Cooking Issues Transcript

Episode 347: One Spinzall, Zero Kitchen Knives.

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I'm HR ends executive director Katie moseman weather for the preview of this week's episode of meat and three are weekly food news Roundup this week we're looking at the way labels shape our perspectives on food I know you're not supposed to judge a book by its cover but is it acceptable to judge a wine by its label there's some labels that I'd say are so bad they're good quality paper Works in good shape you'll get a grass-fed label tune into this week's meat-and-three on Heritage Radio Network that's meet plus sign three available wherever you listen to podcasts

Bridge radio network every Tuesday April 8th December I was early last time so the average it out it's my normal time of noonish to like you know one's what end up in the same box and door ajar and or sprinkle over the same Ocean Race ya calling all of your election or food-related questions to 718-497-2128 that's 718-497-2128 today is election day stassi is not yet voted what about you Matt

the first thing I did this morning I got up voted got a bagel nice how is the bagel it was totally adequate and inadequate Bagel is so sad can tell you the worst thing I've done in years I bought a bagel at a supermarket for my children for those either don't live in the greater New York area or any other area that has you know a high enough concentration with a real kind of Jewish culture

Supermarket bagels are garbage I don't know why it is that supermarkets can't produce a decent Bagel or get someone who can produce a decent Bagel to ship it to them but even a relatively high end Supermarket or one that attempts to be high end their bagels are by and large wretched you know what I'm saying like why is that I don't know why are why is it that like this is like my kids whenever we travel there like I'm going to get a bagel I'm like we're in the middle of nowhere the bagels are not going to be good it's just going to be like poorly made bread Donuts are going to suck you don't I mean it stops you ever had a good bagel like an is like you know in a non Bagel zone now are there good bagels in LA

I've never I've not been to Montreal with many years but even the Montreal bagel I'm looking at it look at it with a little bit of side eye because they don't put salt in their bagels like everything else sounds great you don't even like that a wood-fired ovens nanny nanny poo poo all of that the culture of the history all we make great smoke this nut no-salt we had a discussion before nastassia like you know they're the Tuscany of bagels weird you already have a collar that's all right with your fan base is nice well it's been well to be fair we should have been on the earth 25 minutes

it is it's it's not from Mystic yet

I did a mother this morning what's up

so I'm in the process of upgrading my knives right and I bought The Duo Shark down the DMT that you recommend buying extra time and with the hand sharpening before I actually take that are good knives right and I can't tell if like my existing knives are so crappy that I can't get a good at Dunham's or if I'm just bad at hand sharpening so I wanted to know if you have any tips and tricks to get the most out of the duo sharp I mean

how are they standing there like I think I want to stamped garbage so it's been so strong or adopt you know is like I just I didn't think good knives are that important but now if you know I'm almost 40 though I got to kind of Step Up So they kind of Veggie crucial thing is one to get and there's many many schools of thought on this right but in general you're going to want to take the rubber side of the Stone

there are people who say that you need an even course or stone if the edge needs to be taken down a lot I don't really really believe that I think that's where it's crap I mean people who put very rough edges on things like use literally like large flat plate Grinders like spinning play Grinders which I don't recommend you do with with your Nuys but if you're on the fine side which is the red side right the main thing is to just kind of you know I put some some glasses on her magnifier take a look at the edge of your knife right so in a forge or even someone to an extent of gas in stamp knives write the body of the knife has its own kind of angle and then when you get down towards The Cutting Edge there's the ground in it should not grounded has its own angle right now if you believe the old old school old old old school people who are dealing with that I don't think nasseri like that

super Hi-Tech steel people do this anymore but it used to be at the very very very cutting-edge there was yet another another angle right in the idea it was Hugo Chino to hear you go becomes a kind of larger and larger become more and more sturdy but because it's smaller and smaller it's still sharp that makes sense so like the old school people would you at first and make sure that the body of your blank had the correct kind of angle and they're no good ones can you know be concave they go down or you can have whatever the hell you need but then you have your actual Cutting Edge bevel that bevel is the one that we talked about and we're talkin about Like a western-style Knife which is equal on both sides right versus a japanese-style traditional Japanese which is basically flat on one side and angles on the other two that initial Cutting Edge has that kind of most important thing to kind of get right so you have to look at it with a pair of glasses the old school or what they would do it windy

