to bother you about it, hide it in the back of your pantry. If not, say like, you know who's shoved that stick up your butt this is a valid ingredient stop being so provincial and look at the world and then and then what you do is you just have that there use your normal stock when you have it and then have one of those sitting around just in case all hell breaks loose and you don't have it right okay, but it sounds great. But you're gonna have to remember you're going to change the amount of salt that you have in your recipe so you're gonna want to make sure that there's no pre salt and going on with the boy Thank you. Yeah, and the other thing I would recommend and this is another good one is stock freezes almost indefinitely so what I tend to do when I'm doing a bunch of you have a pressure cooker. I don't Okay, well buy pressure cooker anyway. Step one. After you buy a pressure cooker even if you don't like whenever you're getting chickens I tend to buy whole chickens and then I break them down. And then I just throw the throw all of the bones and you know, backs and necks and stuff into into zips and throw them in the freezer and then out After I've accumulated you know, like four four chickens worth, I just throw the bones in the in the pressure cooker and just make a quick white stock don't even bother. I mean like it's better if you roast everything but don't even bother. Just throw it in with some veg, clamp it and like 20 minutes later, you know you have a passable stock you can freeze into cubes and then you just had so you have three layers now yes and stuff frozen in the freezer and ice cube trays and and put them in zips. And and then you just throw individual cubes of frozen in and they melt relatively quickly. You don't want to freeze Big Core containers of it because then you have to thaw whole core container out. Yeah. And so now you have three layers that are going to protect you.

Yeah. Wow. That's that was really great. Thanks so much. I never thought about the ice cube idea. That's really cool, though.

Oh, well, I forget who I stole that from back in April, probably from Shaco. Panthers really a child someone back in a way back in the day. That book I want to tell me about Dave Arnold's idea. All right. Cool. Thanks very much. Thanks for calling in. All right, so now back to Johnny's list of questions. He writes in Are there any deets Is there any detailed information on changing the oil in a vacuum sealer commercial vacuum machines and other indication that Johnny's in a commercial kitchen. Commercial vacuum machines use vacuum oil and that's how they seal how they get a good seal on them. And it's one of the reasons why they're much better than a FoodSaver any sort of home machine because they have a much higher grade pump. That said, occasionally you have to change the oil, you don't have to actually change the oil very often a oil gets contaminated with water every time you vacuum something with water in it, and you clean it typically just by heating the pump up by running it letting air go through it and boils the water out makes the oil clear again, when the time comes to change it you change it much like you change a car, what you just you run the vacuum pump to get the the what's it called the pump hot so that the oil is a little runnier right and then typically depends on the machine but you might have to undo a couple of bolts and move the pump out. It's just attached by hoses and pipes and stuff, you move it out a little bit. There's typically a filling port at the top and one on the side. And you drain it just like a car. If it had any grit in it, you should look at the oil make sure it had no grit in it. If it had grit seal it pour some fresh oil in run it vacuum oil you can get at any industrial supply place like mcmaster.com or Granger or MSC direct and run it with some fresh oil drain that again fill it with fresh oil. It doesn't take much usually these things take under a quart under a quart anyway. And that's it. It's fairly fairly simple. Okay. Lastly, Johnny wants to know, he was listening to the Nathan Myhrvold episode that we had. And and particularly the discussion on coffee, where we sit where Nathan basically said that you can steam a duck and it's the same thing as doing a coffee. And and he's wondering how steaming could produce the same results as cooking in fat. He guessed that you just assume that the fat had some bit beneficial effect on flavoring. Now that's one of the more controversial things that Myhrvold young you know, and everyone you know, Max were saying is that coffee, the fat actually doesn't make any difference in that what it was is fat is a very gentle way to cook something in a liquid. That's not a poaching liquid, right. So when you when you put something in water, you're you're basically you're you know, fluids are exchanging, you're beginning more of a poached duck, or a braised duck, then you are a coffee duck. But since the fat is considered a dry cooking medium, and it doesn't really add moisture, remove moisture from the air or water soluble stuff from the duck, it's a way of doing a gentle low temperature cooking back in the day before there was any sort of low temperature, right. And if you roasted it in an oven without the fat, you get much more evaporation loss off of the duck. So you'd end up with a much much drier duck. So it's a way to protect and cook the duck. But miracles thing is that basically, it doesn't actually add any appreciable flavor to the duck at all. I don't know, I've never run the side by side test. The only way to do this is to do one in a combi oven set on steam at 85 Celsius or