Cooking Issues Transcript

Episode 254: Meet Meathead

hi this is Marion that's so I'm the poet got in professor of nutrition twin studies and Public Health at New York University and a longtime fan of Heritage Radio like Marion you too can support Heritage Radio Network a member-based nonprofit radio station operating out of Bushwick Brooklyn interviewers are always really well-prepared and fun to talk to about the issues that matter to me the most about how we can change our food system to 100 in the environment is just invaluable to have an independent radio station that's dealing with these issues I think it's a wonderful wonderful support Heritage Radio Network by becoming a member today go to Heritage Radio Network. Org and click on the Beating Heart to donate

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Tuesday but my son's here at the family Jackie molecule inslee's last week here in the booth and so we don't have Jack this week either David's taking over his duties in the booth how did

you're not there are two guests are scheduled special guest and our non-specialist schedule what to do for to do my schedule first my son Dax Arnold you can call in your questions to 718-497-2128 that's 718-497-2128 but the actual guest of honor today it was Asia Minor today is Meathead Goldwyn who wrote a new book I did Satan eponymous book it's called Meathead and it was me

it was the last time I checked like the number two cookbook on Amazon which is like an amazing achievement I actually had one to what's the thing that they after the colon on a title what do they call that show me call science of great barbecue and Grilling beautiful picture of a rib to go on the cover and they said no let's put your ugly face on the cover so I've noticed he got the actual content used to be really good and two people need to want to buy and pick up at the first after a while you get word of mouth and then you could have this could come in a brown paper wrapper

my editor Maria Guarnaschelli also edited. Jim Lahey the bread Baker's but she wrote his first book that he came out with no like for the bread no knead and she added afterwards no work no work book sold more than any other bread look like call and all of your grilling related questions and or Barbeque related question that were talking this can be some of the myths and whatnot original ideas ideas grey plaid but yeah he did the first work I saw on

short penetration where he actually used a like a chemical reaction to show the actual soft penetration because the problem with I tried for a long time and you know that you did with him anything about guy obviously is dies a much larger molecule insults why you need to actually reveal the salt in it he has really brilliant that he stumbled into my website and ask me some questions and I started asking him questions and we just struck off a relationship and he has taught me so much his name is on the cover under mine it's my book that I couldn't have done it without him and he's tremendous and there's a club right there's a website but there is a Pitmaster club which is a paper member

shock part of the site which is a community and it's a lot of fun and a book has a free membership in the Pitmaster Club very interesting and good in a representation of the various

science and practical aspects frankly of first what's going on with it it's three parts right the first one is a heat and producing it the second is a meet and kind of how that works and 1/3 is equipment and then it goes in the recipe says nothing about this is that the combo of you and Professor blonder you're adding like a super kind of interesting scientific take not look boring science but like practical experiments by the way I added too kind of also years of experience and observation which is kind of an unbeatable combo in a book like that will help you think through different thicknesses different styles and so you can improvise you can make it your own

cars are like myth busted to 20 things around 21 you know the good news is this your first book because I say so you know they cost a hundred bucks and sells for10 am not worried about that I've never run a test on you want to talk about briquettes vs. lump on charcoal oh boy you picked a good one because it's made from burning chunks of wood in a low atmosphere low oxygen atmosphere so that is carbonized and becomes Char or Pure Car

in which burns efficiently in a grill and it's more natural natural so it appeals to that audience strong but when you do that you end up with chunks of wood have different size different thickness they burn unevenly and if they're not chart all the way through they can smoke it excessively and you don't know what the wood is it smoking all kinds of woods are mixed up in there and it's all I have plastic and metal things in there I don't know in there so often more control smoke I want charcoal for heat and heat only and if you use briquettes which are made from sawdust the clump together with some binders and did some people

