Cooking Issues Transcript

Episode 103: Bread & Brine

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hello and welcome to roughly 1245 joined as usual the studio in the stash of the hammer Lopez jacket today we have a special guest Piper from Booker and Dax research lab downtown Visalia doing good microphone you got talking to it I have another person I can brutalize on their right to wait that someone in for 97212 8th Ave already

we own now again with the not getting the right thing on my iPad okay this is from Paul K High all thanks for your work on the great show and thanks for answering all my past questions questions about baking in general I'm happy with the results of my one per month attempted baking bread whoever I'm always a little disappointed by the small or perhaps not exist in oven spring that I get I haven't had any real life training my only knowledge is from books but my impression from those books is it oven spring is to be expected and should be noticeable although my bread does rise nicely before putting in the oven is I guess when he's proofing as I say I'm always a little disappointed with the amount it's Springs during those first few minutes of baking perhaps I simply shouldn't expect to see anything dramatic any help would be most appreciated all the best Paul okay

alright here's the problem first of all I am by no means a bread expert there are people who all they do all day all night is I think about bread and so you know you always hesitate when they're people like that out there to make any kind of statement all but that said I feel confident that I don't know enough information right now to answer your question so what we need for a real troubleshooting of of your bread recipe first of all what style of bread are you making with what what are you looking to get the do you want a dance crumb structure a very open crumb structure what kind of crust are now just made her come structure face which is very similar to being face looks like differently I can tell but the so there's that right and then in general I need to know kind of what hydration level you're using so what what kind of you know what's what style flower first of all what you're how much water you're adding to the flower and then how you're raising it

forming it and proving it and what not in general oven spring is generated most of the stuff that I that I read on the on the on the Inner Line recall internet on the internet about about oven spring a lot of it is kind of BS as specifically I don't think that some people say this because you're increasing that the rate of yeast reaction at the last minute as the bread is baking and that's what to me I think that's almost almost probably certainly not the case with the oven spring happens very very quickly and probably not enough time for you start reacting all the sudden producing CO2 in overdrive I think what what's going on is you need a high initial heat Financial burst of heat in the oven to rapidly expanding gases in the cell of the dough structure and then set the structure before the doe stop for breaks and so what you're looking at to get a good oven spring is one there has to be a good gluten Network in there that's going to allow it to hold the gas as it expands

it's going to have to be kind of performed properly and it's going to have to have enough air bubbles in it already that can expand right so its formation of the of the right number of an amount size of air bubbles getting them kind of big enough for keeping the structure of the dough intact so that I can raise up and it's bringing up very high heat both from the bottom and from the top so with a baking stone at the bottom with a very initial a high preheat and then with steam injection or some form of steam to get a rapid rapid heat transfer into the loaf on the on the inner forget I'm not even talking about the actual development what the crust is like which is not a thing this team to do but I'm just saying rapid heat into the into the dough third thing is proper slashing pattern in the dough will allow heed to get in and allowed to expand more of like physically allow it to expand more so there's the slashing patterns that you make on it there's a proper formation that dough proper proofing of it like

I got and making sure the dough has the proper structure to get it to to work properly but very difficult to figure out exactly which one of those problems you have most likely Robin's not tricked out enough for it but I don't know I don't know what kind of what kind of oven that you're using there's an interesting book that I haven't read before but that gets very high recommendations and I want to read it called bread science the chemistry and craft of bread making which came out fairly recently and there's a bunch of chunks on the on the internet that you can read of that on their on their website and then I would look at you know a fresh Loaf in those other kind of like large kind of a conglomeration of blogger to get together and talk about the stuff life is red herrings because everyone you know like all of us were just experimenting all the time. I hope that helps

