Cooking Issues Transcript

Episode 348: A Turkey that looks like a Bird

this program is brought to you by Jewel sous-vide by chefsteps Joule takes the guesswork out of cooking learn more at chefsteps.com Joule listening to Heritage Radio Network we remember supported food radio network broadcasting over 35 weekly shows live from Bushwick Brooklyn join our hosts as a lead you through the world of craft brewing behind the scenes of the restaurant industry inside the battle over school food and Beyond find us at Heritage Radio Network. Org

computer system

extremely late today because we had a we had our weekly China call which we can't do on Tuesdays anymore nastase are weekly call to okay to be more precise to our team in China we're not calling the entire country of China

nastassia the hammer Lopez how you doing so good yeah we got man the booth how you doing I'm doing great. Calling your questions but make him grief because we only have like whatever today for 97212 wait at 718-497-2128 so after the radio program today nastassia we need to do some Bob's Red Mill talking specifically they want me to talk about amaranth flour and sorghum flour do you know what I'm super sick of in general I'm sure it does. I'm sure you hate this as well to pay the bill I don't know why we got to pay the bills honesty but we have to pay the bills but I know that like when someone gives you a recipe for like a gluten-free flour what do they always freaking say what's the thing they always say just like regular are they never say that because it's untrue what are they saying do you pay attention to the world

okay so we are on the call the hospitality business she cares about people well that's not what I heard this morning on the telephone because of how exhausted calls into this car which I which by the way hard enough to hear because they're connecting on Skype and like I don't know whether that you know Chinese Mainland government isn't slick enough to not like when they're listening in on whatever our engineer is saying like his connection is the worst Connection in the in the universe constantly we can never hear what he's saying ever nastassia meanwhile is on speakerphone in the middle of the New York City street cuz she's walking to Pasta flyer whatever and I couldn't do the call my house because you didn't want them to hear they might they already asleep so then she shows up and she starts yelling at her employee

like like worse than I yell at my kids when it's like the same effort they've done everything she's like

he's mopping in the dark mopping the restaurant front-of-house in the dark because if I feel and then I'm like hey person's name person's name he has his headphones on so loud he cannot hear me so that just raises my anger level of course before as he knows he's there alone so why wouldn't he mopping in the darkest and then I sat down to do a call and then I was like it's dark

yeah but the tone of voice is stassi a used like honestly if I was that dude I would have been like this lady wants me to quit I'm going to quit right now like oh my God this. CA nastassia should have been arrested for what she said to UPS like honestly you're not allowed to physically threaten people although good news Amazon is going to have three headquarters not just to stare so like they're going to have their Seattle headquarters or whatever the hell they are and then remember they're going to have their to Country-Wide search for where they're going to put their second headquarters well they decide to do to one outside of Virginia and one the stassia in Long Island City so now you can physically go over there and and choke out somebody at Amazon

Google hears like a good health tip like do not do business with Nastasia and then move within choking range

she will find you I honestly I can't believe that you weren't that you weren't like a no police showed up at your door I know that she made to the UPS first time I felt bad about things I said

I believe you have a caller on the air

hey Dave is such a formal Danica are you doing

I'm good so I picked up the cooking Around the World Series that you guys have a great great right volume in flavored Mead from Scandinavia okay

yeah he never made it right now basically it's just lemon sugar and active dry yeast mean it's like it's got yeah I know it's like why why is my AC need but I might use honey Enlightenment wines I mean the thing is is that obviously if it's Scandinavian back in The Giver read Beowulf there's meat all up and down in Beowulf it's all everywhere the Mead benches yet

you would have no idea how much ABV it will turn out to be a top of my head you can just look up you know Brix to potential alcohol and then you can just convert the the sugar to potential alcohol because it's the thing the Brewers worry about constantly so or anyone that is doping in Sugar I just again I just don't happen to have it off the top of my head I know that the one I ferment orange juice

