Cooking Issues Transcript

Episode 138: Fish Show

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conjoined as usual in the Statue of the hammer Lopez we got Jack and Joe and Shirley Booth House at 1 to tell you pushing a trip up on the warehouse I scared literally like these guys there's a testimony for 97212 8 in this world but the truth I remember you can cause we're pretty much any question right guys I mean then have to be Technical and usually is but speaking of technical right now is like a very met in a special moment she is reading as we said she noticed because she looks at things believe or not they have a book of a shift into us not us but that the radio radio station called the Vegan Stoner cookbook since Tasha is going to be the definition of the munchies with resourceful creative instinctive cooking without using a

play that again one who satisfies the munchies with resourceful creative instinctive cooking without using Animal product do instinctive things when you're stoned out of your mind or is it freely like most of my friends who like to hit up quite a lot they don't necessarily make their best cooking decisions when they're stoned out of their mind just saying soon I mean look I have some friends who are kind of very deep into

cooking and making liquor products with with cannabis and maybe soon it will be legal for me to work on those same as well but I mean I've never really felt bad that stuff out she's looking at these vegetables are quite that much different vegan food at least three write-ins are Collins related to the subject now we'll see authors of the book here who we don't know they're going to call coming in right now hold on

we'll call you on here John Doe a big help at the pub party event that we had last Tuesday I thought

awesome really cool to be able to pass the stuff I brought as well and was Taft was Taft tapioca what was the third we had of the evening I thought it was delicious other later there by the way it was going to were talking about we're talking about an explosive Puffin gun that the Museum of food and drink has their first kind of temporary exhibit and when we so you know we got some tapioca pearls and puffing just on their own and they turned into giant like like cumulus cloud styro balls it was the weirdest thing ever it was not as good at

we did it without the full mix of stuff really interesting

you got the shout-out except they're specially Piper Natasha for showing me such hospitality and also I headed over to PDX and got some rye drink some neck and he took me up some pretty amazing stuff nice nice concocted some possibility of throwing some Coco Diaz in with some rice to be able to make you know Cocoa Puffs Cocoa Puffs my feeling is like when we put things in that are weird occurrences the last puff of the day that we did on Saturday we threw in almond and and and sunflower seeds

Coco Nails my my strong feeling is something that high in oil will tend to melt out mean I know maybe not though in the present in the lack of water will try it someday but as you say we'll try it in an absence of Amy sorry in with a multitude of other stuff so there's the minor constituent this way if it goes horribly wrong the horrible wrong this can be absorbed by the rest of the batch and not all of the inside of the gun but we noticed that we make mistakes their mistakes 10 to melt themselves under the inside of the gun and then require require kind of a bit of a hard core cleaning that happened in one of our tapioca bad she's actually we had to run a clean mid event on Saturday because the tapioca completely melted itself to the inside when it when it smelt it and open it carburized is very quickly but doesn't solidify fast enough to flake it off until you get this kind of sludge in the gun with but but but more and again I couldn't find our car green coffee

turn on I want a puff of green coffee as well know why they have to do the starch content down it's it's a ridiculous information-gathering site for anybody who wants to roast coffee all the time I was you know for years that was my ritual now used to by beings from them yeah

project I'm working on trying to make fish sauce and basically I've been adding a little bit of bump into it I mean I can kind of feel that there's actual mommy but I want to really Juice It Up and I was thinking about doing you know basically creating a fish salt to do the curing process and have the nitrates afterwards evaporator but in terms of thoughts on that yeah you're going to lose a lot I mean a lot anyway on the cook-off at the bacon right but I mean so much of so much with fish sauce fish sauce is a couple of different things right it's it's high in Umami because of protein and

breakdown product while not not remind me not to look at the protein breakdown products but I was going to let the breakdown products in their right and so but it has a huge volatile component as well so my feeling is if you'll be able to get you know a lot of the more stable stuff in there but you're going to lose a lot of the volatile characteristics of it I don't know what the salt content of a standard fish sauce are there widely varying it depending on brand I remember that from my research years ago but you don't want to just you don't want the high liquid content is that the is that the problem I would Chew in