learning is he would take a sharpie or something like this and you'd Mark along that Cutting Edge and then you just take a light swipe and then you look at it again and you can see if you're hitting to Eldridge if you're if you're at the back of the of the knife is too high until you're making you know you know too large of an included angle they're right you'll notice that you're taking off only metal at the very edge of your of your blade likewise if you're too shallow if the back of your blade is too close to your cutting Stone then you'll notice that you're taking off metal that is much closer to the body of the knife itself and you're not taking off anything that's on the edge and when you get that when you get that angle just right you should be wiping that Sharpie off relatively evenly across the entire Cutting Edge right and that's a good way of figuring out like kind of what the angle of your knife is now if you want to change that angle right you can go more

aggressive so that the smaller the angle is out in other words that The Closer the back of the Blade is to the stone is your sharpening the sharper and quotes you'll be but that more fragile your blade will be at The Cutting Edge will be and the more easy likely will be to crack or chip or or roll over right to the first thing you got to do is see what you're getting your angle right I think people freak out about getting their angle exactly right but if you just pick up your knife and do long strokes and try to keep the angle relatively constant over the length of the stroke you don't have to be some you know like Seventh Generation Master Japanese sharpener to be able to properly sharpen a kitchen knife size wouldn't get that worked up about it but the key thing is is that once you find that angle and you and you go you have to keep going until you have done was called form a barrier along the entire edge of the blade and so if you can you look on your glasses you'll notice that like once you have sharpened it down the edge will become very

racing at the end and almost what's go roll up or form a burr on the side that's facing facing up right now decided facing the stone the side is facing up and you should do one side at a time while you're starting right and then what you'll do is you can run your your thumb like starting like you know I'm from the dull side down across the across the edge right and you'll feel something that catches on your thumb field and then flip it over you'll feel what it feels like on an on Burnside and should feel different you caught the edge as you go down so you'll see that you would call the form of corn Bieber on the edge of your head all the way down and a lot of times if you haven't sharpen your knife in a long time or if your night has been bent what you'll notice his his you'll get a bird cage in a couple of places like maybe you'll get a burger near the point maybe you'll get some in the middle in the belly but you're missing some in the front and a lot of times that's because you're nice with indented or whatever but you need to get that bread along the entire line of your

you're a jerk you're not going to not going to win right then that's what I felt like it was either like on opposing sides like there was a burger on one side and then the other basically what you just like I was wondering if that was possible so the time to do relatively long strokes at take up a and the Japanese don't do this Japanese do little small areas and circling when they're doing their initial stuff right so they don't do that but for me I find that I get a more you know it's easier for me if I focus on the area that needs focusing on and so I'll do mostly straight push it is right to get that area and shape but then I try to do some like slide pushes that kind of engage more of the blade so that I'm not like effing up one part of the blade you know and then you're not the other if you know cuz you can overhaul on one side and then then you have to take a whole knife down to that

once you get a good burger Edge on one side right assuming you're not too far gone you get one good bread and then you flip it over and you do the bird once you do that then you can switch to the Firestone and you need to the trick when you're doing this is to do fine or lighter and lighter pressure as you go so if your first hits are relatively aggressive write your last couple of hits where you're going on the on the two sides should be just the weight of the knife really do you know what I mean and then I'll I also you know if I have the time or if I have the stuff I'll stop it I like reverse drop it's knocking ebers off of it or even just take it on my on my apron or sometimes and just like knock you know you know like draw the other way to knock off you know the last cuz that can really increase the durability of your blade now I used to back when I used to know guys and if you're interested in it you can buy a cheap guide like they're expensive guides