hello and good morning team cooking issues like that team cooking you she's not cooking she's team team cooking issues appreciate that can you describe the pros and cons of open and closed bath for low temperature cooking a friend attempted to purchase a sous vide Supreme rather than polyscience immersion circulator for home use because the sales person suggested that an open bath will cause the temperature to fluctuate and cause a loss of control the guy was a schmuck thank you Matthew in Chicago well I don't know the man that you're discussing personally I didn't see him but based on the one statement we have of his which is that an open bath circulator is going to have a large temperature fluctuations yes he is a schmuck so if the rest of his thinking is in line with the thinking he he gave you right there then yes. Call is in order that the main difference between the sous vide Supreme and the real immersion circulator isn't necessarily whether it's covered or not because very easy to cover a you know a bath when you when you use an immersion circulator

are the main difference is in circulation itself now to go back for a second in case I don't know in case like someone scrap you down to a chair and visit your torture is to listen to this radio show and you haven't listened to it before we were talking about her piece of equipment that allow you to do low temperature cooking cooking at very precise temperatures they're very close to the actual temperature you want to cook two rights that's low temperature cooking in the main piece of equipment that most of us used to do that is the immersion circulator and what that does is it keeps water at a very very or anything really a liquid at a very accurate temperature and allows you to do all these new effects if you have for low temperature cooking now there's you notice the word immersion circulator so their circulation of water in the circulation is what allows you to get very even temperatures over the entire batheo with within like a couple tenths of a degree now if you don't cover that circulating bath

what's going to happen is you will get evaporation off of the surface of the of the of the bath right and so you'll be losing a lot of heat and if you didn't have adequate circulation you will get a temperature stratification in the bath right mean no no duh obviously you'll get temperature stratification but adequate circulation is going to prevent any real stratification of temperature once you get any reasonable death below the bottom of the above below the surface of the water now if you have an unstirred bath right the situation is horrible what happens if you do not cover a monster that you will get constant evaporation off of the surface and you will get in essence overtime a temperature gradient established as water evaporates off of the top of the bath and by evaporating cools it cuz it's evaporative cooling and so you'll get a you'll get a temperature gradient set up that probably is fairly static over a long cook once it sends out I would guess

assuming that humidity of your roommate constant aside from the fact what I just said that you must at all times cover a non circulating bath and that you don't need a necessarily cover circulating bath to to get an accurate temperature it is always good practice to cover a circulating bath always good practice because you lose so much energy through the top of the to the top of the bath you know asking to evaporate that a sometimes and larger bad situations are circular might not have enough power to get it up to the temperature that you want because they only typically have between 750 and 1000 watt speeding power to you are going to take a lot longer to come up to temperature than you otherwise would and 3 you're going to be evaporating on stuff like like a mother and and so even over a relatively short cooking times you're going to lose water over long cooking times at overnight you can potentially boil or not boil but evaporate all the water out of your bath

and your product can be ruined and forth in a circulated bat if you've done a bad job and not put a rack or some sort of weight on top of your food such that it's like definitively sunk under the surface of the liquid you know if you cover it even if a little bit pokes up you'll still get a fairly close temperature as long as things totally sealed and covered up to what you want just not as effective heat transfer mechanism so I always a good idea to cover a bath The Only Exception being if your have a reheat bath a relatively low temperature ordering service and you're going in and out of it all the time but under other circumstances I always always always recommend covering the best friend. Frank Tristan twilley you know they opening you know the guy who opened it with us is a manager of a deck one best bartender in the country according to eat or even asking

you guys are Creek on the right so that was good news right good business love myself interesting you a little too tall for my taste but other than that we have a question in from Matt Minter on Bryant when I BBQ pork or chicken I make a brine with a heavy dose of my dry rub in it the theory being that the water is being drawn into the meat and will carry some of that flavor from the spice with it but I was listening to on your podcast with her look decent the flavor molecules are spices are probably too large to penetrate the cells of the meet the question I have is am I wasting my time and my spices by adding them to the Brian has anybody study which flavor molecules will penetrate the meat if any and finally how much brine is too much it seems at some point the ozmosis would reach equilibrium anything more week of diminishing returns I'm sure depends on the cut of meat but is there any rule of thumb thanks