I like the fact that we need Rideshare it stays flat and you don't lose love to lick what I mean I realize that I could do an injection method like they do an industry so I could try that too right well I mean what you could do is you could try it right and then you can just have you can sorry right injected wet but then just go through a little bit of a a relatively High a relatively high humidity dry down. In the fridge before you smoke it out you know I'm saying flash off some of the extra moisture that you put into it by injecting but my my feeling is that if you really want that flavor of fish sauce with Cioppino everyone some people they don't like the smell of it but they're just mistaken of the stuff is delicious if you want that then you know I would go with I would use very little else because my guess I mean it depends on the fish sauce to use but probably pretty

close to what you need right percentage is of it but then and then just let a little bit of moisture flash off under controlled conditions temperature for a while prior to smoke down

eipa dropped off at PDX going there tonight I'm going to hopefully get a hold of it tonight will give you a shout out next week we thought it came out pretty good all right but what was your initial gravity on that was the specific gravity on the walkie remember

go through that whole process we are kind of drinking and smoking things in terms of needs we didn't pay attention too much for that stop smoking Meats not smoking with the Vegan Stoner is smoking presumably okay oh by the way back to the Vegan Stoner things did you see the you watching the CNN Sanjay gupta's weed thing to see what are the synopsis is that you don't remember when member when Peter Tosh they legalize marijuana in a Jamaica is in ASL song get Super Simple Songs action is subject but it goes through the medicinal the medicinal benefits of marijuana and turns out that is probably true

Landon young rights rights in on the Twitter he's at fujiki blend off what tasks would show off flash reveal the blender strengths and weaknesses I like it it's a Vitamix versus everybody now listen listen here there's a couple of things that that are hard to judge and you know I remember I think it would I forget who it was it was either Consumer Reports or was it was the one that they're from Boston magazine for Boston Cook's Illustrated I have the charter issues of that often do the wrong thing with blenders and don't really show off why Vitae prep is such a piece of butt-kicking Machinery right now for instance

does it make a smoothie as fast as some of the other blenders is it smoothie nobody cares professional kitchen nobody cares about a smoothie right we'll get back to the blenders in a second color on the air

hi babe and everyone else I just wanted to call in and ask a little more information about you could do me a little bit about I know it's process of killing fish and inserting rods into their spinal cord to prevent or I guess I'm kind of delay but what is the real reason people do it I guess I feel like one of the upsides and downsides more people do actually questions by the way you want to do you want to call out your name or no sew the whole battery of a Japanese fish killing techniques okay and then the specific technique of destroying the spinal cord is Dave told me it's called thinking

it means like no spine I think right and involves running wire up the spinal cord so all the Japanese fish killing techniques are designed whether or not you believe they work or not are designed to increase the quality of the of the of the fish play I've noticed it most most pronounced in in the firmness in the texture of them fish at although there are some taste differences week notice as well and also the you know we have found that the it's more it's more of a difference in raw prepped as opposed to cook breath although some people disagree with me but the idea is this in a nutshell is that the standard western-style killing technique of whacking it or something over the head or bleeding it out while it's a live or let him suffocate to death in a whale of a boat with a lot of stress

on the fish at its dying and the stress from the fish dying whether it's because of hypoxia cuz if not enough oxygen or whether it's a blunt trauma bleed out all this stuff aren't you know just what we know whatever is pumping through that fish is system as it says it's in his fight or flight mode all of those things have a deleterious qualities on the quality of The Flash from eating standpoint especially the spinal cord destruction rights that starts with severing the brain connection to the rest of the defense right to your shutting off all of the you shutting off all of their Transmissions from the brain to the muscles of the fish and presumably there for shutting off the ability of the dying fish brain to make changes to its body chemistry now so that the way that I was taught originally was just as several of the spinal cord but I'm larger fish I really think it's a better idea to and they make