something like that. And do another one traditionally comfy or even in a bag. So the coffee, although shouldn't do it in a bag, because nothing can evaporate off in the bag. So you should do it basically traditional in fat in this, here's what you should do, you should get one combi oven run one in a pan, just steamed and the other one in the fat in the same cavity at the same time and for the same exact length of time, same temperature regime and see which one comes out better if there's any difference. I'm assuming knowing those guys that they did that and they saw it there wasn't any difference. So I'm gonna have to say that the way they were doing it didn't make much of a difference. What do you think does? Yes. All right. And apparently that wasn't the last question because he says sorry for all the questions, but he has one last question. He does a lot of low temperature cooking, but his partner doesn't like it because she's worried about the harmful effects of cooking things in plastic. I showed her manufacturer's recommendations and that I cook things under the temperature that they recommend. But she points out that plastics have continued to have increased negative effects that get revealed after new introductions and after a new you know, whatever research that comes out and not enough is known to show to safe. Is she worrying too much or is it a valid concern? It's very interesting because I mean, the main problem is you either trust that it's safe or you don't trust it, it's safe, you can't prove that something is safe other than saying, you know, we've used x, y and z for a long time, there doesn't appear to be any negative effects. Now, the fact of the matter is that a lot of these plastics haven't been around superduper, long in food processing things. And there's all sorts of problems that we're having these days. And some people point to things like plastics, but they also point to things like high fructose corn syrup, they point to a lot of things. So it's very difficult to know. And it's almost impossible to prove that something doesn't have an effect. Unless it's by centuries of use, you know, it's very, very, very difficult. I will say this. I am fairly certain that there are materials that leach from plastics into food when you're cooking. The question is, are those and depends on the plastic? Of course, the question is, are those things harmful? The reverse happens to things in your food leach into the plastics, which is why plastics sometimes take on smells and can't be cleaned properly. It's mainly with fat soluble things because the fat of you know fatty things tend to you know, have a cross talk with your plastics more often. Which is why if you use a crappy plastic wrap that has a smell, and you wrap a fatty cheese in it, the outside of the cheese tastes terrible. You've had that happen. Rice does disgusting, right? That's because the cheese is absorbing plasticky flavors, and vice versa. So you want to you want to be careful now, I would stay away from certain things that have if you for instance, if you're worried about BPA, Bisphenol A, right, polycarbonate has, you know, has it right, we don't wrap the food and polycarbonate but we use polycarbonate and drinking vessels all the time. So if you're worried about Bisphenol A, you stay away from that, I would stay away from cooking with PVC because it has lots of stuff in it, including, you know, plasticizers and phthalates and all sorts of things. So and but luckily most plastic wraps are made of that most plastic wraps nowadays are made of polyethylene and polyethylene usually doesn't have plasticizers which are the things that are new people most normally blame for a lot of the problems in plastics these days, but they you know, they do have things in them you know, other things like ethyl vinyl acetate and poly butane that are added to make things clean better, they have solvents in them that are used to you know, during the process of making them that are then flashed off and are there the residual things like that and sure there are I mean, I have been Have there ever been shown to be any problem with them? Not Not that I know of, but it's very difficult I feel confident using polyethylene at low temperatures. But it's very it's very hard to it's very hard to say the you know, the a lot of the bags have the the bags that we use the cooking bags have nylon, which is also relatively you know, considered inert and you know, not harmful in any way. So what do you think the starch or what's the what's the upshot of that there is no Upshot right? Have I ever helped at all or I just I don't know. Here's some things you can also cook in glass jars in a pressure cooker you can cook in fat directly without cooking in without cooking in bags at all. And I think people have experimented making kind of foil pouches to cook things in low temperature you know and I think there's going to be more you know more and more people are going to be interested but you could just do low temperature directly and stock directly in fat in glass packed in glass in like I say foil I haven't done that many experiments with it. So there's alternatives you can use if you're worried for certain dishes if you're worried about the plastic. Yes, yes. Okay, Chris, should we take one more break? Okay, one more commercial break call on all your questions to set 184972128 That's 7422 Majan we love God the man

you brought my way got a listener great ball you came in now good to miss ball I will do love you love loves you