and a PSI running a few weeks ago about using mason jars in my centrifuge and for the record they work about 75% of the time the other 25 not so much I'm assuming what that means is like awful things happened right reason Piper that what he means is awful things have happened

so yesterday Piper's first time on the radio he'd be nice not so much with the with the radio thing he's he's at he's from Vermont they don't have radios there yet right is that true Piper

so here's the deal I think you're pretty much right and Harold pretty much right and that most Brian's don't really penetrate the meat to a very large distance and so you're probably wasting a good bit of your spices however like brining something nice Vermont so the thing is is that I think you could probably get pretty much the same reaction by doing your Brine and then rubbing your spices on after it comes out of the brine. That's what I would do salt obviously gets carried into the meat because it's extremely small molecule you know

I don't really know what their penetration effects of smelling like sugar is nitrate penetrate in obviously otherwise curing wouldn't work but larger molecules tend I think not to make it into into the meat I think that's a that's accurate fact acids tend to do certain work but they tend not to penetrate far which is why you get kind of a different texture on the surface of a meat or any place where is the cleft in the meat where things can get into it you can get effects from acids and painter muscular connection the stuff that you're not going to get an effect from something like that in the dead center of a piece of meat in any reasonable amount amount of time I think you're right I think that they you know there is a diminishing Dimensions return time but that diminishing return time is going to depend almost primarily on the thickness of the piece of meat you use and the brine strength that you use so there's no real no real rule of thumb on brining the same way that would be on the same kind of curing where everything's been written down by the USDA and there is carrying authorities on it mean

have you know any rule of thumb and discreet dating I said you had a nice nice like you do disagree with me or you going to be like you don't disagree with me and tell me I'm a douche he'll tell you that I'm a douche and then you'll tell me and I'll yell at you is that is that how this is going to work

Oggi's are listen hijacked

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because we couldn't play vicious vicious vodka we have that we have a sound alike song and so does the title and it was composed by someone on Twitter Jackie remember the name of the person Jack is a remember bad people yeah but no credit but next time so we got one in from a class cooking issues any ideas on time and temperature for cooking Cod sperm sax low temp you got to love a question like that. Sperm sax solo 10 any way to prevent coagulation of Darius II question any way to prevent coagulation of dairy in a high acid system so here's the thing con sperm I would never say Cod sperm when you're actually going to serve it to someone in the term that we would use info

circles with me melt like Uncle milty milk Cod Milt I have not myself cook cod note I've seen it many times I think I've had it you had the right size did you enjoy the Cardinal yet if you had it went in a Japanese style

where your friends which friend has a lot of Chris Cosentino but I've no idea how to cook it how to cook it low temp means got to delegate structure that I would worry about vacuuming it I would guess that it coagulates somewhere in the range of where an egg white wood coagulate so you probably want to cook it at like no 62 something like that Celsius I don't know cuz you're supposed to steam it or fry it or some like that is supposed to be delicate kind of puppy puffy texture what do you think that's a good what you do give her to give a note is Piper's not trying to buy shoes on Zappos if somebody else we know who shall remain on Facebook he's not on Facebook he's looking up oil polymerization for me

anyway so now I do not have a good time or temperature on it but I would assume it would be somewhere in that range like 62 I don't never cooked I've never really don't even low temp on my favorite kind of you know fish fish gonad part which is a row I've never done any really low temperature cooking on that although I should because I love Shadow Shadows are my favorite things to cook you don't like to share with you what do you not like to share or something about anyway how about the second one it just so happens at Cliff's that we have here Piper who is family is involved with CP Kelco right we have the man to tell you how to prevent the coagulation of high acid Dairy systems Piper with the with some pectin give me some coke and stabilization knowledge drop it on me

let's see what the question was Piper Snapback the question was how to do high acid Dairy systems without coagulation and the answer I gave it to you to describe a respect you like pectin to preserve high acid Dairy systems