special curved knives do you actually take out the brain of the fish prior to severing the spinal cord right now when you squeeze the spinal cord is the spinal cord severing it both at the tail and at the front is also a bleeding technique because you know that belief in Japan and I think you know pretty much for now that you want to get most of the blood out and by severing the the arteries near the head and not the tail you get a fairly efficient pump out of blood into water so that's why you'll see in these techniques the official be cut and then fled in water off in to get most of the assault lawyer usually isotonic hopefully to the fish's blood system pump out the blood to get a well blood fish okay now so the real question is and it seems fairly easy to understand that you're going to influence the quality of the fish flesh by quickly killing the brain or severing the spinal cord the interesting question is is extra step of shoving a wire up the spinal cord or what the health

accomplished right well turns out that the spinal cord continues to send electrical impulses to the muscles even in the absence of you know a central nervous system controls me a train so what happens is is that if you don't destroy the spinal cord especially in very kind of long swimming like pelagic style fish like tuna of striped bass these kinds of things their spinal cord will continue to send messages to the muscle to contract and therefore the muscles will the muscles will use more ATP which is the energy store of the muscle then they will if you destroy the spinal cord and the faster the ATP is used up the faster the fish goes into rigor mortis and usually the harder the fish goes into rigor mortis and fish flash is so delicate that hard rigor can actually do damage such that when it comes out of rigor mortis that's fish

is a start having a gaping in the in the in the in the flash the flesh is softer and not as firm as it would be had you delayed rigor mortis and so that's kind of the those are the overarching reasons for the techniques something like tonight I mean so so what we used to call us western-style fish killing when we did it was you know it it does deteriorate more quickly but you know something about actually isn't best II you catch it regardless of what you know anyone's going to tell you very few preparations taste good with I mean with me on this but most of us in preparation Most Japanese style preparations or in preparation

prefer a fish that come out of rigor mortis right and everybody knows you have to either you have to either get the face before it goes into regular with me and instantaneously after death you have to cook it or you have to wait for it to go through rigorous even if you do it before rigor sets in you know it's still going to be a lot firmer and almost crunchy for a lot of preparations and you can use that to your advantage but you really kind of want the fish to come out of rigor so it's true that when you have something that has had the spinal cord destroyed it takes longer for it to come out of regular so it's Optimum Eating Point usually happens after the optimum eating point of a standard western-style killed fish but that fish at its best is usually for the ones where it was spawns well to this technique is usually added to its best is usually much better than the western style variant and the western style variant will get softer and mushy or much faster than the than the spinal cord ablated

will answer your other question I didn't answer which is why don't more people do it well part of it is education and part of it is high cost if you if you take a fish and you and you pull it on a boat is had a huge fight right it's already gone through a lot of the problems that are going to cause it to know it's exhausted most of its ATP it's so you know it's it's gone through a lot already and so the benefits might be marginal at that point then when you're when they're killing a very high value fish like tuna especially in farm situations they will Electro stones for the fish doesn't know anything is happening pull it up on deck and and put the spinal cord do the spinal cord ablation because they know the market value of the day she's so high you know there's also experiments in his experiments in Australia New Zealand commercial where in New Zealand that you're allowed to you

is a fish an aesthetic aqueous which is based on clove oil ISO usual and they use that to anesthetize the fish prior to bleed out because they seen that the less afraid or less you know whatever you want to call you know what's going on in the fish's brain prior to slaughter is that there's less of that going on that the quality is is better and so those got it it's not approved or at least wasn't last time I looked in the US strangely but it's an ongoing area of research and most of it's been by economics

who is yeah I guess I guess that explains it I just heard it up and thought I should tell him I haven't had the opportunity to do a lot of experimenting with it recently my hope is always that the more we bring attention to it as a technique the more you know fish sellers will start to you know to demand this process boat side and then demand a premium price for it and then if you people start calling it out then you'll see more of it in the marketplace specially for things that we intend to eat at sushi grade and so it's you notes the idea isn't that that most of us are ever going to practice it or the restaurant wise you should practice it because by the time a live fish makes it to a restaurant it's been pretty abused usually you know what I mean the idea is his to have people accept the General accept the the the benefits of the practice and payment pay more for it

I think we had a shout out Chris whooping who became a member listener cooking issues thanks for the support