like I was at I forget the names and I have one right like those things and they're good to try out so you can see what it's like to have like a like an extremely like machine mainly machine guided accurate Edge so you can see what the difference is and it really there pain in the ass they really are useful and in fact you know what I'm going to go ahead and maybe recommend that you try one or you can use Edge sharp is another cheaper guy that likes hunting knife people used the razor's Edge people put that out like you know decades ago and that was the first guy that I ever owned and I have their book which although it's outdated I think it's still good to Razor's Edge guided sharpening he's the guy that I had the world record in speed shaving with a double bit axe yeah you heard me right speed shaving with a double bit axe but information is probably outdated but yeah that's kind of where I learned to sharpen

and he actually recommends a two-part sharpening so you take it down to a good Edge and then you do a secondary small Sharpening at a higher angle just to make him what he calls more durable it but I don't think very many people do that anymore I think that's kind of may be falling by the wayside or like you know what's more important with older kind of steals but I'm going to go ahead and say that it might be fun for you and worth the time and energy to buy one of those sharpening Riggs like The Edge Pro just so you can see just so you can see what it's like to take something down to like a you know what kind of mechanically perfect Ed you can see it right and then once you've done that a bunch then I think you will be able to hand sharpen more easily right it's it's kind of like the way they teach welding in Reverse where they make you learn the hard stuff first and then and then teach you the easy stuff like Meg instead of reverse I think you should learn the easy stuff first so you can get a feel for the tool first you note 4 for like what you're doing and then

move on to the hardest up at this point in my life it's so much easier to pull out the the sharpening stone and just you know touch up my knives then it is to haul out the Edge Pro bolt it down to the freaking table choose the grid set the night put the thing you shoot shoot shoot shoot shoot shoot shoot shoot you don't like please you know that's like 10 minutes of my life and like you know story. Whereas like literally you know before I kind of steak I'll pull out my stone I like Shoop Shoop Shoop Shoop Shoop Shoop Shoop Shoop Shoop stop stop done you know what I mean like real fast for a touch-up you know what I'm saying and if you ever get into Japanese nice you're going to need to be good with hand sharpening because I mean you just need to you know because they require they require more constant Focus prior to every use and once you get good with the sharping stone you'll get in the habit of just doing like a light touch up on the extra fine just before you use every time in that and if my opinion problem may be right I may be wrong with my opinion that does that super light

search up beforehand is helpful in maintaining kind of the longevity of of like a really nice Edge

yeah so that's that was the other thing I was going to ask is like how frequently do you do the the full episode of sharpening routine into it snow cast iron pot then you need to do that right now it's been taking a long time because you might have to take chips out of it you know what I mean a lot a lot depends you know my butcher used to tell me never to put knives in the dishwasher but he was like afraid that the heat does something but I think it's more just the knife banging around in the dishwasher is reason not to do it but now and plus the handles made of wood I'd like to hear some good arguments on not using a dishwasher on a modern knife as long as it was isolated so it wouldn't knock around I'd like to hear the arguments I don't know what do you think it'll Buy

I will so I bought a Mac 1/8 inch Mac Chef Japanese chef knife bevel very very fast you know Petty and another Mac are good I like them for some of the European style ankles and I've owned I've owned some old-school sabates I really liked you know I think you should call my dad actually has an old bikes about the eyeslicer yeah but I want to I was curious if it would be possible to rehab that that thing is like really beat up I found it in my drawer in the back and I was wondering if an EMT at a thrift store for $3 I love that knife

yeah and it came right now you can bring that thing back where is so easy to sharpen because and everything but it's stuff is so easy to sharpen those guys you sharpen it with like the worst stones in the world think about it you don't even like they don't maintain their Edge you have to sharpen them a lot but they're very easy to shower and I kind of like them you know what I mean at one last thing o get a 10 inch knife