Jack to the use of the binders but they're pretty natural products whatever that means I mean arsenic is natural use cornstarch as a binder but you have uniform size a uniform weight a uniform Quantum of heat for Brick at Weber Chimney contains 80 of those briquettes so you have exact heat and temperature control with the briquettes and everything that I'm about everything I'm curious about everything we want to do on the grill is control control heat control Fire Control smoke I have more control with briquettes and I recommend people use them it's constant year-round you have one variable fewer to deal with it for years I've just kind of out of habit gotten the lump and I was convinced I don't even need to run my own test I was convinced by reading and I'm going to go break it now just to let

everyone listen to the show already knows you do not mean the one that's impregnated with with with Garnet mineral spirits petroleum product in the Regatta Bay do giving off smell and flavor you can smell the block away you start charcoal the best way is with a chimney and it looks like a big coffee can and it's got a false bottom and you put newspaper under there worldwide of paraffin under there and it takes about 15 minutes and you wait for the charcoal to be completely asked over when it's completely asked over it's burning really hot and I'm eating very little smoke and I know people think charcoal is for smoke but what is for smoke charcoals for flavor things you know when you especially when you're exposed like in The Culinary World in a cooking school were in particular lot of Japanese chess come over and they make a big deal in a purpose so they're dealing with

very high-grade extraordinary expense Adventure Time and for them there's they're doing a different technique first of all their burning like a couple of sticks at a time I need a cool super clarifier typically indoors no dumping binchotan into a Weber ritualistic process and the they're almost uniform in sickness and if you click them together they sound like wind chimes I mean it but they're carbonize perfectly smoked problems that I see an American lump charcoal the same price as briquettes would you still go for briquettes that's the question

things in it right and the binders do create more Ash that's the one disadvantage of a cat's you get more ass out of them during a single cook is makes it harder to work at a problem for people with big green eggs the core concept that people need to learn when they're grilling Outdoors is to set the grill up into zones a hot side and a not hot side and you've got infrared radiant heat directly below the food on the hot side and the indirect side or the not hot side is warmed by circulating convection air and you can move the food back and forth as you need to do when you were controlling key you're controlling the type of energy striking to me and in a kamado that's round like the Big Green Egg

what is the generic name for what the Big Green Egg is for those who don't design and it's a small round area so it's very hard to divide it into heat zones so it makes a great lake at the temperature that I normally cook my pizza it was very difficult for me to reload it and keep it going to be green egg was only able to sustain an even heat for a long time at lower temperatures where is its competitors

they need to do some innovation in just to get that on the table right now I do almost the exact opposite style of cooking like so I come from Montana low temperature sous-vide background almost entirely all my stuff is already cooked before I go to the it to a grill and I'm using the grill mainly for finished, Pandora's to which is like in out in out in out because it acts more like a rotisserie with speed going in and out but let me tell you have hot side in any I'm not so hot outside I shoot for about 200 to 25 on the indirect heat side it's warming just by convection air and it's like sous-vide you start a big thick steak on the indirect side and gently warm it just like you would in a sous vide system and once it gets up close to finish temperature say you want me to and rare steak hundred and thirty

235 you'll take it up to about 120 on the indirect side then you lift the lid moving over the hot and putting just on the underside and slip frequently Flip Flip Flip Flip Flip grill marks you've got a great Seer and when I did side by side comparison the sous-vide product is significantly moisture and more tender but the redneck sous-vide if you will the reverse Seer technique gets more

flavor from the grill in the Smoke show me see her on one side or the other you get much better flavor development when you see her both before and after the CD the meat end up tasting cured because it's all penetrations the temperature what temperature it is when you put it on the grill afterwards after this music so many variables it's hard to like one I just think

I think we can agree on is that the best way to cook any piece of meat like that especially is a low average heat input with a very high instantaneous either continuously as a rotisserie work swear it's like intermittent but like me I think you're going to put a seizure at the beginning fine but it needs energy into the surface of meat at the start list a steak for example what happens is people don't realize it's did the hot air doesn't cook all the meat but hot air only Cooks the outside of the me once the outside of the meet starts building and storing energy like a capacitor it's the outside of the cooks the inside of the me so if you start