CMC that's carb boxing methylcellulose will follow you if you don't know what the hell CMC isn't think it's a brand of truck so he's using carboxymethyl Rite-Aid have to write her bossiness will tell you where who bought who makes that stuff has Pantry CMC in every freaking thing like his body doesn't do so well with the gluten so he he you know he's a perfume forming and gluten-free bread and also appoint for those of you that have no idea what the hell're talk about you point so if you take xanthan gum and actual bit like a fluid gel you sit on a Surface you tilt it and it acts like a gel until you put a certain amount of sheer on it which point it automatically sends and turn to a liquid that's called a yield point cuz I'm at a yield Point acts like that as opposed to sending it is merely thick but will flow under all circumstances so too easy real world example

that don't involve hydrocolloid that you can think of are maple syrup no matter how cold it is it just flows but slowly it doesn't have a yield Point whereas ketchup right ketchup does not flow until it's tough day until she has applied to it and has a you appointment break so that's that's what he appoints a Viber is looking to strengthen something and assistant without having a yield point he's using CMC and pectin but do we use a specific type of Belgium

beta pectin witches from beats what's the beta refer to for those who they're out there and they're in the pectin land

hyper work at CP Kelco is like the research what it will be in the research lab like busting stuff out and so hyper will put back in just about any damn thing and CMC in just about any damn thing so give him just give me the recipe since you're not going to tell him to give him a freaking recipe

it's complicated High concentration solution of beta pectin like gum with maybe 5% is mixed with you know what the solution you wanted acidify and then

it's continually mix for like an hour or so and then slowly add your acid it depends I mean it's only specifics to think it's incredibly difficult I mean you going to be going to just trying to pour juice and like lemon juice into it or something like that or some sort of like Dairy beverage assuming that's what he's trying to do I would say

make one high concentration solution of data pectin or an HM pectin and and then added in increments of like 1% total weight with the with the dairy and then slowly acidifying will see that the the flocculation point is going to go to decrease pH when I took less there you have it I wouldn't that's not so much a recipe you can take to the bank but I'll paperwork on he'll get it out to you by the way I was looking up wallpaper stalking I was looking up Aaron's last name who who made the song his last name is Roberts and so Erin Robertson thank you for the fish is fish is vodka song we like it alot

how abrupt end on the clap guys Jesus killing me okay now I didn't answer was an oil polymerization technique made in Japan nothing from Japan called cut the mayor of the temperature at which I guess Tim poodle names like so I can like temperature right to put a computer and start a video of it on on the on the internet amazing what they want to do is if you ever have like a liquid fat and you want to dispose of it and throw it in your trash you can't because it's a liquid so what you do is you add this powder to it and it instantly plumber eyes and turns to a solid with you then scrape out of the pan and you can throw in your regular waste trash now that's crazy that I don't know how the hell it works it says it's some sort of LG thinq some sort of algal seaweed like nonsense but I wasn't like know where was able to find what's actually in it what is actually doing it and it's clearly some sort of

it's probably clearly is not clearly I guess it's some sort of polymerization where the oil is being linked I doubt they're Derek like instantly hydrogenating it because I don't know of any way to do that because it's not a system weather out of adding a powder to the oil and turn into a solid which is nutty I don't know how the hell that work someone out there please if you know what this reaction is and what's causing it because remember there's ways to do it in like that I found that are very very non-food grade the question how do you do it in a in a in a food-grade way such that you're not doing something crazy to your pain like are they somehow instant saponification reaction with a range of soap I've no idea someone please tell me the only way I know how to solidify fat like that hardcore solidified is to add large amounts like upper to 10% by weight of mono and diglycerides when that lets you could take a liquid fat

add 10% mono-diglycerides to it and you know he did a little bit and then went when it cools it will thicken and turn to a solid and you can scrape it out and that's that's the only way that I know that I've done it in the kitchen before but I don't I don't really I don't know