okay you won't regret it all right all right all right up there right now

oai hey great to be talking to you guys

show about 3 weeks ago and I kind of didn't eat. I've been really into it so thanks for what you guys made and I got my girlfriend really into it so now she talked to you about you guys liked all the time

true liquid intelligence for my birthday last week interesting to me and say you won't sell me one so first of all how dare you if I were to try and a copper slug first mentioned in the book set

that some drinks like it doesn't affect it, it actually is kind of husband and son it just makes it tastes awful like a sound like a contest to translate what drinks like so put a piece of copper in your mouth and then drink and you'll get kind of an idea now you don't want to have copper in contact too long with acids in general right because it'll formula a certain amount of kind of toxic copper salts but it's not really in contact with it that long and it's boiling so hard that I doubt you're even getting that much contact with me but just to get an idea taste like you like you're sucking on a like an old-school Penny you know what I mean a little bit so like with certain I've you know I've had it taste okay in mulled wines you know and nails and I used to do like a glug recipe where we throw the red hot poker in

does red hot pokers is look they're inherently freaking dangerous and even if it wasn't for that they burn out you and I mean so like I'd sell someone and you know nastase and I don't want to have to deal with you know when they break a saying what we told you they were going to break you want to do that

by saying that is not going to be that the secret Booker and Dax next item absolutely not back the last time I was in China or two times ago when I was in China I spoke to someone about trying to manufacture one even for the bar because I I had to go make them again you know for a while Piper was working with us and Piper would make them now that you know Piper's has been here for years now I have to make them again I hate making them because it's Port look maybe making the 50th red hot pokers boring I haven't learned anything new XS not true I change the recent Bachelor did I just made 10 last week I was trying to figure out how to integrate them into the bar I spoke to someone in China about manufacturing it but it was that thing that where they clearly didn't understand what I wanted and just like I was just projecting months into the future of trying to tell somebody what I wanted and then that person not really caring about my problem and like not really giving me what I wanted and that the level of like I felt my I felt like months of Audrey 2 compressed into just 20

chance of looking into this guy's eyes when I wasn't there at the trade show in China and I just said to myself nope real heartache because you have to rely on so many people that don't think about it the way that you think about it anyways but you better have a very very high output stove or put it on a high output still and then hit it with a torch for a while to adjust to heat that slug up and you're not going to get ignition with it the way that you get with a red hot poker however you might be able to get an ignition if you have an open flame Source next to it and you poke it with extremely hot slub I have not tested that

what are you going to put the flame sword lights like direct it at it or it just like have it nearby know if you like since you stick the slug into the into the drink and then bring the lip of the glass under and there's an open flame bar sparker there it should light because you superheated alcohol vapor and it's going to be coming out kind of violently and it'll light up but really like you should be careful in the only real injury we've ever had with a red hot poker was one of our bartenders years and years ago the glass blew up right that was the problem the glass blew up and just you know from the thermal shock is glass you know what I mean and I told me happened once but then that shattered and it burnt his hand and so then we made holder so now the bartender hold like I got a handle and the glasses at the end of the handle so even if the glass breaks it doesn't like explode it just goes down I freaks some people out with the red

poker failing I remember we used to have it at the at the French Culinary Institute and those guys definitely did not want to do the red hot poker and that they used to freak them out all the time and they would occasionally you know I would say what are the words we use fail spectacularly but

it's rare and you know the main thing when you're doing an electric red hot poker with failure is there is conditioning it for first use once you conditioning for first use it's pretty safe like most of the danger is if you don't condition it properly because it can overheat itself and blow out but whatever you know I deal with it I have not had good luck with the rocks and the other problem with the Rocks is that the hot rocks and are sitting in your drink right see you throw the Rock and then you have a hot rock in a drink and so now what me The Rock State School right I would try that that the copper slug it's easy to buy an easy to try so you can get an idea for it just let it heat for a long time you can put like a little insulating blanket over the thing to kind of keep the heat in like you can get a very very high temperature insulation blanket and just throw it over the poker when it's on the stove top and that will that will allow you to kind of heat it up