at the beginning on a grill you going to pound energy into the surface you going to get a great dark surface and then just below the surface you going to get a layer of brown then you going to get a layer of tan then you're going to get a layer of pink and then you're finally in the center going to get a half inch or so of perfect medium-rare where is if you start slow in either a sous-vide machine reverse sear you can get it the color really even top-to-bottom color results are related to temperature and you get perfectly cooked so backyard Weekend Warriors we took way too hot you are honest cook slow cook Lo cook gentle development as well call it quad Riyad mahrez where they actually do the two groups I detest it I've always detested

when I see GrillMarX I don't salivate I see unfulfilled potential I see a child that had great smarts and never got the college ICD-10 surface I want to see brown service I want to see it dark all over and when you Flip Flip Flip every minute or two you can get that all over even tan and brown I'm sorry thanks for calling in a minute just one more thing about feel free to chime in a time I've noticed is frankly that there's a certain minimum time for crusted halibut and that you cannot develop a crust faster than a certain rate because

how to minute on your average take to get across so it's flipping faster than that reduces the quality of the bark and flipping too slow for going to get gray so I like to flip about a minute men in the house when I cook sous vide I actually like to pass even slightly squeeze both sides into a paper towel so I can pull a little bit of that moisture out and make sure I get a quick sear and rather than steaming I'm working and I'm pulling out of a bag and I like to pull out of the bag a little bit in advance I throw them on towels typically and I think you say you're somewhere a lot when I'm grilling to get quick surface Sheen of oil on top of something when I'm going into the Pandora app Pandora

going home with Pam is if he get it hot it does a good job but if there's Pam on the side of the need it gets kind of a little bit of a waxy mouthfeel which I don't like

give me like I'm the only reason I can actually get it hot it's fine but if it's if it's between hot and cool it gets a little waxy when I'm going I know you're anti skewer but nothing you can do like when I'm going in and out of it and like spraying is the only way I can doing a lot of it is the only thing I usually don't spray Pam I usually spray different cooking oil but I'm asking if you can fill with cooking like a bunch of them break on me but like I haven't figured it out yet so you know

I completely agree with the most classic car so you could get them to close to the grill that they're toast that is so great so let's let's get right to some unless we have call or calling a question let's get right to some mixed drink you are working on a couple weeks ago do you remember what it was remember what's the question of real quick for a couple of weeks ago I was testing with frozen blueberries because the real ones weren't I don't have real ones yet I was testing with with Frozen and

blending a fruit if I think the Frozen stuff is fine really especially if you go direct from Frozen into the liquor so I like certain fruits you'll get interesting and somatic action When You Freestyle because you rupture a lot of the cells during the freezing process and the flavor changes quite considerably apples would be the one that's very clearly like that but blueberries fresh ones when they're in winter in season but I can't recall the recipe I've been using Shad berries recently Kazarian right now find the closest linden tree AKA Basswood Linden blossoms are in now and you can Nitro model or blend Linden blossom drink I suggest Linden blossoms 2 oz half ounce lemon half ounce sub simple some salt you won't regret it

I'm perfect that's so much I think you back to miss on resting let me start and Greg you can jump about hiring a grad student to do some research on this the general theory is that when you take meat out of a hot fire if you let it sit for 5 10 to 15 minutes and let it rest that the juices will be redistributed and that they will flow more evenly throughout I'm not sure that they have run away from the fire and been distributed improperly and I've never seen evidence that they have some really interesting test with this great why don't you tell me about what you've done and what you've learned

first of all I mean in most cases that's how you talk to you about a steak unless you eat the whole thing in 30 or 40 seconds it's going to rest on your plate so the steak you eat at the beginning is going to be different than the state TV 5 minutes later versus 15 minutes later so partly rested differences nearly zero I've done immediately gathered up all the juices waited 15 minutes then slice it up there's no difference the difference is where it ends up where they're it ends up inside the meet or ends up in the plate and then you kind of pop it up while you're eating for the total amount of juice is no different rested and not rested I'm a big believer in not resting for a cup and actually pretty early after it comes off the fire because I don't like the cross the fog out and I worry about carry over when you're using a really hot fire so I'm a fan of taking the meat off slicing it I like that charge