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and we're back okay back in the bread I was thinking about this for a second I read an interesting couple of interesting articles they don't actually relate to the question about oven spring but I thought that was kind of interesting one is that these nut jobs are trying to figure out a way to determine how their bread is going to react to baking and instead of doing the obvious thing for us which would be to bake it they put it in a vacuum chamber and these guys are by putting in a vacuum chamber they expand all the air cells that are in the air bubbles that are already in the dough and they claim that at any point in the bread making process after the initial kind of mixing and the Aaron Corporation has happened that they can get good correlations to the final bait volume

by putting the sucker in a vacuum and seeing how high it can it can raise up another interesting picture on vacuum mixing in the in the bread science book I told you about that's available to check its online where she reproduces a picture of a bread that was mixed under a vacuum had the craziest for structures considered bad for structure but I thought very interested not like now I'm spending all morning thinking about like you know various you know ways to put vacuums on on bread but the other really interesting thing is is an article I read about the temperatures at which the temperatures at which the bread and some laid-back the oven spring is setting and so the point is is that the protein structure in a good bread in a well-made the protein structure is going to hold a gas bubble Integrity up to a point of about 60 degrees Celsius where a crappy bread dough is going to hold its structure up to a point of about 50 degrees

and so is the key difference there is that that's right around the temperature that the Starship latinization is taking place of the protein is really only there to hold the structure of the bread while you're waiting for the starch to gelatinize and set and that's why I am I think we discussed about it a couple times in the past you know when you're working on a gluten-free bread like a like a lot of the problem is just getting it to react properly to the initial breakout so it's the initial baked out of its it's hard because you're getting the proteins they have to hold their until the interior the bread gets up to in a 50 or 60 and that's you that's why we're doing experiment experiment with things that have weird kind of pre gelling characteristics like like you add something to hold structure like a Santander like a CMC and then you'll add something to actually gel in that mid-range temperature where there's other things are going to start to fail like a metal

Lalo's or some other sort heat gelling a property because the idea is that it's not that the protein is important I don't think it's important but it's not you know majorly important to the final texture of the bread I think the major the major impact from the final type of temperature on the bridge going to be the starches and how they gelatinize however the Major Impact to the formation of that final structure is going to be how the protein working so that's the really dig Diggity dig that you get when you're trying to formulate a braid without protein wouldn't without without gluten protein when you say that's going to do this Tasha and just say just say yes okay dear I hope this is still the correct email and it is even though we didn't answer last we got to see the statue got to email a few questions I'm in All Grain Brew work like an answer this last week that I said All Grain Brew & IMAX The Greene Topps good brewing equipment work except except for which

for some reason I called Ward but I was told that Brewers call at work or equipment used for Beyond low-temperature cooking

that's interesting I know I I love I've been trying to use mashing techniques and use the the the amylase that so you doing it all grain Mash what what are you using barley malt typically malted barley when you're mopping the barley your address of allowing a little bit of the grand to grow allow me to germinate a little bit and then you're stopping that while the enzymes are in there that will convert the starch in The Barley eventually convert the starch into sugar so that the growing embryo can can use them you kill that such that the enzymes haven't been destroyed but that the embryo isn't using all of that stuff it isn't wasting at any of the stars because you want to convert all that starts using enzymes to Sugar so I've been not with much success but trying to experiment using using the enzymes in that to add other starches to do cooking related things so to break down

potatoes for instance or break down even further sweet potatoes using a mixture of amylase is from from Grand but I haven't had any sort of luck you know that I haven't had any sort of luck that makes me want to think that I'd that's what I want to do for the next you know do you know 10 years much more luck with not with grain-based ferments doing anything but Harold McGee has been turning me on to some really interesting rice-based fermentation Japanese not Koji base but you know other weird symbiotic like mixtures of bacterial and fungal and yeast elements and I forgot the name of these weird little their call yeast balls that are from China that McGee kind of turned me on to that make this amazing fermented rice gruel at a son like anyting ever so I've had more luck using that and culinary and culinary application but I haven't really had done much with beer now malt is delicious and malt I think especially even the even the drive stuff that you can