don't read which is kind of where you want to be and then you can kind of get into the fun of playing with these with these drink but just be aware it'll have a little bit of a copper taste today's program was brought to you by lecreuset the first to Pioneer colorful enamel cookware over 90 years ago they've been a favorite for Generations through the meals and memories the cookware creates in the style that expresses my name is Kat Johnson and the communications director at Heritage Radio Network when I'm not making food radio I'm making food and my favorite cookware is the 8 quart marine blue Dutch oven that never leaves my stove top before we got our lecreuset the cook where we used most often with an antique Griswold cast iron pan it didn't take long for me to realize how much I've been missing enamel cast iron in my life lecreuset has a superior heat retention of cast-iron but pair with the unparalleled perform

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I don't I'm doing great thanks I had a quick question for you

yeah so mangostee so the real question on like a mangostine for instance is I've never eaten the seeds right so I don't know I don't know if you were a like I don't know I don't know what kind of Technology have and be I don't know how much damage it will do to the Jews to smash those seeds up and then try to get the stuff out later you know what I mean I know when we're doing stuff like concord grapes we don't blend the fruit or like due to intense of a hard core of a juicing to go to Mass cane juicer just because we release all of the astringent and out of the seeds and it ruins what is otherwise a delicious juice right yeah for things like that or I have done other big seated things in the past or things that don't want to be Blended or Juiced what I will usually do is I will just kind of

need them by hand with pectin X Ultra sp-l and that breaks up the fruit and then the seeds kind of drop out and then you can puree and or filter and or do whatever you want with the clarify wherever you're going to do to get the rest of the juice out and I've done that with like strange like life is a Senegalese fruit called mod which has a giant seed in it I've never done I've done Spanish limes which is a mamoncillo which is kind of similar strategy this way where you like throw them into a pot you hit him with enzyme and you just keep needing them you know or we are tumbling ever beat them and then the enzyme eventually eat the fruit away from the pit without having that without chewing or destroying the pit and I might do a similar I don't know what people do commercial you should look this up for you can also try a press but then you're still get me squashing us

flat you know I haven't started using our 20-ton press as a juicer yet or lot like last week like I said as a as a nut sacks washer Norwalk kind of setup yeah but bigger giant nut sacks in our in our in our press even if you're not going to use a spinzall or do anything like that I think they like hitting those with with an enzyme that breaks down pectin hemicellulose is going to be your first step to kind of getting those seeds off of their Yanni getting them out of there and like just getting the the the fruit juice to liquify

then that makes a lot of sense appreciate it and I'll try to think about it more mangosteens me to think about mangasee where do you live I'm in New York City or Garbage anyway compared to light I mean they're good but like compared to where they're actually growing mangostine never like ever bought a sack of mangosteens directly from a place that grows mangosteens oh yeah the off the back of a truck in Thailand it just doesn't get better than that right right yeah I mean I mean like once you've had that mangostine and you have like a New York City mangostine where he's been like frozen or ship you just like decent sure but I mean like compared to like I think he had thing is like people who have a mangostine here in New York City right they tasted the like that's a good fruit that's good you know what I mean but if you go if you have a

real one somewhere where they're actually growing those damn things and you have one fresh you like holy crap that is a grapefruit you know what I mean it's not like one of these it's not like one of these are not a take-it-or-leave-it fruit you know what I mean like they like when they're right you know what I mean they're like they're they're top-notch you know what I'm saying oh yeah I wonder whether you lose you know what I wonder whether they would taste good clarified clarified lychee I haven't liked it sweaty I don't like it I don't like a lot of me about lychee things like I don't know it's like kind of sweaty something something animal has sweaty I don't like about it I mean I'm willing to be willing to be convinced not but

now I never been there been a giant fan of lychee stings which I don't know like what would you like me to Nastassja in general what do you like canned lychees are those things I will give it a shot and report back 2 minutes