Aroma and a slightly hard cross which I have to wait too long so I like to do the same thing and so the liquid that's in there which comes out is just as good whether it's in the meter is out of the meat so I'm not a big fat there's one exception and that is for things like a brisket and they're there is a huge advantage in Waiting an hour after you pulled off the fire wrap it up put it into a faux Cambro it and let it sit there it will absorb the juices and I have to do the micro structure of the brisket and the wave Cooks it actually act like a bunch of soda straws and it will pull the juices and it'll continue to cook in it I do definitely believe you want to rest up a big need like a brisket mistake I'm on the opposite side I I never rested differentiating the two steps by saying needs that you're cooking to medium rare

150° you don't need to rest you want to serve hot not only what you were saying but I think a big part of the juiciness phenomenon is saliva and when you put a sizzling hot steak on my plate I start to salivate I get juicy now as far as the brisket I refer to that is holding now Drake rather than resting does a brisket is cooked to 200 200 + 3 degrees big difference from 130 degrees steak way that I look at it isn't that I've never believed in this redistribution garbage when I called garbage what do they mean redistribution it is true that your experiments show in the sidebar if you read carefully towards the end is meets 10 to as they're cooling back below about 50

52 Celsius 10 to have a radical shift in their water holding capacity and so what happens next to me it's as they cool down and as your experiment shed and it bled I think 3 oz is when it was cut hot to ounces. Which is only 1 oz and asked you said Professor on the thing is that it stops up two juices I've run multiple mice and multiple hundreds test where you take two pieces of me either Force chill them through their zone of of like absorption and this is some kind of Granddaddy's of low temperature to sous vide cooking

and he always used to say you want to ramp your cooling down slowly when it's in the bag when I'm talking about Siri cuz he does cook chill and then retherm later fast faster better write for microbial standpoint and he always said no you want to do a ramp chilling in the garbage and we just ran we ran the tests like hundreds of times cuz we used to teach it in our in our low temp sous vide cooking classes and about 70% of the people about 70% of the time people will choose the meat that is going through a a ramp Cooling and so then because I always get more reabsorption chooses as it slows down which is actually corroborated by the the sidebar you guys did in the book saying that to meet reabsorb the juice I don't think the meat needs to be

non sliced where the ribs are the juices it just needs to be in proximity with the Jews and other muscle groups that there's not much you can do about it and it's not going to absorb a tremendous amount of that thing about a rapid cooling Cooling and Ice baths and stuff but I do believe that if you can get hot lead into a suvee bag and seal it it's going to it's going to sterilize itself if it's hot when you put it in and and and then you have a little bit of margin to play games with how quickly you cool it or not so I'm I'm not as worried about the microbial issue if it's in a nice sanitary bag when I get to be back it's super difficult to suck mean you can't suck a good vacuum on hot obviously a pressure bag instead of sucking the air out of the bag you increase

pressure around it experiments on that really works at higher pressures you don't agree there's certain certainly true that in a vacuum marinator the vacuum marinating I believe that we both has it does absolutely nothing in terms of driving things in or all those stories about for the smoking how do you spell can get a protein scientist on this because they are professionals have spoken to on it I've never really played with it that much because I never cared to I don't really care about it that much but they say it's that there is a when I don't believe that I don't know that I believe this is like you know how there's a there's built up knowledge overtime for professionals to do it they believe that there is a window of vacuum pressure that is good

but a deeper vacuum in that is not eventagious and a shallower vacuum than that is not affected trying to find some window where they can prove it works most of the studies I've seen in the food literature show that the vacuum marinating ineffective as in my own experiments as is I believe the theory very high pressures of course if you know the high pressure pasteurization is extraordinary Li efficacious in terms of what it does the molecules the in-between level 400 PSI can make a difference your average home pump is not going to get there then so most of the stuff that had the most commercial ones that your average home users it's ineffective tissue is a Ziploc bag you're just as well off you can make a difference at the high levels