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Jack is that your magical zamfir stuff in the background oh yeah I would love to see out of her mind

where is it is very very tip of the North Fork of Long Island right on daily preserving fishing oil in jar without assaulting it lately overnight in a refrigerator be cooking it in water and then covering it in oil and that's why I know it's not fully cured it's not really safe to have it at room temperature and it tastes really really good even if you just used a neutral cooking oil

like to make a lot of this before the season ends and I'm wondering if it's suicidal test to use this method of the traditional right that's a very interesting question and you know I can't make any offhand I'll say this if you do at night rights to it right I don't know what you want to but you know everyone knows we're talking about here worried about botulism right and and other kind of there are some other especially in fish actually some some some cold tolerant spore-forming pathogens pretty sure I got it has been a while since I've looked up this this process but fish keeping it is a whole science and of itself and people definitely remember preserve things for long periods sync locks in a fridge in a fridge environment that haven't been cooked at

right but I believe you're going to want to add there's a couple things you need to know you need to know what the moisture content of it is and you need to know how much salt you're going to add and then you're going to want to add I would guest for safety sake some nitrites to it and if you not eight sides but if any if you if you get the right combination of that and I'm sure this is look up a ball on the web then as long as you aren't going to store it at room temperature if you're going to keep it refrigerated you could probably make a safe product it's fairly close to what you're doing it's not going to be shelf-stable it's not canned but yeah you can probably make something that will inhibit the growth of the of that kind of really nasty stuff in the fridge but I'm hesitant to give you any actual numerical recommendations over the air without doing a lot of research first

I was looking up traditional the hell out of the fish. I don't have access to a can of where I am the first place that the best waiver on the small Felix.

It doesn't feel fully cured once it's ones without you know he has it just has the texture spray texture still Fresh. So it seems to be that that's what I'm worried about is the best flavor is not something that's going to be saved the Cure level with the amount of salt and and adding adding adding nitrates good as well isn't obliterating the really dangerous stuff it's obliterating the normal stuff if the canning that obliterates the normal stuff in the reason that you probably have to cook the crap out of it first is because you're probably getting rid of water at that point you're lowering the water activity through a cooking me think about how Coffee Works you know you do a long cook on it and the meat is salty and dry you know I'm in a good way and I happen to love comfy but but you know what you're you're like to cook step isn't just a cook step it's also a water control measure you could do a straight

can of the fish without the initial cook step after the curing and get a higher much but it's still going to be cut you going to be cooking hell out of him two different from what you want I would once you covered in oil and let it know I don't know if that's what happened to not really eating that much after after the unsecure in the cookie or something that you could actually put in the freezer covered in oil and safe place intact if you know it like you're better off probably do it yet mean like I'm doing it after the freezing it after the full step

botulism shouldn't grow in the freezer in the freezer does he have a couple giant blue fish in an integrator interest of flavor here cuz we just like $2 a pound for the Bluefish just Grill any that I really love Blue Fish Blue Fish really delicious freezing nothing should go again in Portugal in the freezer remember that I've never actually put a liquid oil pack in the freezer before most times when you age oil oil oil can fish their Aging for years he wanted me to so like how you know a lot of those changes especially in the cans in a hermetically can stuff you're talkin about years of changes not you know days or weeks

an inn in comfy when you age and even it's like you know like a month or more when you add like a duck confit with I love that page duck confit flavor but

yeah I feel fairly comfortable it if you freeze it you're going to be in a safe Zone but I've never I've never Frozen a pack product in a liquid fat for I've only Frozen them in a salad pack remember when you freeze freezing actually can accelerate rancidity of of things because of the water fraction that there is more concentrated in so you can have things for granted a pretty hardcore in the in the freezer if there's any Oxygen so you going to want to really pack that stuff without any air at all

may I still covered in oil so it's going to be less of a problem but you want to get all the air out of the bag yeah pretty well but I just never know never really comes up a list of freezing freezing liquid Jeremy night dates at I would guess that control us completely winterizing won't go solid although I've never put it in freezer olive oil get sludgy also taste good but the cost more but the canola