I ferment pretty much I have to add sugar to it and it starts out at around 11 brakes so 11% Sugar by weight and I have to add sugar to it so it's not one to one so if you want let's say 8% alcohol you're going to need more than 8% sugar I think but again it's been a long time since I run the calculations but easily doable thing on any one of the Brewers sites Brix to potential alcohol scales what they called because they don't know if you're going to ferment dry or not so obviously any residual sugar that you leave is is potential alcohol that you didn't convert

okay yeah so what I'm doing right now is like I was thinking about other varieties once I get started and will probably be like crazy is good I mean the good thing about orange is the residual acidity that's in orange juice is nice and the residual it's Claire I use clarified of course I've never tried on clarified and their residual bitterness it's in clarified orange juice is nice watches for men to dry it doesn't end till last so you can't mean the flavor of it I didn't like as much when it been aged for 3-4 months as when it was no pressure on the order of like a couple weeks old after the initial primaries done that one problem if you haven't done a lot of fermenting before is you'll probably have a tendency to make it too acidic on the beginning and then once it ferments dead dry it's going to be extraordinary really tart because the sugar will be gone unless you don't

Let the dead dry you could do a partial fermentation in which case residual acidity is more your friend is that make sense you know what this is the first time I'm making any sort of alcoholic beverage what do you mean like the sugar that's in there right it as you can forward it to alcohol than a there won't be anymore at that that Sugar will be gone away so you know like when I do deciders and and and other things I tend to try to ferment almost all of the sugar away other people prison search techniques and cider making call Keven there's all sorts of techniques to try to stop the fermentation at you know at some point and mid-cycle so that but you know and sometimes things will just get stuck so they'll be a lot of residual sugar like the fermentation will just end for you know a number of reasons the East is inhibited by something or in fact honey a lot of

Mead funeral first time Mead makers will have problems with their distillation it's called getting stuck and so you'll end up with a higher you know proportion of sugar and less there for alcohol but if you are going to ferment something until it is completely dry so it's all the sugar is gone then just have to take into account the fact that you know the acidity will taste you know. Moving how much more present than then you might expect it yeah

best recommendation as to an inexpensive meat grinder

I don't have a I don't have a good one I have the KitchenAid one and I don't really like it I hate it right some people buy that and yes no game some people will use that I believe it with its check I think that like when it was built the old one that the hand grinder that's Lean Like A casting but you know I don't have any good luck with that I should research inexpensive I mean I know is I don't have it there was this stuff that I do when I grind it I just don't like it I just think it's loklo quality Seattle catavina like the thing with the KitchenAid attachment is it smears so easily so you have to like cut things into into long strips me everyone that owns a real grinder loves it

like so I've used for instance the inexpensive sausage stuffers from places like Grizzly by which is not only know the catalog and it works fine it's not as well put together as the more professional ones like the wells are really crappy and the grinds on the welder really crappy so presumably it's more difficult to sanitize they also have relatively inexpensive Grinders that may be good but I just don't have any personal experience with his kind of is grizzly grizzly like they're mainly a tool company but they also cater to Hunter's right and until Hunters have to process a lot of sausage so they have sausage I don't have to but they do so they have things like sausage stuffers and meat grinders and they tend to be cheaper than Bass Pro which also sells these things or Cabela's which also sells he sings so you know like it once it's being sold into a professional kitchen the prices go way up but when it's sold to a

obvious or a hunter or something like this who still has been need for professional grinding abilities the price can come way down now the quality probably also comes down but if you're not using it every day in service dance probably not you know not that big of a deal but I doubt you're going to have anything that's going to let you know rival like the you know the butt-kicking hobart's that you know we had back at the school you know what I mean yeah yeah thanks a lot for Adela even though it should have turned out like 7 years ago so you can get away with almost anything

this program is brought to you by Jewel sous-vide my name is Katie Mossman wadler I'm the executive director of HR n and a real-life juul user I use juul to help me host the most delicious dinner parties when you cook with Jewel there zero guesswork the steak chicken seafood turkey vegetables and eggs all come out exactly the way you like them the parrot app is super intuitive and has a great visual Dennis guide jewel is awesome for prepping many perfect portions making it easy to cook for a crowd and it's hands-free so you can focus on entertaining while juul does the work and pro tip jewel is also great for travel I threw mine in my suitcase if I'm headed to a rental house with any kind of Uncertain kitchen from perfect steak to juicy tender Thanksgiving turkey juul makes the best food you've ever tasted just be sure to save some room for