I think it works best with thin Cuts also noting that helps a big thick cut like Christmas in minutes and with shrimp vegetable garnish work in cocktails and while you're sucking the vacuum it's when the pressure comes back in and pushes the liquid into the evacuated Port remember that meet it does not have its not like swiss cheese is not enabled Reno air pockets in there it's a fully saturated sponge if you will

do something is also something that's good that you're hitting on her so preposterously obsessed with juice and S and the loss of juice and it stinks just have to be juicy enough for them to be well let's try agent gets rid of water on this business that you know we here don't poke a thermometer into the meat cuz it'll

is 6 oz of water if you stick a thermometer in there if you stick a fork in there you might lose a teaspoon after numerous punctures there's 6 oz of water in there you're not going to miss it with us to Bound Brook Court thing in my mind is is mouthfeel and I'm sure they've done experiment with putting in monosodium phosphate things like that there is a place for me there is this window where you don't want Pure or mild water because it's a little watery on your tongue if you put too much water holding gel then it feels a little bit slimy but there is a window where it has this wonderful anxious meaty texture in your mouth due to the viscosity of the liquid and yes that's what you have to hit

otherwise you end up with the Reno industrial flavored needs which tastes like they put gelatin on the inside or the audience cuz it's an important words Maya water when we cut into a steak and these juices that we see come running out people off and call it blood it's not blood the blood is removed in the slaughtering process blood from the steer and a chicken and a hog is much like our blood it's very dark red it's almost black it's thick and when it comes out in oxygen it starts to coagulate those thin pink juices are called Maya water because they're mostly water and they've gotten a little bit of a pink tinged from a protein called myoglobin so I want to caution all you people who say let's collect the blood for it over to me

Indiana that's where they all rights were there

how do you like your steak really red or I mean I only ever you do exactly 55.2 degrees all the time is 130-135 single most thing that you can do as a home-cooked to improve your grilling or your barbecue your smoking or even your indoor cooking is go out and buy a $30 digital thermometer that'll give you an accurate reading within 5 Seconds 3235

and more importantly poultry needs to be 65 to be safe and we're not talking about longer than a couple of hours as long as it to cook temperature in consumer reports in a research project a year ago and which they found out of 300 chicken breast 90% had pathogenic bacteria half of them had and antibiotic resistant pathogens you don't want to undercook poultry you don't want to overcook steak and a $30 digital thermometer you want the top-of-the-line the thermapen for $100 go get it it'll reading 2 seconds but you had a good one to read in 5 seconds. 30 bucks absolutely

between what you're willing to do for your family and then what you're doing if you're serving like you don't you don't know the people are there a mean to compromise or whatever there's like a different person that I have to be going to eat it raw and save it to my family wrong I don't I don't do it anywhere near the grill they have the the potting compound that they use inside of those hypodermic needles is sensitive to heat and we'll die if it overheats and then your $80 probe is it in the garbage you can still stick it in to meet though you're not but I've lost more than 5 like trying to show temperature rise and a steak while I'm flipping it so they actually leave it in the grill

or God forbid use it as a frying thermometer they're going to call her though cuz I'm a related question from a couple if I could get it up to a 750 you do it to cook medium-rare hamburgers but I read Knight if I put them in boiling water for 20 seconds before I grind it and and that cuts down all the surface bacteria in in general most of the in the interior meat is pretty close so you can get away with that in most cases but you can get it from a mobile home

yes I want to ask you guys a question but I don't want to miss him call or you're on the air

hey Dave I picked up a big green egg over the weekend and I'm really excited to use it and the question I had actually relates to digital thermometer so I thought it'd be a good thing to the ducktail I wanted to pick up something that I could use to get the temperature if not just the ambient heat in the kamado grill but also the you know whatever protein I'm cooking and I was hoping that there might be some device out there that would give me three thermocouple sensors so that I could get like chicken breast and chicken thighs at the same time and if there's more on different stuff at the same time but obviously is you just pointed out the heat is an issue when you know you've got it up above 500 you can't put silicone in there so I'm wondering if there's