and my guess is a canola will stay I don't know I don't remember what temperature can olive starts getting sludgy cuz it's been a long time since I've liked you know Friday I've done Coldwell certification of agar with something like grape seed but you know it's been a long time since I've tested the limits of sludge Venus of those oils but they're all winter I so they shouldn't probably get to solid in the freezer not not the consistency that matters yes that is my guess that is my dad is my educated guess yes that is the temperature in their family words of all different kinds of animals put together

alright thank you bye-bye versus other blenders there's two things there's one there's ultimate blending ability right and other blenders the Blendtec for instance have you know very good blending capabilities there's another one I saw that a lot cheaper than if I tap rep that actually has I think is is blade interchangeable with / probably Omni blender also has a 3 horsepower motor motor and like really kind of like a good-looking blade actually in fact it looks like the blade might be superior to buy depressed I'm not sure but it's a lot cheaper but when you look at the controls for it you realize that the reasons it cooked love Vitae perhaps is not based on you know making fruit smoothies it's the control mechanisms of vital preps are amazing to paddle switches and an eye

very intuitive very good for Cooks so any any rating of professional quality blenders has to take into account what it's like to use them when you're cooking you know especially when you're cooking heavy duty in a kitchen over long. And you needed to have a good touch a good feel and I think one of the reasons other than blend blending ability that we all love / up so much is the way that it becomes an extension of your hand there thing we hate about it is that if you lose the plunger which Cooks invariably lose a freaking plunger you have to beat on it to get it to plan properly although they have knew they have a new picture that apparently is much better in that regard closer to what they are Blendtec picture is like here are some things to test out can you blend a pound of bacon into a tomato sauce and have it be silky smooth

mathematical test other things like that means it was interesting about the vital prep isn't that you can make a smoothie with it what interesting about it is that you no longer need to use a Tammy when you're making sausage because if I tap app can make things that smooth so those are the things that you want to to test and then if you actually need to you can see whether or not it makes a decent Margarita hello I do like myself a frozen margarita stuff tastes good I'm sick of people hating on things that are, and if they taste good cooling he'll just had a quick question about supercooling with a circulator I seen her never gave briefly touching on a topic using a circular to speed along the chilling process post cooking this got me thinking can I drop my water bath below freezing without the

drawing my wonderful circulator I've noticed it goes below freezing but I'm too scared to drop it down out of fear of destroying my baby I think I'm putting an unopened bottles of water in the bathroom hour or so should I put some ice or salt in there as well as an old-school polyscience 7306 model that's a soul stainless bottom one the old one thousand favors she had her happy face on there could I do with other thanks in advance and I'm running from Edmonton Alberta PS can you answer this on the next show because I'm waiting to do this technique on a dinner party on Saturday okay look at Liberty look I use this technique all the time with my circulator that circulator if my memory serves me can go down to about minus 20 Celsius it's the lowest I've ever taken I don't know if it goes below that I meant to test it in the newer plastic one before I came in but I forgot I forgot to test it whether or not that thing can be set below zero but yeah so here's what you do and I do this all the time at events where I want to chill download

batches of cocktails with my favorite cocktail chilling techniques for Advance because it's fairly accurate you get a big tray you fill it with vodka cheap cheap cheap cheap cheap cheap vodka and then you throw dry ice into it and then you set the circulator in on high circulation and you said it's whatever you want your cocktail temperature to be right and then you just let it run and what happens is as the as the dry ice chills it below your set point the heater will come on and will heat your the Vodka back up to the temperature you want it to be and then as you noticed that the dry ice is almost gone you break off a couple more tips of dry ice and you throw it in and you can keep a very accurate temperature on drinks for hours and this is my favorite way to do carbonated back or the hold like large batch cocktails for long periods of time and I've done it many many many many times and I've never hurt the circulator not once you can probably also

a saltwater be aware that you might eventually pit or corrode the 316 stainless that is on it with a large amounts of salt but salt water bath can be controlled just on a assault I spaces so you know you might not need the circular if you buy me the circulator but you might not need the heating effect I typically use dry ice that's the way I do it in about peaches that's Google I like you like temperatures Willy's John Riley has always preached the getting great pieces this is John preached great Peach it's twisting the question we got here it's always pretty sure getting great peaches means never having to say it