darza pumpkin pie Jewel perfect food every time to get yours visit chefsteps.com Jewel and use code h r n as in Heritage Radio Network to get $15 off for a limited time that's chefsteps.com Joule code hrn it says hello and it's not going to Davis from Sam and Chicago I love the show looking for an alternative to the sous vide turkey this year you mention a method where you spatchcock a bird lay it over a pile of stuffing and blasted in a hot tub I've listened to every episode and I can't remember if it was a new one or an old one I can't find the spec would you mind going over this again sure so you can do depend on how much you take out your going to speed up the cooking more or less but if you're willing to the thing about it is as you can make something that looks relatively bird shaped thing I don't like about a lot of like the classic kind of roulade things is they don't end up looking like

courage which is okay if you're a French person but not okay if you're doing American kind of a a Thanksgiving so what you can do is just cut along the backbone and cuddle on the backbone kind of on either side and rip it out and then you can even rip out some of the you can rip out you know that the internal carcass of the of the bird there it's a lot easier than doing in prison when I use was doing the turkey where I'd have to put the exoskeleton in I would have to do is called Inside Out boning where you roll the bird apart and remove the scale without making a cut in the meat at all and that takes a long time on a turkey a lot longer than it does on a smaller bird like a quail especially if you have nastassia Lopez sitting next to you pestering you about how long it take new member on me and you are mine David taking you a long time on of the freaking Frozen freaking turkey trying to inside-out bone it so it looks good on TV and stassi is doing nothing but sitting there the stassi is very good at sitting there and pushing your buttons

well you have a sharp knife in your hand she's the worst worst anyways so this is much easier you just cut out the backbone and then like kind of pry it open Snap the joints at the at the let you know at the legs and at the wings rip out those bones you can take out you know I owe you can leave the rest of the bones in really but then so you have those bones now you can roast them off and make a gravy with them which is what I would do so then you make a a stuffing shaped kind of Mound and me sorry I'm a bird cavity shaped Mound on you know on a tray or whatever and then you roast that or cook it or what I typically do is I'll make it like a bag and I'll make it to plug like sous-vide almost of that and I'll cook the stuffing as its own kind of thing like a football and then I'll have it hot really hot like you know hot like you know steaming temperature and then you'll have your bird and because you've taken

the bones out it's going to most bones I was going to cook relatively quickly also the stuffing is already at cooking temperature so you don't need to get it hot it's already hot and it's already been made safe then you can drape the bird over the stuffing in the shape of a bird by the way you can also Bryant it already injected Brian into the breast and what not and you can drape it and ride it if you want you should dry the skin drape it over the stuffing and it Cooks relatively quickly not as quickly as like the actual flat pressed spatchcock against a sheet tray which is the absolute fastest way to cook it but it's again it's going to look like a flat turkey and not like a turkey turkey from Thanksgiving till this is from gas Herbert I am writing after I'm done some research on peppercorn infusions which it seems to be little material online especially in the gastronomic application

interested in occurred to me that you may know about this stuff after reading through a liquid intelligent mean I have a pepper infusion in the in the book the stuff you're not that monstrosity is open the but once I don't know do you have to pay for itself is not useful as toilet paper or as a Kleenex say thank you you look to see whether I thanked you or not and I was at fishy's open the first three pages miracle I love you use of interesting spices and relate to your perfectionism here at Aquia West African fine dining restaurant in London my question is when it comes to infusing Peppercorns and spices and non-alcoholic solution such as milk or water what is the ideal temperature and time for Infusion and what scientifically speaking of the consequences of going above or below this temperature / time take as an example peppercorns clothes and star anise with by the way our friend Leanne Wong I said was her pornstar name which is amazing right Starry Eyes

she said it wouldn't be star anus well mispronouncing and that's why aren't you at we had another woman at the French culinary who used to mispronounced something in a horrifying with I can't say it online but like literally whenever she opened her mouth and said these words are stocks are like boom arm away and like and like it was like it was like you know when you see the shockwaves you see the skin like in slow-mo and like the cheeks are like getting flashover like going to do this explosion shlomo's it was like that in the station's like would 90 degrees Centigrade for 2 hours be too high too long at all the best so look a lot depends only tell you what the variables are first of all milk whole milk by the way or as my grandpa like to sit like

milk because he did not admit that skim milk wasn't fact milk 98 so they have it until that there are self-hate right whatever to the point being that milk is a good choice because it has some fat and a lot of these spices especially specifically black pepper the the actual nice flavors in it like people being and all the other all the other good kind of Air Mags all the stuff not extremely soluble in water which is why and also its volatile stuff so Jeffrey steingarten you know our friend Jeffrey steingarten who by the way all the younger people out there if you haven't read the man who ate everything you should go ahead and read that Seminole Seminole book and its subject in a very early person of that kind of kind and you know what kind of a curmudgeon in the more than kind of a curmudgeon