and let's remember that if it's Jerry Lewis he's talking about a 15 year old there's not but I'm thinking about all I can think of is Jerry Lewis singing that to like a 15 year old Oh man. I had to take it to a bad place right? Yeah, but listen, I like his music but don't you think about that when you like when you have a musician that you know has like a crazy and look I respect him greatly as musician but when you think of someone who has a crazy flavor like that, don't you have to think about it every time you hear the music wasn't it his cousin to a look now you're just making fun of the south and I appreciate that I'm pretty sure anyway Chris fear we're gonna get in trouble on this one. Like, you know what with the fresh balls and this is bad in a bad day anyway, crispy writes in about isI infusions. Hi David and Stosh. I have a cocktail question for you. I've been doing a lot of isI infusions and fat washing. And I had a question about rancidity. Even though I freeze and stream my fat washed alcohol, is there some residual fat that can go rancid over a period of time? I err on the side of caution and keep it in the freezer taking out as needed, and let it come to room temperature for proper dilution. Also, I've infused nuts into alcohol and an ISI. Is there any nut oil that would seep out and go rancid at room temperature? I don't usually keep isI infused alcohol in the freezer. My cocktail obsession didn't start until I took your hydrocolloid class last November. Thanks for the Enlightenment crispier. Well, thank you for the compliment. That's very nice. Okay, look, when you're fat washing, a certain small amount of fat is soluble in the alcohol and that's frankly, where some of that taste is coming from. Now as to whether or not it goes rancid if you're worried about rancidity one thing you can add is a little bit of vitamin E, which is a kind of fat, you know, fat soluble antioxidant that you can add to try and prevent rancidity. I don't know can you just buy that in the store? Vitamin E you can just buy vitamin E in the store. Yeah, you can just go buy it took a funeral. But I called up I couldn't get in touch with Don Lee. But I was trying to get him and John Aragon who were two of the guys at PDT, who used to blast out their famous Benton's bacon bourbon, fat washed, drink for their bacon bourbon, that washed thing that was hugely popular PDT. I don't know what, four or five years ago, some of that four years ago, whenever it was three, four years ago. And so I said to John, here's the here's the quote, John, did you ever have rancidity problems with fat washing? And then he writes back, he wrote, we didn't have the product around that long. I was like, All right. All right. Have you ever heard about the problem? Because I have a radio question about it. He says, No, but then again, putting bacon sticks in a bottle of people putting bacon sticks in a bottle of vodka are probably experiencing it and won't know it because I don't know because they're drinking too much bacon involucres And I know he said something unprintable, so I can't find it. But he basically says that he there maybe there's some rancidity happening, but he hasn't noticed it. And people who are like doing a lot of bacon and vodka probably don't notice, either. He also says he thinks it depends on the shelf life of the fat. someone doing a lobster fat wash will have much less stable shelf product than a duck fat or bacon fat will be interesting to see if there's a relation to proof of spirit versus stability of product. I agree John, it would be an interesting thing to look up me to test I don't know. I mean, the one thing we do with fat a lot in the ISI is cocoa nibs and of course the cocoa butter is gonna get dissolved in there but Cocoa butter is famously stable against oxidation. You know, that's why chocolate lasts so long. I mean, that you know, it loses its temper, but it doesn't go rancid. You know what I mean? But you know, Evan has done a lot of butter fat washing I wonder whether it goes rancid mean certain things do go bad when they're infused. You know, remember, we used to get rid of the the hops one got skunked, nasty. He was 13 and his first cousin. You got to speak more into the microphones because he was 13 in his first cousin, but his management all insisted she was 15. Oh, wow. See, just like me to believe the management story just like you, you know, just too trusting a company man? Yeah. Matthew writes in on sauerkraut and slow roasting. Hey, Mr. Atia hope all's well with you. And Dave, I had a question. I was hoping you can answer them when you had time. I heard Dave mentioned that lactic acid contributes to sauerkraut type flavors. In fact, it's the acid that you get from the lactic acid bacteria making sauerkraut and you can distinguish, you know, a pickle, you know, an actual lactic acid that pickled from a vinegar pickle based on the lactic acid. I'm working on a bratwurst sandwich for my business. Sounds good that I plan to talk with pickled purple cabbage, would it be possible incorporate a small quantity of lactic acid into my pickled cabbage to suggest a sauerkraut type flavor without actually going through the fermentation product process? Does this make sense? And is it a good idea? I don't know. It's interesting. I've never had really a mix of lactic and vinegar like a semi vinegar lactic I mean, maybe I have but I haven't. I haven't made it myself. So I don't know. Look, it doesn't harm you at all to call up terrorist bias or modernist pantry. It just matters pantry carry that. I have no idea anyway, call them up. Get yourself a bag of lactic acid. It's not that expensive. It's powder form. I used to get liquid form but it's a pain to deal with. Don't get that just get the powder