refrigerated but I've never heard y chilling pick peaches screws up their final ripening process can you explain it all so I've heard different opinions about whether the sugar content in peaches goes up after they've been picked what's the truth Sean rapper in Seattle I don't really know much about his website there and he Advocates using crappy white bread with tomato sandwiches so that the bread doesn't get in the way and I wholeheartedly agree I think you should do Scrappy white bread for like really good BLTs you freaking love BLTs man guilty so delicious what we mean is soft and gets out of the way fast yes and so Martin's is kind of the epitome of that style soft and gets away it gets out of any whatever so

there is an interesting thing about this and I ran so I can I read a bunch of things on the Twitter nastic Twitter retweeted tweet of me to read it to me what you say

I got you some stuff that's that's a cursive family program a while back that he had some peaches that had what looked like some petraitis on them the Noble Rot and if they were amazingly delicious I guess after some of the moisture evaporated out after the anyway he's he's he really liked them and I found out that in fact botrytis on peaches is an issue and they treat with fungicides I like that word fungicides and the influence of cooling in temperature maintenance on the quality of California ground stone fruit every missile missile 1986 there's a whole series of things in peaches called chilling injuries and what happens if peaches are typically if you want to ripen a peach you want a peach to ripen it roughly 20 degrees Celsius right and asked after they pick

I mean if they don't ripen the same way when they're picked as they would if you let them sit on the tree but the fact of matter is if you let them completely ripe until they stop on the tree they can't be shipped at all that I couldn't one of those fragile things that exist right so you can't you can't do it so you can't commercially do that and if you have your own tree you can do it so the treat their fruit once they're picked they want to be ripened at at 23 see what's going to happen is you're going to get probably an increase in bricks and increase in total dissolved solids and you can break down of the pectin for the fruit softens and furthermore there's probably a reduction in total acidity and the creation of all the flavor compounds for the ripening that you wouldn't get if you didn't let it usually at like higher than 20 degrees Celsius because they're being picked out in the middle of an orchard in California is piss hot in summer time right and so what you need to do is Chill commercially what they do is they try to chill with peaches down very quickly

they get out of the orchard now and I need to do that because when they're warm and they're being handled impact are much more have to be bruised destroyed and the rot fungus that come in the Orchards and that different organisms right work very rapidly at those high temperature so they try to get the temperatures down as quickly as possible and then if they going to employ a fungicide or something else they put it on when they're cooling it then after they packed it and they're in a stable place where they've been packed then prior to sale they ripen them out at the higher temperatures right let them go through there but then go to their business problem is is that peaches when they're held at Refrigeration temperature from like Celsius to like 10° C in that range when they're held their up for a long. Of time they had what's called a chill injury they never ripen properly and I tried to look through what causes this and it's real It's relatively unclear to me what the actual cause is but it monkey wrench is the ripening process so that it never happens even

in the fridge been warmed up now temporary chilling doesn't seem to have this effect so that storage in the refrigerator for a like a day or two once you had to come back up it might throw off the ripening it might mess it up but it's not going to prevent ripening from happening now I might finish this tomorrow to take the car so they eat but the interesting late if you take the peaches all the way down to zero but don't let them freeze in that very narrow window like 022 degrees Celsius they don't necessarily get those till injuries and also if you take your peaches and they do it's called intermittent warming so they have them in cold storage and every couple of days they bring the wrath of temperature up till like to hire ripening temperature and then cool it back down again if you do that you can also stop at call Dad Chillin Journey but it's a specific it's a known thing with peaches and they get would call it Willie defect where there's almost no flavor they don't soften right and they taste kind of Willie and Millie

this is why I always get nectarines instead of peaches because the pieces we get here in New York is Bates suck or suck good but it never is where I for some reason they do a much better job getting nectarines to us here in the market on the air