Saigon anyways

point being he was like Dave why do you add pepper early on in Houston who to call me you would literally he would just call nastassia and me and just yell at us for our practices even though he had like me we would not have seen him in like a year and he would just call us to start yelling at us right and still has to come up on our phone and be like it's your turn. Because it was going to be like 8 hours and then yelling at us about X Y or Z why do you add pepper early on in cooking all that's left at the end is the bitterness and none of the great aromatics why do you add it at the end and I was like Jeffrey I like those better notes why can't I add it to the times yet no response right so the problem with pepper is 1 a lot of special things like soups is a lot of those like awesome aromatic compounds or one volatile and to not super soluble in water they should be more soluble in the fat in the butterfat that's in milk I think right so then there's there's two things that are going on there's loss of all those because it doesn't like

literally evaporating right and there's a loss of all those because it's also just not infusing into whatever liquid you're using and then there is the actual destruction of the of those flavors and Aromas due to the heat so you know you have to separate some of these things so in a sealed system where there's no are right it might be possible to have a higher temperature and because you're not volatilize anything because it's sealed maybe it's possible to keep those things in solution if they actually want to dissolve into it right so you might run into a situation there where it's good so 90° C in milk in on a stovetop you probably will evaporated a lot of those bottles and they won't be there right so I read a study that even just give grinding temperature that you use right with you if you you know refrigerant you grind refrigerated or frozen Pepper with dry ice bro black pepper vs. grinding it at a higher temperature because of the friction of grinding like let's say 40 50 50 degrees

Celsius results in a huge loss in the volatile compounds presumably to the atmosphere because you can smell them right not presumably do to autologous where the stuff is breaking itself apart so I think in other words it might be possible in a sealed container to get a decent higher-temperature extraction pepper but I don't know for sure you got to run some tests the other thing you could do is try to do in fusions under high pressure at lower temperatures even in the milk and something like an easy under a new high pressure like you know 10 bar or so 10:11 bar something there right and then you could do a side-by-side with it with heat things like doing a side-by-side and kind of seeing what what what you get not yet when they have a show at 1 and you have to record a cat's not even here yet right there

it is I believe 521 cranberry fresh cranberry to vodka it might be 41 but I believe it's 5 to 1 and then just blend it with a SPL spit it out had a butter popcorn rum is literally just you know poor like are pop some popcorn for the rum over it you know I think it's you know it's a it's a lot we just do it let it sit there for like 2 3 hours straight off press the hell out of it melt butter keep the butter yesterday and it doesn't take that much butter frankly I don't have the numbers off top my head stir it let it stay liquid with like what you called immersion circulator for overnight covered she not losing everything and then freeze it straight and then someone was going to try to make activated charcoal with rye bread but I don't think it's going to work and I'll talk more about it next week heaven

activated charcoal is very difficult to make and I would look at the books there are online activated charcoal how different and complicate it is from just plain charcoal and once you turn into charcoal it won't taste like rye bread anymore unless it's just something you really want to do now on to Bob's Red Mill because what we started to talk about to begin the shows we never finished his believe this into the ads are know what I was going to try to get nastase to say that I hate is when people like you'll get your pancakes will you pancakes muffins or cookies because obviously I do that all the time I add oats to my pancakes so I've been trying to work with these products to try to see if I can make something that is interesting but anyway I'm not a hundred percent successful yet but I have run a lot of tests I was working on a scrapple AAA sorghum based

scrapple serving base biscuits and Joe are Roti stuff anyway so we'll talk about it later more next week I got to record some add make some money Bob's Red Mill cooking issues

thanks for listening to Heritage Radio Network food radio supported by you for a freshest content and to hear about exclusive events subscribe to our newsletter and to your email at the bottom of our website Heritage Radio Network. Org connect with us on Facebook Instagram and Twitter at Heritage underscore radio Heritage Radio network is a nonprofit organization driving conversations to make the world a better Ferrer more delicious place and we couldn't do it without support from listeners like you want to be a part of the food world's most Innovative Community rate the shows you like tell your friends and please join our community by becoming a member just click on the Beating Heart at the top right of our homepage thanks for listening