form because it stays around forever. And sprinkle it in and you know, it really does add it depends on how you think about it. Sometimes people think of it like your sausage. Sometimes people think of it like sauerkraut depends on what it's added to. I'm assuming if you add it to cabbage, it's gonna taste like sauerkraut. You know, I happen to really love sauerkraut. And so my feeling not having done side by side taste test is you're not going to get the same sort of complex, delicious flavors. From a quick pickle that you are from an actual fermentation to produce As lactic acid bacteria on the other hand, quick pickles can just be fresh and delicious tasting and there's no reason why they can't have a lactic acid flavor as well as the vinegar flavor, right. So, you know, you know, I don't believe in things necessarily using them just a shortcuts but I definitely believe in doing something that's going to make it more delicious. And so if it's delicious product that you stand behind, and I think it's a good idea, you know. along the same vein, there's shocking slow roasted or braised meats and an ice bath affect the reabsorption of juices into the meat, I often slowly braised slabs of bacon or other meats wrapped in plastic and foil in the oven at temperatures between 202 50 Fahrenheit, I was under the impression that during the cooling process, they reabsorbed some juices that may have secreted during the cooking, it would speed things up for me to be able to plunge them into an ice bath after braising in order to children quickly, what Marie worries me is that this would affect the overall outcome of the product in terms of juiciness, it absolutely will. absolutely will. This is one of the things that we do in the Suvi class, every time we run it is we show the effect of cooling on pieces of meat if they're too rapidly cooled. And this goes back to something I learned maybe 677 years ago from Bruno Gu so kind of one of the grandfather's of, you know, low temperature cooking is that you want to cool meats relatively slowly, in order to have them reabsorb juices properly. And then once they get much below about 50 degrees Celsius, they stopped reabsorbing juices, and so you want to ramp the temperature from cooking down relatively slowly. Now, I'll tell you what he recommends, Bernard also recommends and we've done side by side, well, I'll tell you what he recommends he recommends you take a product out of your cooking bath, and you just leave it in on the counter in air on the counter for let's say it's a thick product like you're talking like a bacon slab 20 minutes, then throw it into tap water for 20 minutes, because the air is not a very good conductor, it's going to heat it cooled it relatively slowly. Tap Room Temperature tap water is much better conductor is going to start dropping it down a little more rapidly. After that 20 Throw it in ice. And it will get all the way down in a relatively quick and safe amount of time without having to worry about you know whether it's going to be chilled properly or not. That's a Bruna. Gusau recommends and we've tested various regimes from throwing it directly in ice like you recommend or not recommend that you ask about and then versus just going on the counter for 20 minutes and then an ice for versus the full Gousto on the counter then in water than in ice. And there's not that much of a difference between the full Gousto and just leaving it on the counter for 20 minutes and then throwing it in ice. So if you have to admit that step you can but there is a marginal difference in his method is marginally better. There. The full goose Oh, okay. I also have a small sandwich business, he writes, I would like to make a cheese sauce to serve over a braised beef sandwich. I'm looking for a more temperature stable solution than any traditional Mornay sauce. For those of you out there who don't not have to Mornay is basically a bastion valve. So you take a rule like a flour and butter. You cook it, you add milk typically they would score the milk beforehand, but I don't think it's really necessary because milk that we use has been pasteurized, right? And then that thickens up when it comes to the boil. Usually you cook it off now for like 20 minutes to get rid of any residual starchy and flour flavors. And then towards the end you Stir in cheese to make delicious cheese sauce. Like you know, classic would be Greek air something like that, right? It's just as like square because she likes all kinds of like fun Dewey Swissy kind of crap. She's like she loves like Italians and Swiss right? Food. Yeah. And people are like you're the one always come to the coming to the defense of the Swiss people. I make fun of them because they're neutral and you'd like no, they're great. Culture mostly, but not the people. So you don't like Swiss people. You going on record saying you don't like Swiss people. I like some Swiss people. Just curious. I was asking, Okay, where was more than a sauce. Okay. Ideally, I would like to be able to make this sauce ahead of time and just heat it up for service without having to worry too much about it breaking. I'm not sure if it matters but I would like to incorporate cheddar. He should have said I would like to incorporate delicious cheddar into the sauce. My goals are more delicious version of cheese was made from actual cheese. I'm not at all adverse to adding strange chemicals into the mix. I just wasn't I want the main flavor to come from actual cheese ie not from processed cheese. Any thoughts or ideas? This would be a great assistance. Thanks, Matthew. Okay, look. We've all had cheese sauce go granny. Right.