Wireless and can withstand heat so I don't have to watch the amazing we have a thermometer buying guide have an electrical engineer and we buy the thermometers don't take samples we put them through equipment to test their accuracy their speed of response check them against the manufacturer specs but there are probes that you can buy that are plug into a meter so you can buy 20 probes put one on a different part of the grill grate put two in the meat hanging one through the Dutch from Prague to probe and measure as many different measurements as you want if you want something off the shelf that's remote read I'm not happy at all with any of the blue

Bluetooth devices we've tested Bluetooth is a pain in the butt it's really hard to pair sometimes there are some nice units maybe they'll solve the connectivity issues but my favorite is made by a company called Maverick and they have several models the one I like the best is not the newest model it's called the Maverick et-732 and it's radiofrequency not Bluetooth and I can walk several blocks away from the not that far but I'm a block away from the house and still get a good reading on it's got two probes so you can use both in the meat or one of them eat all on the other on the grill surface but that's another point that we should point out we talked about measuring meat temperature you don't want to use the thermometer that comes on a grill it's usually mounted in the room but if you need to meet you need a probe down on the surface where the need is so you need to get a digital thermometer with a pro this Maverick et-732 cost about fifty bucks

but if you want to go to other things about thermocouple you purchase the the metal stainless steel probe is a ground it's one of the lead if you put more than two of them in the same piece of meat you can get what's called a ground Loop and get very unreliable measurements you need special thermocouples if you want to put more than one into a piece of me going to the same meters look if you noticed weird numbers it's often because of that I forgot about that chief thermocouples that you don't have that problem but of course she most manufacturers that's actually get an electrical ground Loop between one piece of me down into the stainless steel grill over the other piece of meat into the thermocouple you can actually watch that happen so I used the right kind of thermocouple

this is not a common occurrence though I mean this is not about the thermometer probe you might want to consider doing which is a trick I use as I get these cotton braided laces like you might put in your shoes thick ones with water I put them over the Teflon part of the thermocouple probe and then I wrap it with aluminum foil and that allow you to use a thermocouple on top of a really hot Grill and not destroy it immediately and silica spray after a while I still have a weak point where the epoxy goes from The Wire into the thermocouple but if you don't do that that he might get one one or two grills out of them if you're not careful

but if you really want to go geeky and you have some money the cheapest like super multi one that I know of but now that I've I think Massachusetts maybe Maine called measurement Computing sales at an 8-channel DAC that has a thermocouple input sitter pre-calibrated and years ago when I bought in a silly they give you a program and if so you could do at the time it was two hundred bucks with eight channels of input and then you just buy yourself a spool of wire and makes make some thermocouples and go to town I used to use it for like eight things at once and I'm not telling you to steal a copy of labview online but they have a thing called that they are there when they come with works fine too but it's super nerd it is up there like I can think of like five or six people that would care to even have eight meetings at once but temperature

what we want what we call blue smoke out of a of the Green Egg which is the best tasting smoke a very efficient so once you get the hang of a do some dry runs fired up and don't put food in there and waste food fired up and cook without food and get your measurements down so that you can control him and tell him Greg the green eggs is they are so efficient that running a little oxygen stars and sometimes when you open it up to see what's going on the oxygen rushes in the cold Catch Fire to get the kind of a hair removing burst of flames out of things to do as you open it a little crack you let the air in let it burst burp and then you open a little all the way it's very rare that you need that many the only time I can think of that you would need it is if you were building a brand-new bread oven and you are in

adding thermocouples into the masonry at various depths so you can tell what's going to happen in an egg you could just move the thermocouple around and see what the temperature distributions like on a gas grill for example and use the grill and you turn on the grill close the lid and then you lift in a few minutes and look in and see which bread pieces are burning black and which are not loved and now you know where your hot spots are you guys ever when you're cooking use these new cheap floor thermal imaging cameras, could you microwave cooking with her kind of cool on my website with shoes that look at the fact that you put a slim jim in a microwave antenna and actually gets hot in infections with nose in between