hi David

Indianapolis again

it ends up at the hospital with extremely strict rules and no matter what I give her after microwavable forehand anyways so which I think is kind of crap but I mean that's the way it goes I got the yogurt answer though the line of defense my blood witches are neutrophils that will be like Siri is not necessarily okay to have in your blood so I mean if it's still kind of a it seems like a great area but but that's that's an answer that I received

super Draconian to make sure nothing happens but the doctor said last time is that it turns out that patient outcome is better if they like the food at their eating

yeah definitely might my mom Christmas my love my mom is a person that's in the hospital and she she just want like she won't eat the microwave egg and cheese. If that well as something that I think Cooks a lot of institutional cooks and even Cooks in general and you hit the nail on the head with this is that if you have a set of parameters that are unvarying right I have to cook the crabs out of this then only choose foods that survived that well don't try to make things that can't have the crap kicked out of them and still tastes good like my friend but I don't know whether you guys can deal with salt I don't know what the salt issues are with the diet but like coffee would be great

okay yeah definitely cuz you can eat the hell out of that and it's time to make the mistake of trying to cook things that can't be cooked given a certain set of parameters and doing it well and and then serving that why why there are plenty things out there that taste good when they when they've been cooked to death you know you know they don't have a like as a family member that super into the science behind cooking so like shellfish is one of the things that they can be present in in treated well

what I'm assuming you put on the engineer's mind that you like well let's not think about you know we have a set of Givens what are the set of Givens now what's the best we can do within that set of Givens do you know rather than wishing that you can make something that you can't make within your set of Givens and I think it's actually very good practice for cooking in general because every and every moment in your life and I guess no matter what you're doing but I think mainly about the kitchen you always have a you know a set of limitations that you have to deal with and your ability to do the best possible job with the limitations you have determine how good you are as a cook you know what I mean

but I came in the air does to ask you another question so I was curious about the transmute Raymond 8 and the noodles that Wylie Dufresne makes you said that he he does like his determination gelatin noodles one of them has gelatin in it

and I was curious if it did not cross me or did not solidify because the concentration of gelatin was so low that they're not actually interacting LOL at least last time I checked there were two different transfer case is meat Glue by the way for those that don't know what we're talking about it's what you know bonds proteins together of covalently actually there's two different end and the enzyme is transport amination typically there's a helper protein in it that that is used kind of ticket to bridge the gaps between what would otherwise be two pieces of meat that are molecular level are fairly far apart okay so in the one that's most commonly used by chefs is called Activa RM and it's friends with him that's mixed casein milk protein there are two or were at least last time I checc two different Transit emanations that had gelatin as a component there was GB which dancer greatest Bond and that's been around for a long time and a lot of the reason that you know nails and I never recommended using that one is because it kind of sets up tacky

quickly as hard to reposition so and we didn't necessarily need that huge bond strength that comes from the GB for the does Crosslink the other one that we used and so I don't know anyone that keeps GB around the other one is called G es and GS is one that has gelatin in it that also has phosphates in it is designed to sit on the counter as a slurry because the enzyme doesn't work until it's been painted on them because the phosphates in it keep it to alkaline for the enzymes to work properly so yeah they will Crossing but what you want I don't know what the specific gelatin characteristics are the ones that are in g p and GS Wiley's recipe he says you can use RM but I'm almost 100% sure that he uses activity I which is just Activa and maltodextrin with no helper protein in it and the reason why is that we've had failure of his recipe when we use RM because you actually don't want the gelatin

find anything but itself okay so if there is casein protein is there casein in there or other proteins have discussed bonding to and you're making me so these kind of vegetable based we ended up not getting the awesome gelatin cross-linking because a lot of the gelatinous cross-linking the other things least that's our theory that we always had much better results with that his gelatin recipe when you use ti so he would do as he would hydrate that he would make his pure a very low moisture content purees he was in hydrate in a regular gelatin I don't know what he used it like knocks are equivalent Knox is fairly High bloom tonight and then make the slurry let that cool down a little bit add a TI to that and then make mix the whole thing together spreading Lisette and that's going to really what he's looking for us to cross linking a gelatin they're not answering your question or no