I buy are the extract is an underused ingredient in from a culinary standpoint delicious you know malted mashed potatoes that we know not like me or bake or small or like not like you make milkshakes with but like large amounts of you know Brewers malt powder DME dry malt extract would you don't use cuz you're all grain is a awesome addition flavoring addiction to Ted too many things that I used to have a fair bit of beer what are some interesting things I can do to play with beer for sweet or savory application I've been thinking about phones with Metro sell at 50 and abused it and she's preparation for sodium citrate but Mathis lf50 beer applications are coming in the classic applications of Memphis lf50 a man think one of the effect of the first application I saw Memphis lf50 is a hydrocolloid arrived from cellulose that has very good whipping properties and it's used mainly by Chef to make very dense like kind of Shaving creamy consistency phones because it makes a very fine so

phone as opposed to something almost are kids when egg white as opposed to kind of the light Airy phones that are produced by things like buy things like less of then you know versawhip is another foaming agent but I tend to think that met us lf50 makes kind of a finer kind of more egg white E phone then versawhip usually does Oliver sleep is also good for certification anyway 50 also doesn't leave us with can't do witches if you make a if you make a like a like a whipped egg white texture sings metal sell a 50 a phone you can pipe it onto a tray throw it at dehydrator 135 Fahrenheit for a couple of hours then turn it down to hold it and it'll make a crunchy like a crunchy meringue crispy thing with no protein in it that's amazing now the first application I saw it was Methuselah 50 wasn't that beer with Sam Mason who I don't know when is ice cream company starting up again he knows anyone know anyone anyone to be delicious I'm sure it was he was doing a backup WD 50 when he was a baby

wd-50 with making a Guinness phone with metal sell at 50 and as I remember I tasted it and my feelings was it was it was delicious obviously cooking with beer is good I've been using a lot Inc in cocktail preparation course that's nothing new so I guess I don't have anything really knew I liked this cheese application with sodium citrate so I'm assuming you're making like processed cheese with beer in the lead-up to add some turkey have to have some sort of like a casing extra casing to it you buy I did some work with a product called rennet casein and rennet casein is is casein it's been produced from the process like we actually rented it and then you break it down powder it and you can reuse that to make cheese analogs and so I've done some initial experiments with red casing but I'm sure as long as you get the pH right with that with the beer that you can make a pretty interesting kind of beer cheese how it works

had the meltability of cheese but tasted like beer and I think that would be eminently possible with beer rennet casein and the right emulsifying saw so I wouldn't just use citrate you do you have a call and it's even the one question it's not a potential you said what you're telling me is not a person buying shoes on the internet are you on the air

hi David Sasha and friends this is Brian San Francisco she is the Iowa cold but what site I found my natural food store This Way Lexington which looks kind of like bee pollen it's so what's the difference

yeah almost all the less it then that you buy in in it is from Subway and it's not that that's the only less than sign out there it's just a byproduct of manufacturing all the other soy products they have soy lecithin I've never used liquid less than you use Liquid Piper

do you like it means obviously the worst the powder is pretty good you can buy a powdered 1 and up the the prom with the granules is personally I think they tend to accentuate the off flavor that you can get in less than if you use too much and also they're hard to get what

what is a into the hard to get into solution sometimes the granules and the where's the powder is like you know easier but the liquid I mean assuming that if you can buy the liquid if you can tolerate having an extra extra you know liquid I'm sure it's not leave from church oil base right but if you can have it at 8 you know cuz less than would rather be in oil than water you whenever you're talking about an emulsifier got to look with called the the hydrophobic lipid bilayer hydrophilic lipophilic balance what you're looking at is it an oil loving emulsifier is it a water loving emulsifier and then big mistake most people make with less than is although it's kind of somewhere near the middle it's not extreme on either side less than is an oil loving emulsifier so if it's coming as a liquid it's almost certainly coming in and oil-based liquid now