all I know is that you saying that now that you say that after this cuz I haven't spent enough time I was on the phone all morning with with Shana okay tell people this is Nastassja talking but some reason talking through me tell people to submit their Thanksgiving searzall techniques to why you say it's usually rolled me to my email right and then you give the you know how to film thing so tell them how to Thanksgiving searzall techniques send your videos to my email please film horizontally so they can be formatted like a human being and not know vertical vertical become one of those persons like on the news is it's so foolish I hate so foolish this question is from Pete from St Pete and I appreciate if I lose my name is Peter

miles from St Pete IV call Pete from STP for sure hey hey hey hey hey hey I need to get a pressure cooker and did some research and found that the instapot has come out or is coming out with an electric pressure cooker that maintains 15 psi while cooking call the instapot max have you seen play with or know anyone that has one of these if it maintains 15 psi will cover all of our bases that you said are probably the most electric pressure cookers is it self venting which is not a big knock against it I'll admit I like the ease of use of just hitting a button letting you go but I do plan to get induction burner soon as wondering if I should just get the country, thanks for trying by the show hundred if it he's a hundred 50 episodes through the back love of Jesus okay so the answer is I don't know I've looked into the reviews of the instapot max are not so good because the price is higher and they say it actually takes longer to cook and what that I'm assuming means is it takes longer to heat up and then longer to cool down

I'm not usually using a pressure cooker Just For Speed so that's not a problem for me I want the you know I want that kind of higher pressure and absolute amount of time to get to temperature in to get down isn't that important but most people on the internet

I have an issue with it compared to the cheaper one just because they thought it was going to be a whole lot faster because they had equated the higher pressure with faster cooking and while it is true that things will cook through faster at once you reach that temperature will also take longer for it to come back down you know off of pressure because of the extra pressure and I don't know how they're heating element Works might not you know he he is quickly but that said there a lot of things I really think 15 psi is better for their things where you can do a lower PSI and just took a lot longer I haven't done all of the test by now at the bar because people you know can't be trusted to maintain a pressure cooker they you know we use an electric one and we just cook it longer to do our dulce de coconut I haven't tested it with honey and eggs to pick up we're not using those at the bar right now so I don't know and I haven't personally personally use one the one thing I will know is they

one of the reviewers it took it upon a certain amount of time for it to cool down using the natural release method so I want to make sure that there was something you could do it and not have it take quite so long to do its natural release anyways sorry I couldn't be more help more help in Bed Stuy it's local best I love the show it's my daily Subway listening you let me to further cultivate and pursue my own curiosity is in the kitchen question you went over Deebo and rolled turkey somewhere around episode 150 but I couldn't find it a T-bone and Roll whole chicken out of Japan are there any major differences when boating on trolling a turkey I'm thinking 10 pounds of Bones I have no circulator but you have a pressure cooker electric oven and convection oven and then you a question to which I don't have time for any ideas for stuffing I'm thinking sausage homemade bread lots of spices sounds good don't forget egg exhausted I like to throw mushrooms in and I was told mandarin orange slices are bad

I love them because that's what I grew up listening on deboning a turkey the main differences are there usually bigger that usually Frozen you really want a thought you really it's very easy to lose track of where your fingers are in a semi Frozen bird when your hands feel cold and that's kind of when you get sliced Inside Out rolling boning where you don't cut the meat is a lot more difficult in a turkey because of its side but if you're just going to do it where you cut down the back and open it Japan style it's not that much more difficult than doing a chicken at the only thing it's harder is popping the joints is more difficult like when you're popping the joints out to break them out because the joints are stronger because they're bigger the main difference I think we are really going to have trouble is the tendons in turkeys are ridiculous in the legs and very hard she going to lose a lot more meat if you're ripping out the bones in Legs vs Chicken where the tendons are a lot easier to remove sew the tendons of the big thing and it starts you told me I don't have time to talk to you about how they used to have a machine that can rip attendance out and why they don't bring that back

what's important we can talk about it later next time on cooking issues

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