you're completely answering the question one more one more parts that I'm sure you're running with gelatin to see like the relative rates of cross-linkage to see like if it's the melting point just increases over time or or is that I'm sure it does because ultimate strength increases over time so you get like 75% of your bond strength in the first 4 hours however you get a lot more if you let it sit overnight and so I'm pretty sure Riley kept his word for changes as well gel strange changes over time which is why they've no they make the the pimento strips in the center of Olives are made from Elgin it and they age those for a day because they're gel strength changes dramatically and

weather not going to snap changes dramatically after they've been age for a Day so a lot of these polymerization reactions have the majority of the thing happens fairly quickly but then there are continued changes for long. Of time afterwards

okay and just one more question is there anyway that like maybe next time or whatever you can talk about like good articles and stuff to talk about like food swimmers ation reactions and relative like but I'm curious about his hydration rates to see how the job is affected by different hydration hydration you know yeah I'll come up with some good references and Sons are like partially and I will give him a shout out or I'll tweet him out during the week or some of that will give me a shout out next week if you can remember to send in the question about it I'm too like the email then it'll it'll help us not forget

perfect thank you notes and cooking potatoes I'm your biggest fan I think I can make a good case for this assertion more later for now I've heard you talk about the high notes in bass notes excetra when talking about flavor and various preparations I love this analogy is I'm a musician but I'm yet to fully appreciate what this means when it comes to putting a dish together are you able to outline the origins of this type of thinking I imagine It ultimately matter of balancing across the whole Spectrum acid bitter sweet sour excetra it sounds like it's more applicable to Beverages and say dishes but I'm not sure I'm a Savory guy when it comes to cooking can you talk about this please and second of this mention both things in this way that I have to answer my wife doesn't cook it in the microwave with water until tender and then let it completely cool much to my chagrin prior to mashing her idea was to make mash for 18 month old son now I know how to make a mashed potato

face face punch at least I guess you punch yourself in the face with his wife is doing this I feel free but I noticed her matching the cold potato with a fork into a total gloop hoping for a good result I pointed out to her some start Basics bad idea that you're not mine but it also obviously it's a bad idea what someone is doing something horrible in the kitchen like unless you are literally their boss it's like really a bad idea to tell them what they're doing is horrifying because you can't hide it you can't hide at the look on your face of horror cannot be his and then you're the worst could you hate it you know how to do it and then they look at you and they can tell that you want to kill said he didn't want to tell your wife you know what I'm saying they can tell that you're upset and then they ask you what's wrong and you can't lie and say nothing's wrong because you're looking at them and like everything that you feel is a person says that what they're doing is horribly destructive to the quality of the food that otherwise would care for quite well

reach their hands and was destroyed right but turns out that when you do that to your spouse bad things happen I know this is so I pointed out there some start Basics and she threw up her hands and said you fix it then and probably went to bed all I wanted to do was throw it out but then I thought I'll ask Dave can you think of any reasonable culinary application for such a ridiculous preparation or it will go in reverse but awake

yo he does are you can mix them into things like Croquettes if you're if you're frying things out or we were just talking about it Martin's potato bread potato bread is a good use for old old mashed potatoes right stuff yet I wouldn't do any gnocchi I want I would want a fresh when you want to fish from your key but probably get away with it so he used make a mashed potato Like Glue on purpose and as part of this whole thing that Maggie talks about I talk about Noah's talks about if you push something that is a defect so far in the defect erection sometimes it comes around to being good again so he would overcook potatoes then add extra liquid to them so you can imagine it then blend them in a vital prep to shatter all

starch granules and turn it into kind of a pastie glue and then flavor it and the idea was to accentuate that potato puree with that kind of interesting kind of gluey texture not try to have to be mashed potatoes I got to say it's pretty good now you're starting probably retrograded somewhat especially if it's all so it's not going to maybe work the same way that you could try just pushing the glue all the way reheat the hell out of it at actor liquid turn into a glue or use it in the music music that otherwise the high notes first thing on the next on the next program I'm also going to answer Jacobs question about Burr Grinders and coffee I'm going to answer David's question about muffin style mixing and I'm going to talk to Dandy about recreating recipes from the Applebee's appetizer menu

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