Plasma in Graves by never thought to put a slim jim in a cooler than going to have fun with this if you want it like do you like super plasma stuff with weird you ever tried partially evacuating the inside of a microwave microwave dehydration increase in evaporation rate you can have fruits keep their shape basically as their evaporating in a microwave under partial evacuation so I tried it a bunch of times and I would always get huge plasma balls all over the inside of the microwave yeah well it's like with microwave transparent so you can microwave inside and Ice Cube which is kind of cool

call Big Florida having two separate places in the book is one is the first one the second one is his color is not an indication of the people just won't eat things that are that color how do we well they won't eat chicken we're getting better at eating pink pork the government gave us the okay 65 to 145 and if you want to cook pork down to 1:40 or 1:35 you're in for a real treat you're getting a steak like experience of tenderness and juicing is that you've never had worked before in a few restaurants are doing that and you're dealing with a whole muscle me just like you are with the steak you going to be pretty safe chicken we just have mental block my wife

is a FDA Food Safety scientist she's pretty smart pretty high-ranking government the expert and I can bring you in chicken from the grill that I have tempt and I know is 165-170 and we cut into it and she'll look at it she look at that. You know I can't fix I can't fix the color on your the bone because she has his huge source of myoglobin sitting there in the narrow but the surface and a lot of people rejected on the surface is if you put it in an acidic marinade the acid will reduce the temperature that myoglobin changes color when I so one of the tricks is to use an Ascend buttermilk for example and other things will dramatically help near the surface of four boneless meat for people who are queasy about this I recommend something that's acidic to help make it less pain

myoglobin changes color when it heats up so it starts out pink and that's the pink juice and the meat stays pink to 140-150 it starts getting gray or brown the myoglobin changes color same thing and chicken now we're cooking chicken up for 160-165 but something about the acidity of the meat prevents the myoglobin from changing colors like it used to be in 7 weeks it goes from egg to store shelf in 7 weeks I used to be these birds would wander around it would take months for them to grow 5 much more effectively now the chicken bones have very thin calcium on them and so you can see the marrow through the bone it

oven in the mara will leak out and you can in the picture the picture in the book of really purple bone juice and the juices will stay thing it didn't get enough the Smoke Ring Works cuz Greg did definitive research on this take the nature and it didn't turn brown but the other reason is nitric oxide and carbon monoxide from a smoker gets in there and fixes the myoglobin just like you fix a photograph and until that can be another reason why I smoke needs are pink and below the Mason-Dixon line to go look at that and say oh good you smoked in the butt of the Mason-Dixon line to return it which driving run Tron crazy cases the acidity will help you

open a window where you can serve speed which isn't pink but is the safe to eat it's not a light switch it's also rate dependent so if you're doing low and slow you're going to have a different kind of interaction between phenotype and low and slow cook if also often in a situation where the oxygen can't get out so the oxygen continues to refresh to keep the myoglobin pink and so it depends upon the thickness of the me how quickly you're doing the cooking and a variety of other other factors breaks down for more than one reason and a some of those enzymes and so on if you cook low and slow there more fragile than the myoglobin so the thing that it packs a myoglobin dies away before it has a chance to work on the myoglobin and so it fits it is very much rate

something is very much dependent upon whether the oxygen can get out or not which is an example and Mero it's a little bit like a balloon the oxygen doesn't leave it is usually the meat Samaritan stay pink longer time for that reason so it's it's a very complicated I like it cuz those are knobs you can turn to adjust the final result but it is very complicated I miss a couple things on the way out upside down cake please write and tell me I'll get the rest of questions later

it's a genuine in the department of food and all the articles are they under the food button and Meathead your website Amazing Ribs Meathead Meathead Goldwyn because of protecting the meat is because I have a bone to pick with both of you guys on on a 225 vs 325 I think we'll reverse their trend on the 325 because you're dealing with evaporated cooling a lot on the 225 keeping the meat temperature down but they will have that argument

people shouldn't even hear that argument 25 accurate as it's in the book is accurate my only gripe is that if you were to go much higher I think that the trend would not stay the same way wouldn't it's not linear I think you picked to special temperatures I picked a nut Greg and and I picked them because I like the 325 renders fat in a little better and chicken thighs for being on cooking music. Goodbye

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