I know if I've never use Liquid lecithin but I would guess it's a lot easier to use cuz the the pain in the butt about less than is going ashore and I think we lost a color because that we have some sort of like weird feedback loop going on here but back the cheese for one second the book that you guys want to get and I think I mentioned it on the on the show here before is processed cheese and analogs by Adnan to Mimi and that's going to have all the recipes you need a you can you can look at a good bunch of it on Google Books and see see what's going on finally on the way out we had a question well okay one more thing on cheese be used as a replacement for sodium citrate to recipes as well as for sequestering calcium if yes is there a standard stealing amount for the amount used ask anything specifically about modernist mac and cheese recipe sodium hexametaphosphate is not a single thing it's a group of polyphosphate salts and it's a monster at sequestering calcium

it's not a straight replacement for sodium citrate because they they have kind of different functions in a mac and cheese they they they function the function differently usually when you're making a cheese-based think you need to add not just one emulsifying salt but two or three the function you need depends a lot on the pH of your system so certain of the salts are more basic than others and so you need to add them to get your pH in in the right level and also they tend to have different texture depending which one you used and unfortunately it's not a straightforward thing it's kind of a little bit of a Dark Art until it requires a lot of experimentation a lot of it is still just people like testing recipes and keeping log books of what they do but a sodium hexametaphosphate and sodium citrate together you should be able to get a lot of things under your belt having those two ingredients on Hammond doing she's finally can I explain my home Seltzer system yes here is what you do to make them if you have the money in the time and

but now but you don't want to spend money or time later what you do is you get an under the counter ice machine and then you drill a hole inside of the under-counter ice machine is not this is what I kind of have and what I have at home is a slightly more ghetto version of this you take an ice machine you drill holes in it right you buy a cold plate go to go to Mark Powers there in Guntersville Alabama cheapest get a cold plate two circuits one circuit of cold plate is not enough to get yourselves or cold enough for what you want to do here right so what a cold plate is is it's a big stainless steel coil that's embedded in an aluminum block and you keep that underneath ice right now one chain of gold chains not going to drop the temperature now so what you do is you put the end I forgot you have to buy a carbonator a carbonator is a giant tank that holds water at room temperature with a pump the same kind of Puppets a rotary vane pump made by procon usually and it's the same pump to use Nespresso machine and that's what's up to your water supply so you get you put your water supply free out of your sake and through a filter you put that goes through a filter want to go to the filter it gets

what time do the pump on your carbonator right you think a 20lb CO2 tank you want to run it about 95-96 98 PSI someone in their into the tank now your water mains I don't have enough pressure to inject water into a system that has that high of that high of a pressure so the procon pump overcomes at pressure and shoots the water sprays it into the tank that spring mix it to find surface area that the water is instantly carbonated now you need to have it at 98-90 90 100 PSI because you're doing it at room temperatures that's under extreme pressure it comes out of that goes through two circuits of your cold plate right to Circuit of it and it's underneath your ice machine so now you have constant Eye Supply and you have constant cold selsor when it comes out in the next biggest mistake people make is that use a crappie picnic tap like you would use for beer they're worthless useless you need to get what's called a Becker squeeze valve you can also get Becker Becker

who makes the best cell service no question because it has a giant compensator in the back of it that allows you to make the transition from the high-pressure region of where the seller is the low pressure atmospheric region and there and they're just they're there free it's freaking awesome that's the system so that's the system I have a 54 Eldridge at home the problem was I couldn't fit under counter ice machine and where I wanted to put it because it would require too much of the ventilation problem I couldn't do it plus with all the tubes coming down for my espresso machine cuz my Express on my Seltzer rig are together right where all my filter water crap is so I have to go through the awful it was not all I build an insulated box like out of wood and a spray foam and blue and blue foam with a condensation pump right need a condensation pump the condensation pump and so now my freezer which is across the aisle in my kitchen I pull the ice out of it every day from the ice maker dump it into my insulated box into the cold plate and then that's how I get my clothes salser and so that's my pulse Elsa rig at home

it's awesome the one with the automatic ice machine is even better now that I have a 7 year old that I can boss around he actually does the eye so it's just like having a manual ice in a regular ice machine for me but that's how I recommend doing it it's the balls I never run out of Seltzer cooking issues

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